What is the Universe expanding into..

Do you think there was anything before the big bang?

  • I don't think there was anything before the Big Bang

    Votes: 56 12.5%

  • I think something existed before the Big Bang

    Votes: 200 44.7%

  • I don't think the big bang happened

    Votes: 54 12.1%

  • I think the universe is part of a mutiverse

    Votes: 201 45.0%
  • Total voters
    447
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#9,321
mchambin said:
James Webb is at an unstable Lagragian point it needs help to stay there, this takes fuel.

Link to the said 3D button.....?
Several links to presumed Webb page and I gave up when I found a LGBTQIA+ propaganda. 😵
Click to expand...
It cant be linked but its here: https://webb.nasa.gov/content/webbLaunch/whereIsWebb.html?units=metric

and here -> 🙂

3d.jpg
 
#9,322
As already explained, James Webb has sensors at -267 Celsius or 6 Kelvin!

Galu, amidst the confusion that is the Expanding Universe, which in my opinion is inevitable, despite Einstein's blunderings with the Cosmological Constant, I must thank you for your observations on Barsoom:

https://barsoom.fandom.com/wiki/Barsoom

Strangely, I have detected Barsoomian plants growing in my current Jasoom neighbourhood!

Pictures may follow. I say this with uncertainty. An inevitable consequence of both General Relativity and Quantum Mechanics.

I am extremely alarmed that one of our AI's (Voyager 1) seems to have gone missing:

https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/engineers-investigating-nasas-voyager-1-telemetry-data

But am sure we can fix it in software:

 
#9,325
Mission accomplished! I have captured images of the Barsoomian Plant on Jasoom!

Initially I thought we had 4. But one turned out to be a Hardy Jasoomian Roman import called Pink Valerian. and two turned out to be Hardy Jasoomian Snapdragons. One a very vivid orange and one multicoloured. Purple and Blue.

The one that remains is Pink and White. I suspect it is Barsoomian. Anyway I have the picture. Just remains to export it to https://ubuntu.com/

A mere technical difficulty. 😀
 
#9,330
Galu said:
What! 😵

Webb is at L2 for a very good reason!

What is special about Webb's orbit is that it lets the telescope stay in line with the Earth as it moves around the Sun. This allows the satellite's large sunshield to protect the telescope from the light and heat of the Sun and Earth (and Moon).

Click to expand...
James Webbs is at L2 or the Sun Earth system.
This L2 has nothing to do with the Moon.
I am confused to I see the Moon comes in when it is said that JW doesn' stay put at L2 but is made orbiting L2.

I cannot figure this JW orbiting L2 while L2 is orbiting the Earth ( 1 year period ) and the Moon is orbiting the Earth ( some 28 days period ).
What is the JW orbit around L2 ? It's plane is the ecliptic or not ?

L2 is always in the shadow of the Earth.
The shadow of the Moon is relatively very small and not clearly related.

The 3D brought to me more confusion than explaining.
 
#9,331
That pink and white flower must be an exotic snapdragon! Will have another look when I next see my neighbour about!

I think the L2 point is an attractor in Chaos Theory, but only semi-stable:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrange_point

But the James Webb Space Telescope needs regular rocket correction to stay on its roughly circular orbit around the L2 point which is about 1.5 million kilometers outside the Earth's orbit.

The telescope feels the combined gravitational attraction of the Earth and Sun to orbit in exactly one Earth year. Without the Earth (and Moon's) extra bit of pull, at about 93 Million Miles out JWST would be orbiting in more than a year, being further from the Sun than the 92 Million Miles of the Earth. I am not sure it is always in the Earth's shadow if ever.

Thinking about it, if it was at more distant but stable L4 or L5, it would be more difficult to send a signal to the Earth, needing more antenna power. I don't know whether it would be more expensive in launch fuel to send it to L4 or L5 too. Because of the disruption of the Sun's influence, the Lunar L4 and L5 points only attract dust in a temporary sort of way. But I do remember reading that Earth actually has a little rocky second Moon for the next 400 years. Sorry, no reference.

I do wonder what happens to JWST at end of life. Presumably it wanders off randomly into space when out of fuel. More Space Junk! I believe the various satellite based Internet schemes (Elon Musk's SpaceX for one) need about 8000 satellites each. This is a menace IMO. You wouldn't get me into Space with all the rubbish flying around Earth at 20,000 mph! I have seen the scary Sandra Bullock astronaut film, "Gravity"! A loose fleck of paint at 20,000 mph hits you like a hand-grenade! 😳
 
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#9,332
I think by the time JWST runs out of fuel, they will have figured out a way to go there and refuel it. Might also be they send an automated ‘space tug’ to bring it back to low earth orbit for refuelling and then send it out again.

I think going back to the moon to build telescopes and support infrastructure for space exploration will be a good thing.

Interesting things ahead of us!
 
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#9,333
Why would a life-form drag the JWST back to Earth for refuelling? Surely a waste of resources! Cheaper to send it some more Fuel or batteries!

To this end I have been investigating maintaining my old iPod Shuffle 512K which is currently 17 years old:

https://apple.fandom.com/wiki/IPod_shuffle_(1st_generation)

Amazingly it still works after a recharge on USB! Plays Britney Spears "Oops I did it again"! Along with Chris Rea "Ace of Hearts" and Crowded House "Always take the Weather with You".


It is, of course, debateable whether my taste in music ca. 2005 is better than Voyager 1's two 1977 disks:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voyager_Golden_Record

Surely Prog Rock was the thing back then?
 
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