Re: Re: Re: Re: upsampling clock
Hi Guido. Im pretty much interested in your clock upgrade. How many clocks of the 963SA will you change with your upgrade?
And is it similar with LC Audio's new 963SA clock upgrades?
http://www.lcaudio.dk/com/963.htm
Guido Tent said:
Hi Guido. Im pretty much interested in your clock upgrade. How many clocks of the 963SA will you change with your upgrade?
And is it similar with LC Audio's new 963SA clock upgrades?
http://www.lcaudio.dk/com/963.htm
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: upsampling clock
Hi
A series of both clock upgrades and power supply replacements has been produced. These are currently being tested, and adjusted where required
The new linear power supply fully replaces the existing SMPS, so deals effectively with cutting noise.....(believe me guys, after over 15 years of EMC experiene I have not been able to reduce noise down to audiophil limts so i decided to replace the whole unit - stop spending too much money on putting in Black gates there)
The TentLabs 963 clock clock upgrade is a true dedicated design. it differs from all clock upgrades currently offered for the 963:
1 - It contains 3 low jitter clock modules (11.2896, 16.9344 and 24.576)
2 - It automatically selects the correct frequency, depending on the media played
3 - It injects the new low jitter clock at the only place where it should be: At the conversion clock input of the DAC chip !
The latter is a true advantage if you look at the current 963 architecture: All currently available clocks are routed through way too many gates, connectors, wiring and boards - question yourself what happens with the jitter at the receiving end, e.g. the DAC chip !
The target sales price for the 963 clock upgrade is set at a very competitive 259 euro. The power supply upgrade targets at 229 euro.
A complete instruction manual with photo's will become available, the mounting of the clock upgrade is not a beginners job.
Please give me some time, I am working very hard to finish worlds best sounding DSD A to D converter, to be launched at the comming AES in Berlin, early May.
let us make sound things better
cheers
boochies said:
Hi
A series of both clock upgrades and power supply replacements has been produced. These are currently being tested, and adjusted where required
The new linear power supply fully replaces the existing SMPS, so deals effectively with cutting noise.....(believe me guys, after over 15 years of EMC experiene I have not been able to reduce noise down to audiophil limts so i decided to replace the whole unit - stop spending too much money on putting in Black gates there)
The TentLabs 963 clock clock upgrade is a true dedicated design. it differs from all clock upgrades currently offered for the 963:
1 - It contains 3 low jitter clock modules (11.2896, 16.9344 and 24.576)
2 - It automatically selects the correct frequency, depending on the media played
3 - It injects the new low jitter clock at the only place where it should be: At the conversion clock input of the DAC chip !
The latter is a true advantage if you look at the current 963 architecture: All currently available clocks are routed through way too many gates, connectors, wiring and boards - question yourself what happens with the jitter at the receiving end, e.g. the DAC chip !
The target sales price for the 963 clock upgrade is set at a very competitive 259 euro. The power supply upgrade targets at 229 euro.
A complete instruction manual with photo's will become available, the mounting of the clock upgrade is not a beginners job.
Please give me some time, I am working very hard to finish worlds best sounding DSD A to D converter, to be launched at the comming AES in Berlin, early May.
let us make sound things better
cheers
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: upsampling clock
This is not meant as a criticism but to most DIY'ers a very small chip module at 259euro and PS module probably with a small tx and a few regulators for 229euro doesn't really sound competitive at all.
Guido Tent said:
This is not meant as a criticism but to most DIY'ers a very small chip module at 259euro and PS module probably with a small tx and a few regulators for 229euro doesn't really sound competitive at all.
At the risk of being an invader
but I have seen what Guido is talking about, and this is not something your average DIYer can come up with. And I'm just talking about the pcb quality/layout.
Not to mention Guido spent several months getting it right.
You are welcome to try and beat him at it, but it has to be equally good AND cheaper 😀
Guido : any chance of using this clock for the smaller brother (763SA) ? Sometime after Berlin.... maybe.
but I have seen what Guido is talking about, and this is not something your average DIYer can come up with. And I'm just talking about the pcb quality/layout.
Not to mention Guido spent several months getting it right.
You are welcome to try and beat him at it, but it has to be equally good AND cheaper 😀
Guido : any chance of using this clock for the smaller brother (763SA) ? Sometime after Berlin.... maybe.
Alien8 said:
Hi
If I am right, the 763 offers similar functionallity, except the upsampling ?
The 963 clock module can be delivered without the 24.576 MHz XO for upsampling, so I guess that fits your needs.
regards
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: upsampling clock
Protos,
What are you refering at ? It looks like their is some misconception between what I described about 963 upgrades, and what you describe above.
To clarify, the 963 mod is not yet anounced on my website.
cheers
protos said:
Protos,
What are you refering at ? It looks like their is some misconception between what I described about 963 upgrades, and what you describe above.
To clarify, the 963 mod is not yet anounced on my website.
cheers
That is correct, but it has only one crystal 11 MHz if I remember correctly (I don't have immediate access to the service manual now). As I understood the 963 has three ?
Maybe I should start another thread - or email you off board...
