Naresh, the amp is made in Austria, not Britain. It is $8k new, not $18k. It is single ended 6c33C with high quality transformers. Maybe it is nothing special as you suggest.
As for the phase detector, something in that very complicated box of wires (thanks for posting the photo Chris) expects the 0 volts on one leg and 240 on the other. When I plug it in on US 240 (+120, -120 for simplicity) the on off switch will not turn off, apparently the relay never gets de-energized. I didn't leave it that way for long as I assume some components are running on half voltage which can be bad for them. However the tubes glow and with a little fiddling around I could get it to play. I think solving the problems of what make it not work on US 240 might be a path.
Thanks for the suggestion of switching it to 120. I think it is a long shot. Simpler amplifiers often can but this one has so much added on (like the phase sensor) that I think it is unlikely. I'll try Ayon again. It would be nice to get a schematic. Ayon won't even provide a user manual without a code. Maybe they will give it to me now that I'm an owner.
Since I identified the problem, I've been focused on providing a transformer big enough to power it. I believe in a huge power reserve for amplifiers to support bass. I have a dedicated 10ga service line to my stereo location. I'm looking at a 15000 watt amplifier. https://www.voltage-converter-trans...vt-15000-15000-watts-step-up-down-transformer . However a friend with more experience in electronics that me has me worried out the output impedance of the transformer may prevent the transformer from responding to spikes in current demand, which is what amps need and why we use big wires for our amps....any thoughts on this?
thanks,
Jerry
As for the phase detector, something in that very complicated box of wires (thanks for posting the photo Chris) expects the 0 volts on one leg and 240 on the other. When I plug it in on US 240 (+120, -120 for simplicity) the on off switch will not turn off, apparently the relay never gets de-energized. I didn't leave it that way for long as I assume some components are running on half voltage which can be bad for them. However the tubes glow and with a little fiddling around I could get it to play. I think solving the problems of what make it not work on US 240 might be a path.
Thanks for the suggestion of switching it to 120. I think it is a long shot. Simpler amplifiers often can but this one has so much added on (like the phase sensor) that I think it is unlikely. I'll try Ayon again. It would be nice to get a schematic. Ayon won't even provide a user manual without a code. Maybe they will give it to me now that I'm an owner.
Since I identified the problem, I've been focused on providing a transformer big enough to power it. I believe in a huge power reserve for amplifiers to support bass. I have a dedicated 10ga service line to my stereo location. I'm looking at a 15000 watt amplifier. https://www.voltage-converter-trans...vt-15000-15000-watts-step-up-down-transformer . However a friend with more experience in electronics that me has me worried out the output impedance of the transformer may prevent the transformer from responding to spikes in current demand, which is what amps need and why we use big wires for our amps....any thoughts on this?
thanks,
Jerry
Can i ask , how much output power provides this amplifier, and it is really worth it ,to purchase heavy transformers of kilowats range? Every transformer has output voltage drop with heavy load ,but are you listening at max volume ? Too heavy one will just eat your power at idle and heat up ,no transformer has 100 percent effeciency. Actually it would be easier to paint schematic of step up converter transformer you have ,but amplifier don't starts with it ,and modify it to your needs ,rewire , no matter its a project for weekend or few weekends.
amp is 35 wpc. It weighs 55 kg. While waiting for this amp I've been listening to a 10 wpc tube amp that weighs 5 kg. Even this small amp provides significantly more bass with a 10ga power cord vs a 14 ga. --Jerry
35w ??? Not much ,for 15 kw transformer... practically idle .You should not feel difference then ,how much wats transformer you use , unless voltage don't drops under load. You may test your amp power consumption ,with watmeter , and try to measure voltage drop of stepping transformer by applying a load like lamp or heather .
Beware of the current spike while energizing a very high power transformer. It may damage equipment, or trip the breaker. At 15Kw power level, it is better to ask an electrician and/or check the electrical code yourself. But the 15000 watts on that transformer sticker is probably a marketing number. If your budget is in the 500$ range, check out a 2KVA insulation transformer for industrial use, such as Mouser part number 530-HPI-20. Your local electrical supplier may have a similar product at lower price. The insulation transformer does a better job than the voltage converter stopping mains induced interferences. Just wire the secundaries in series and you can use it as 115v to 230V converter. And it does have real certifications. It may have a slight mechanical hum, this is normal for any transformer at this power class. Toroidal transformers have a lower price but they may buzz.
Well that 35W in Class-A stereo, so figure about 4X35 or 140 watts. Plus filaments and other stuff. So max 200 watts?
Although how you get 35 WPC out of a single ended 6C33C I don't know. Still, 200 watts should cover it at full tilt boogie. Double that for audiophilia and we get 400 watts. Figure VA from there.
