I have seen that math before.😕
I have utterly no idea what you're railing against.
Perhaps you're wanting to add something to this already drawn out thread? http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/soli...est-realistic-audio-transient-terms-v-us.html
Here is who I learned from in the 90's
Jim Williams: Behind the Gear with Audio Upgrades | Tape Op Magazine | Longform candid interviews with music producers and audio engineers covering mixing, mastering, recording and music production.
His main product that he didn't have the energy to really push hard enough. No wonder! As the resistance in just this thread is a small sample of the wider EE/audio populace.
Audio Upgrades
Some comments on a recording forum. Look at the key words "transparent" "clarity".
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/45886-audio-upgrades-high-speed-microphone-preamp.html
He is/was very, very smart (not about seat belts though 😉 ). He did a lot for analog electronics. He just didn't really care about deeper aspects of audio. That's all.I suggest all EEs who share Bob Pease attitude about electronics, be sent to Mars (one way ticket), carry with them all the copies of the books he wrote. His way of seeing circuits is detrimental to society
George
Mooly,
That gerber is from the Elektor Doug Self preamp I suppose? Is there anything missing besides the component positions or are there a lot of other pieces missing? I remember there were many sub boards in the Elektor kit that I looked at in the past.
No, the preamp was the 'Precision Preamp' from Aug/Sept 1996 (iirc) in Electronics and Wireless World magazine.
I fancied trying the tone controls and manually laid out the PCB from the circuit taking just the tone stage.
One very important point, the Diptrace layout is the view looking down on the top of board, looking through the board if you will, as I printed the layout onto a transparency and produced the PCB from that. So I'm guessing that any Gerbers would need the view inverting so that you are looking at the copper side. There is a 'mirror' facility but I have no idea if that alters the Gerbers or not.
What still surprises me is just how good (in this test) the 4558 appeared to be.
And then you realize the RC4558 has 1V/us slew rate, pretty much a 741.
1.7V/us typically (according to TI) but yes, it is actually described as 'electrically similar to a uA741'.
The very first opamps were designed for analog computing. Now we use them for audio.That's an (excellent) repurposed DSL line driver.
That's an (excellent) repurposed DSL line driver.
Op-amps for specifically for high end audio what a joke. What the market demands sometimes needs a dose of good old BS easy and painless to dish out, there's nothing to verify. In the end the stupid THD/SNR numbers (and $$$ of course) are all that matters.
You wouldn't find a single major cell phone player trying to push a PONO style signal path.
Could anyone imagine a Pono shaped cell phone on the market, I bet that would sell real well! I don't know what they were thinking with that design, it seems like going backwards before there even was an Ipod.
Look at the sample. The critical spec. All the same. Slew rate - Slew rate - Slew rate..... Throw an AD811 with a fast power supply in the mix. Try it! But you won't. You guys are like sheep.
Oh, and you may have read some where, like Gearslutz or some such, about modding a big mixing console and putting fast opamps in maybe the mic pre circuit, or the EQ circuit, and getting no difference. You know why? Two reasons! FIRST, the big reason, the power supply regs are located way far away from the opamps - the long trunk line series resistance (both feed and ground return) eats the power supply speed and such chokes the speed of the op-amp. SECOND all the other opamps, like in the summing channels, usually have not been changed so the micro-dynamics never make it to the outputs because the 20v/us devices (THERE IS THAT SO-SO SLEW RATE NUMBER AGAIN!) eat it up.
No need for a lecture on SR Robert - please take a look at some of the stuff on my website.
I think on line level stuff if you are 10x the max slew rate of the source material you are ok. Seems therefore that 20V/us is a good number.
Secondly, decouple locally and well and SR is preserved. Surely this stuff is well understood?
If the guys building or moding these mixing desks don't understand these basics then indeed we will have issues with recording sound. But I don't think that is the case.
Its the uA1458 that is a bit dire like the 741.
Check this out 😉
That shows how old that DS is - the text is probably from the original released in '69 or 70 IIRC.
It would be great is some of the semi vendors would go back and just blank out crap like this.
Hilarious. Until you realise that most who took the Mooly test could not tell the difference - LOL
😀
Could anyone imagine a Pono shaped cell phone on the market, I bet that would sell real well! I don't know what they were thinking with that design, it seems like going backwards before there even was an Ipod.
Too much bungy smoking and jamin' down on the ff-are-rm (as Neil would say it).
I don't think we'll ever see that one in an industrial design mag as a good example of early 21st century practice.
Some comments on a recording forum. Look at the key words "transparent" "clarity".
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/45886-audio-upgrades-high-speed-microphone-preamp.html
Vivid?
Could anyone imagine a Pono shaped cell phone on the market, I bet that would sell real well! I don't know what they were thinking with that design, it seems like going backwards before there even was an Ipod.
Trust me there were some bonkers mad concepts flying around in the mid 90s. Most luckily never made it to market. Some sadly did https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_7600 .
I still have at least one jacket and a backpack from the days when phones were about the size of a snickers bar. I had an 8810 (through work) which wasn't much bigger than a zippo. If you had said then that phones in 20 years would be the size of a pocket diary you would have been laughed out the room. If you had said that a phone would have close to state of the art audio you would have been sectioned.
Funny old world.
I still have the original Nokia phone I had sitting in a drawer somewhere but it surely didn't look like the one you just put up. I can't believe how big cell phones have become. I would really say that most phones now are really more of web devices today and the phone is really a secondary function for talking while you surf the net or read email. I just don't want to carry a phone that big, it goes against my wishes for a Dick Tracy wrist phone with holographic projection so it could show everything you can do on a large smart phone but I think I'm still dreaming at this point in time.
Would you care to pass on that little trick?Some opamps need little tricks done to insure stability (Ed Simon gave me one for one of the high speed Nat Semi chips, for example).
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