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: upsampling clock
The price is very competitive indeed as at 259 euro, it essentially replaces 3 clocks. The cost of 3 low jitter clocks will easily be more then 400 euro. Can't wait for your clock and PS board to be released.
Guido Tent said:
The price is very competitive indeed as at 259 euro, it essentially replaces 3 clocks. The cost of 3 low jitter clocks will easily be more then 400 euro. Can't wait for your clock and PS board to be released.
I guess everything the 963SA has, except the upsampling.
the 963 features upsampling and progressive scan, 763 doesn't. Apart from that, the 963 is litterally the bigger brother, and has probably some better output stages (judging from what I have seen in this thread) but I guess that's it.
check eg : this hardware review (just googled it up)
I bought it because it replaced a broken sony DVP NS700 V which wouldn't play SACD's so I returned the thing, the DVD 763 SA had the same or better functionality for the same price. (Except for some dsp tricks the sony could do)
The crystal feeds some dividers, the correct frequency is selected and carried across the other side of the player through those flat cables (and probably back as well) so I guess in that respect it resembles its bigger brother 😀
the 963 features upsampling and progressive scan, 763 doesn't. Apart from that, the 963 is litterally the bigger brother, and has probably some better output stages (judging from what I have seen in this thread) but I guess that's it.
check eg : this hardware review (just googled it up)
I bought it because it replaced a broken sony DVP NS700 V which wouldn't play SACD's so I returned the thing, the DVD 763 SA had the same or better functionality for the same price. (Except for some dsp tricks the sony could do)
The crystal feeds some dividers, the correct frequency is selected and carried across the other side of the player through those flat cables (and probably back as well) so I guess in that respect it resembles its bigger brother 😀
Guido,
I forgot to ask, will your TentLabs 963 clock upgrade help improve in DVD playback quality in any way? Im asking this because I'm thinking at least one of the the 3 clocks that your clock upgrade replaces must have something to do with DVD playback.
I forgot to ask, will your TentLabs 963 clock upgrade help improve in DVD playback quality in any way? Im asking this because I'm thinking at least one of the the 3 clocks that your clock upgrade replaces must have something to do with DVD playback.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: upsampling clock
Fair enough , I haven't seen your upgrades but I have seen a few clock modules and they are usually a small pcb with a few chips etc.Now I am sure your average diyer cannot make one on his own but in the diy world as you well know there are plenty of advanced DIYers offering PCB and schematics of their projects and occasionally reasonably priced kits and even very cheap group buys.I am sure you put a lot of work in it and should reap your profits from people that are interested but to me it sounds like a commercial offering that perhaps a group of dedicated diyers could probably make for a fraction of the prices you quote.
That is why I am saying that it does not sound competitive , at least in this forum.
For around 500 euro you can easily build quite an accomplished set of amplifier and speakers so spending that much just on a small/medium size mod of a CD player does not sound like a great deal.Don't forget that the Chinese are now offering SACD players fully featured with good clocks including tubed outputs and all manner of audiophile components all for about 700Euro.
Look herehttp://www.cattylink.com/PRO-SCD-2.htm
Guido Tent said:
Fair enough , I haven't seen your upgrades but I have seen a few clock modules and they are usually a small pcb with a few chips etc.Now I am sure your average diyer cannot make one on his own but in the diy world as you well know there are plenty of advanced DIYers offering PCB and schematics of their projects and occasionally reasonably priced kits and even very cheap group buys.I am sure you put a lot of work in it and should reap your profits from people that are interested but to me it sounds like a commercial offering that perhaps a group of dedicated diyers could probably make for a fraction of the prices you quote.
That is why I am saying that it does not sound competitive , at least in this forum.
For around 500 euro you can easily build quite an accomplished set of amplifier and speakers so spending that much just on a small/medium size mod of a CD player does not sound like a great deal.Don't forget that the Chinese are now offering SACD players fully featured with good clocks including tubed outputs and all manner of audiophile components all for about 700Euro.
Look herehttp://www.cattylink.com/PRO-SCD-2.htm
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: upsampling clock
Hi,
I am surprised: You've seen a few modules, and you assume mine are "similar", without having seen the ones I talk about.
I run a commercial business (TentLabs), besides my job at Philips. I support the DIY community by offering a low jitter module at 29 euro (that needs a low noise power supply to come alive). Besides that I write articles, in order to stimulate DIY activities.
Ofcourse one is free to invest whatever he wants, in whatever relationship to the original price.
I looked at the site. These Chinese do not know about jitter, as they spec it using ppm, which is only indicating long term stability.
You assume that if they write that, the clock is low jitter, and copy it without understanding it either, or am I wrong ?
regards
protos said:
Hi,
I am surprised: You've seen a few modules, and you assume mine are "similar", without having seen the ones I talk about.
I run a commercial business (TentLabs), besides my job at Philips. I support the DIY community by offering a low jitter module at 29 euro (that needs a low noise power supply to come alive). Besides that I write articles, in order to stimulate DIY activities.
Ofcourse one is free to invest whatever he wants, in whatever relationship to the original price.
