Veganism

[Evenharmonics]

The advanced search returns "Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms." on that term both with and without quotes.

Post #250 and on.

I genuinely don't know what you're talking about.

It didn't take me more than a few seconds to come up with the results. I wonder why it didn't work for you. Clicking this link may help you.

 

[Evenharmonics]

Evenharmonics,

What's your point?

If you are in USA, perhaps you should look at your "own" backyard before criticizing what goes on in Indonesia's backyard. If you are elsewhere that's not Indonesia, you should also look at your "own" backyard before criticizing what goes on in other nation's backyard.

 

[Evenharmonics]

Yes, it does. But I think most people agree that you can be cruel to an animal in a way that you can't to a plant, because animals can suffer in a way that a plant does not. You can even say "sentience is vague / has degrees" and still think that there are clear examples on each side of the line.

There is always that "but". Plants and animals do look and act differently but they are both lifeforms. You would treat them differently because they are different?

 

[Evenharmonics]

I personally think animals lose something of value when they die, pain or not.

Animals can have goals that require future existence to fulfill (the successful rearing of young, for example) and we deny them the fulfillment of those goals when we kill them. We certainly deny them future enjoyments of anything (goal directed or not).

There's actually a campaign organization that seeks to recognize the legal personhood of some animals (Great Ape Project - Wikipedia) and with it grant a 'right to life'.

Are humans animals? Have our capacities separated us completely or incompletely? We share many faculties across the animal kingdom. I would argue the separation is operative rather than inherent. We are still much more biological than virtual.

I have met dogs who are more human than some humans, in a positive sense.

This thread is going around in circle. It's back to the anthropomorphism.

 

[TheGimp]

There is always that "but". Plants and animals do look and act differently but they are both lifeforms. You would treat them differently because they are different?

In a simple answer, Yes.

I do not equate them.

 

[Evenharmonics]

In a simple answer, Yes.

I do not equate them.

Thank you for the answer.
Now, chickens, cows and humans look and act differently but they are all lifeforms. You would treat them differently because they are different?

 

[TheGimp]

Yes, I would and do.

A human is welcome in my house, a chicken or cow is/are not.

 

[vuki]

Yes, I would and do.

A human is welcome in my house, a chicken or cow is/are not.

 

[Charles Darwin]

The way I see it when they come to your house you have to feed a human but you can eat a chicken.

 

[scottjoplin]

I know people locally who let the chickens roam in the house....they tidy up in their own way

 

[Evenharmonics]

A human is welcome in my house, a chicken or cow is/are not.

Oh, that chicken and cow. I see what you are saying.

 

[Charles Darwin]

Human Chicken, a song by The Dancing Did on Spotify

 

[myhrrhleine]

Chickens for meat are not raised in cages.Never have been.They are run together in barns or are free range/barns.

Some are.
You can tell how much exercise the chicken gets by the color of the dark meat. The darker the meat the more exercise. The lighter the meat the less exercise it gets.

 

[myhrrhleine]

It did mine. I chose not to have a pet, although there might have been some that were OK. Mostly I didn't fancy the idea of living with a carnivore and having to feed it.

But now that I'm a vegetarian who eats fish from time to time, we have cats. But they don't like meat, just fish and cheese. Weird.

My cat prefers Doritos

 

[myhrrhleine]

Only for the better half of our population. That study concludes "Height was significantly positively associated with risk of all cancers" in post-menopausal women . Then this "article" goes on to tell us that we shouldn't mistake causation with correlation, thereby invalidating itself.

Other anecdotal correlations are also invalidated. Taller soldiers etc etc.

Here is a good example. Ice cream sales correlate with pool drownings. Does ice cream cause pool drownings? No, we understand that there these are both correlated to a different thing (hot weather). We don't have this sort of understanding of the processes in the human body yet. We are getting there, but silliness like the above doesn't help much.

Height in humans is determined by estrogen levels.

 

[Galu]

I know people locally who let the chickens roam in the house

How are the Lesser Horseshoe bats getting on SJ?

 

[NATDBERG]

Thank you for the answer.
Now, chickens, cows and humans look and act differently but they are all lifeforms. You would treat them differently because they are different?

We all treat everything differently that we catagorise as different in our heads. How we internally catagorise is a matter of complex nurture and can be very individual.

Most people treat humans around them differently from each other, as individuals. We'll even catagorise them into personality types and treat each type in certain different ways.

Very easily people can switch to catagorise a bunch of humans, based on nothing but an implanted idea, as "them" and treat them very differently from other humans. Sometimes it goes as far as catagorising them as non-human and unworthy of life itself.

It is not a fixed moral position, how we treat other living creatures, not something based on the "truths" of an external world (external to the human mind).
How we relate and treat other creatures is all internally based. It is essentially abstract and arbitrary and a self-made illusion.

A problem with human perception is that many see their normalised worlds as "the truth", even worse a "moral truth". The ego then tries to impart this to others, their children for example, to make this internal outlook as real an true as possible which becomes a collective feedback loop. It is fluid over time.

That people will treat various living organisms differently is entirely a reflection on them and says nothing about the value, status nor hierachical position of the organism itself .

--

In other words (you'll probably need something else to explain what I'm getting at above! ) that people do treat animals differently says nothing, it is only a reflection on what has happened previously. There is no "truth" to be gleaned from it.

Plenty of humans I wouldn't let in my house whilst i would let chickens in (cows too if I had a big enough space and rooms where things wouldn't get trashed - just practical considerations).

 

[scottjoplin]

How are the Lesser Horseshoe bats getting on SJ?

Natur Cymru - Nature of Wales: Porthmadog's bypass bat bridge

There are ospreys nearby too Bywyd Gwyllt Glaslyn Wildlife

 

[scottjoplin]

That people will treat various living organisms differently is entirely a reflection on them and says nothing about the value, status nor hierachical position of the organism itself .

Should we then consider Plant rights - Wikipedia

 

[Galu]

A bat bridge! What next - one for robins?

P.S. Is there, or is there not, a dog in Porthmadog?