Tweeters with Low crossover frequency

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#43
or instead of a tweeter use a small full ranger - this gives you the ability to cross over about as low as you want, even at 700Hz. And it will be alot less expensive compared to one of these esoteric "large dome" tweeters.

I read the Chairo Sonnet writeup a few years ago with much interest. It's still in my bookmarks.
 
#45
oon_the_kid said:
If there are any good 2" dome mids worth talking about, I am listening too.
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Oon,

You might like the sound of a compression driver with the compression chamber cover removed, and the throat stuffed with felt and covered.

A friend used to use JBL 2420 drivers (44mm, 1.75" diaphragm) like that and said it sounded a lot more "high fi" than the same drivers on horns, though did not have the midrange sensitivity.

At 700 Hz, probably still get loud enough for most before running out of excursion, which is rather instantly apparent when the diaphragm hits the phase plug. Using titanium, rather than aluminum would be advisable if you like to "crank it up" 😉.

Art
 
#46
weltersys said:
Oon,

You might like the sound of a compression driver with the compression chamber cover removed, and the throat stuffed with felt and covered.

A friend used to use JBL 2420 drivers (44mm, 1.75" diaphragm) like that and said it sounded a lot more "high fi" than the same drivers on horns, though did not have the midrange sensitivity.

At 700 Hz, probably still get loud enough for most before running out of excursion, which is rather instantly apparent when the diaphragm hits the phase plug. Using titanium, rather than aluminum would be advisable if you like to "crank it up" 😉.

Art
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Wow Art, that sounds liek a cool project. This is more like what I am talking about. I have another thread about how to modify speakers so that the resonance goes even lower by removing the backcover. This pretty much does the same thing.

Just out of curiosity. How much excursion can such a speaker do, xmax?

Currently my favourite in the running is the wavecor 30mm dome tweeter which has an Fs of 400Hz and an xmax of 0.4mm.

Oon
 
#47
CharlieLaub said:
or instead of a tweeter use a small full ranger - this gives you the ability to cross over about as low as you want, even at 700Hz. And it will be alot less expensive compared to one of these esoteric "large dome" tweeters.

I read the Chairo Sonnet writeup a few years ago with much interest. It's still in my bookmarks.
Click to expand...

Hi Charlie,

I already have quite a few small full range including markaudio and the likes, would like to try soemthing different. Although they have similar frequency response, other parameter are different. Such waterfall plot, dispersion etc.

I am interested in how you might implement digital crossover filters using PC though, as your signature suggests. Care to send me some good threads?

Oon
 
#48
oon_the_kid said:
Wow Art, that sounds liek a cool project.
Just out of curiosity. How much excursion can such a speaker do, xmax?

Currently my favourite in the running is the wavecor 30mm dome tweeter which has an Fs of 400Hz and an xmax of 0.4mm.

Oon
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Oon,

Unfortunately, Xmax and other TS parameters are not generally specified for compression drivers. From what I can tell, it probably is 0.5mm, but that would be one way excursion at contact with the phase plug, so slightly less than .5mm is the limit before clacking noise and diaphragm damage occur.

Art
 
#49
oon_the_kid said:
Hi Charlie,

I already have quite a few small full range including markaudio and the likes, would like to try soemthing different. Although they have similar frequency response, other parameter are different. Such waterfall plot, dispersion etc.

I am interested in how you might implement digital crossover filters using PC though, as your signature suggests. Care to send me some good threads?

Oon
Click to expand...

For software DSP, this is a good overview:
Digital Crossover/EQ with Open-Source Software: HOWTO | Richard's Stuff

Also, for a small fullrange driver to try, this is a suggestion that I have used (where I say to use a full range driver instead of a tweeter):
Tang Band W2-800SL 2" Aluminum/Mg Full Range Speaker Driver
IMO its best used above 500Hz, even better over 700Hz. Despite the name, I do not use full range drivers full-range. That's just silly.
 
#51
The tweeter used in the PMC AML1 and AML2 is a large 34mm soft dome made by Audax (modded by PMC), I don't remember the model but I think it was popular for a long time and used in other speakers. Anyway it worked very well in the AML1 I used to have crossed at 1.4KHz with a small waveguide and it went loud cleanly too.

AML1-3.jpg
 
#52
Tenson said:
The tweeter used in the PMC AML1 and AML2 is a large 34mm soft dome made by Audax (modded by PMC), I don't remember the model but I think it was popular for a long time and used in other speakers. Anyway it worked very well in the AML1 I used to have crossed at 1.4KHz with a small waveguide and it went loud cleanly too.

AML1-3.jpg
Click to expand...

Maybe it is this one?

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...udax-tw034x0-1.3-textile-dome-tweeter-by-aac/

Nice. Wish the resonant requency was a bit lower..

Oon
 
#53
Oon, if you give the tweeter crossover an impedance trap that is tuned to the Fs of the tweeter, it may be feasible to cross the tweeter closer to its Fs.

It comes down to calculating the Sd vs. Xmax numbers (note that due to the crossover slope, the tweeter must handle lower frequencies than the crossover point), and plotting out how much margin the crossover leaves in the tweeter until the safety limits (at each frequency of interest).

Once you have something that looks plausible, build it, crank it up, measure the distortion profile, and listen.

hth, jonathan
 
#55
The wavecor tweeter has an xmax of 0.4 mm as opposed to 0.25 mm for the audax. Plus the wavecor has an fs at 400 Hz as opposed to 700Hz for the audax. Frequency response for the wavecor is lower too. But the size of dome is smaller a little bit. So likely will stick to wavecor.

Sent from my D6653 using Tapatalk
 
#57
AD 0211 is somewhat better with its cloth dome.

Top of the line, the AD 02110 SQ, is a true gem, but rater hard to find. Very smooth on axis till almost 10 kHz.

De Greef and Vandewege, the Belgian authors of the landmark MFB loudspeaker article in Wireless World, used these indeed as tweeters, passively equalized in the top octave, crossing at 900 Hz.

Given these loudspeaker only did cost some (coverted to Euro's) some € 15-20, they were my favorite mids in the 80ties. Easy to use and dirt cheap.

Regards,

Eelco
 
#59
jcarr said:
Audax TW 034 has a diaphragm area of 9.1cm2.
Diaphragm for Wavecor TW030 family has an effective radiating area of 11.5cm2.

jonathan
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Gee. I didn't notice that. My bad. I naturally assumed that audax being a 34 mm tweeter will bigger than the wavecor which is only 30 mm. Maybe it has to do with the shape of the dome...

Oon

Sent from my D6653 using Tapatalk
 
#60
oon_the_kid said:
The wavecor tweeter has an xmax of 0.4 mm as opposed to 0.25 mm for the audax. Plus the wavecor has an fs at 400 Hz as opposed to 700Hz for the audax. Frequency response for the wavecor is lower too. But the size of dome is smaller a little bit. So likely will stick to wavecor.

Sent from my D6653 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
One slight annoyance of the wavecor tweeter range is the chambered 30mm tweeter comes with a flat or deep waveguide, but not with the shallow guide faceplate.
For me, that wd be the pick of the bunch, if they made it.
 
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