I looked at the site. These Chinese do not know about jitter, as they spec it using ppm, which is only indicating long term stability.
You assume that if they write that, the clock is low jitter, and copy it without understanding it either, or am I wrong ?
regards
Tent Clock
Hopefully my 963SA will be revived on monday by a specialist!!!!
Than I'm ready to do the Tent clock upgrade.
Just wondering when the clock upgrade will be available, the comming month or later this year or .......
Regards,
Saffier
Hopefully my 963SA will be revived on monday by a specialist!!!!
Than I'm ready to do the Tent clock upgrade.
Just wondering when the clock upgrade will be available, the comming month or later this year or .......
Regards,
Saffier
Hi Guido,
I don't know the HW architecture of Your upgrades and, as far I can find in the net, Your clock upgrade seems to be very competitive (259 €) compared with other (good or not) stuff.
My only doubt (and it's only a doubt, so don't take it as a critisism)
is on the price of the PSU upgrade.
Of course I don't know schemas and design of Your PSU project and before seeing it I cannot really judge anything but, as far as I know, a good PSU for the application required here needs to respond to 3 requirements (I could be wrong, of course):
1) Voltage / Current circuit demands (transitory and duty)
2) Exact time-up sequence of each psu output
3) EMI screening (with respect to the same fitting space)
Using one or two good transformers (one for digital and the other analog if needed), a good PCB design (expecially respect to D and A grounds), the right number of good and quiet regulators, and a chip for the time sequence (if You don't want to trust RC time constants of each line), should resolve points 1) and 2); while the third point could be resolved either completely screening the whole psu and its outputs or putting the whole thing outside of the player case.
I cannot be sure because (I repeat) I haven't seen the upgrade documentation yet, but I think the doubt it could be done with an amount of money quite below 229 € is the main reason why Protos posted what He wrote.
I still wait to see the documentation on Your site to judge it, but if I were (even partially) right, would You consider to propose a discount to people acquiring both modules and/or a cheaper solution for PSU (i.e. give requirements, schemas and let customers buy all or part of the less critic components) ?
Sincerely,
Giacomo Verneau
I don't know the HW architecture of Your upgrades and, as far I can find in the net, Your clock upgrade seems to be very competitive (259 €) compared with other (good or not) stuff.
My only doubt (and it's only a doubt, so don't take it as a critisism)
is on the price of the PSU upgrade.
Of course I don't know schemas and design of Your PSU project and before seeing it I cannot really judge anything but, as far as I know, a good PSU for the application required here needs to respond to 3 requirements (I could be wrong, of course):
1) Voltage / Current circuit demands (transitory and duty)
2) Exact time-up sequence of each psu output
3) EMI screening (with respect to the same fitting space)
Using one or two good transformers (one for digital and the other analog if needed), a good PCB design (expecially respect to D and A grounds), the right number of good and quiet regulators, and a chip for the time sequence (if You don't want to trust RC time constants of each line), should resolve points 1) and 2); while the third point could be resolved either completely screening the whole psu and its outputs or putting the whole thing outside of the player case.
I cannot be sure because (I repeat) I haven't seen the upgrade documentation yet, but I think the doubt it could be done with an amount of money quite below 229 € is the main reason why Protos posted what He wrote.
I still wait to see the documentation on Your site to judge it, but if I were (even partially) right, would You consider to propose a discount to people acquiring both modules and/or a cheaper solution for PSU (i.e. give requirements, schemas and let customers buy all or part of the less critic components) ?
Sincerely,
Giacomo Verneau
A bit offtopic, sorry, but can someone please name some online shops that ship inside EU (Estonia is now also EU 🙂 ) where I can order the DVD963SA. Shops in Germany or Netherlands I quess would be ok. Or in Scandinavia - should also work.
Local importers in Estonia gave me an answer that no such model exists 🙁
Regards,
Ergo
Local importers in Estonia gave me an answer that no such model exists 🙁
Regards,
Ergo
Look here:
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=19718&item=3813404498&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
He shipps worldwide...
Thomas
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=19718&item=3813404498&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
He shipps worldwide...
Thomas
I have upgraded the 1000 uF BG caps and added the bypass caps, 0.33 uF, on the progressive scan board as advised by Eric.
My experience was: NIGHTMARE. The leads of the BG caps were bent and difficult to desolder. Furthermore, the ground plane dissipated away the heat very efficiently, making the existing solder very hard to melt. I hope I had not damaged the board by applying excessive heat, was working on it for a couple of hours! Anyone can share your experience on getting the components out easily?
The progressive scan module was re-instated. It worked, but I did not see any improvement. Furthermore, I saw that the panning of movie contents was a bit jittery, or was it just me?
Help!
My experience was: NIGHTMARE. The leads of the BG caps were bent and difficult to desolder. Furthermore, the ground plane dissipated away the heat very efficiently, making the existing solder very hard to melt. I hope I had not damaged the board by applying excessive heat, was working on it for a couple of hours! Anyone can share your experience on getting the components out easily?
The progressive scan module was re-instated. It worked, but I did not see any improvement. Furthermore, I saw that the panning of movie contents was a bit jittery, or was it just me?
Help!