So if very roughly ,it can draw 2 amperes from 230-240v mains . You can test your step up transformer ,if its suitable ,by loading it with similar 240v rated load ,or can connect two in series ,of they are 120v rated, and see how much voltage drops with load in comparison to no load voltage . Yes ,input power from 120v line may drop too off course ,at least double current ,if no loss transformer. Lets say 1000w roughly . But i don't think you need a 15kw transformer...
My factory has 34kW, my entire house is 9 kW or so...
15 kW is rock concert power level.
Instead of exclamations, just one word : Incredible!
15 kW is rock concert power level.
Instead of exclamations, just one word : Incredible!
I have come across Keba PLCs, also B & R, both made in Austria.
They fail in India's heat and dust. B & R is a bit more reliable than Keba, and it is now part of ABB.
Their competitors coat the PCBs with varnish / PVC spray or similar to protect from dust induced problems.
Austrians say put the thing in air conditioning...instead of spending $5 on a unit costing us $3000, they want us to put our machines in dust free temperature controlled enclosures.
We say bye bye, they say why why.
Then they wonder why we foolish Indians cannot understand their philosophy.
We want things that work, and at a reasonable price.
We don't care if the sun shines from your body holes or not.
That is something they will never understand.
They fail in India's heat and dust. B & R is a bit more reliable than Keba, and it is now part of ABB.
Their competitors coat the PCBs with varnish / PVC spray or similar to protect from dust induced problems.
Austrians say put the thing in air conditioning...instead of spending $5 on a unit costing us $3000, they want us to put our machines in dust free temperature controlled enclosures.
We say bye bye, they say why why.
Then they wonder why we foolish Indians cannot understand their philosophy.
We want things that work, and at a reasonable price.
We don't care if the sun shines from your body holes or not.
That is something they will never understand.
And one more thing, a lightly loaded transformer will give very high voltages on the outputs.
There is something called regulation, and our electric utility engineers use that to select transformer ratings for the load.
I am not an electrical engineer, please read up on that before choosing the transformer rating...
There is something called regulation, and our electric utility engineers use that to select transformer ratings for the load.
I am not an electrical engineer, please read up on that before choosing the transformer rating...
I'm still impressed by transformer numbers 15kw , i'm wondering how much it would eat idle ? Lets say 95percent efficiency , lets say 5percent is its idle current , 15000*0,05 gives 750w . It would then more than amplifier consumption , even rough, few times . Lets select proper transformer . Such monster would be reasonable if you had moved full house of eu rated equipment,but live in US or similar ,and don't want change devices ,and feel like home .
It is not a 15KVA transformer. 15000W is the model number. Look at the declared weight: just 105 Lbs (less than 50Kg). This is more like a 5KVA transformer, that may eventually supply a 15KW surge for a few seconds. This is useful for heating applications, as example.
To get a comparison: a Hammond C1F010EES 10 KVA transformer weight is 178 Lbs. Anyway, my suggestion about sourcing a 2KVA transformer is based on the same consideration made by Pano on post #46: extimated amplifier consumpion is 200W, but my idea of overkill solution is to go to the next order of magnitude. If a 2KVA transformer will not solve the low frequency issue, then the cause should be searched elsewhere. A 2x margin is not enough to remove all the doubts.
To get a comparison: a Hammond C1F010EES 10 KVA transformer weight is 178 Lbs. Anyway, my suggestion about sourcing a 2KVA transformer is based on the same consideration made by Pano on post #46: extimated amplifier consumpion is 200W, but my idea of overkill solution is to go to the next order of magnitude. If a 2KVA transformer will not solve the low frequency issue, then the cause should be searched elsewhere. A 2x margin is not enough to remove all the doubts.
They deliberately obfuscate the specifications: "15000 Watt Maximum Capacity Heavy-Duty Continuous Use Transformer". They let you think that that the peak capacity is the same as the continuous use one. This is not a given, and a look at the weight seems to negate this assumption. This is still a better transformer than the first one, anyway.
I was being generous. Running at 2x35W all the time is highly unlikely. But the nice thing about Class-A is that the draw on the power supply is fairly even, the high bias current insures that. Wasteful, but consistent. Do you think a 500VA transformer would do the trick?
The OP wrote in post #22 that it already does have a "500W" transformer. On my experience, when the size of the transformer starts to be in the range of a industrial application, there is not a lot of difference in price between say 1000 and 2000VA: they both are small in this context. The main advantage of the smaller are the weight and the lower idle consumption, but the regulation is better on the bigger transformer.
By the way, on my previous post I forgot that not everyone is an electrical engineer and I started to write VA without explanation. The proper way to specify the power capability of a transformer is the Volt-Ampere (VA), not the watt, because not every load is purely resistive. So if you see a ecommerce site that sells transformers and only lists the power in Watts, you know that it is targeting the general public. It is a fair assumption that a more specialized seller that lists all the technical specification in a proper way does have a better product portfolio and prices.
By the way, on my previous post I forgot that not everyone is an electrical engineer and I started to write VA without explanation. The proper way to specify the power capability of a transformer is the Volt-Ampere (VA), not the watt, because not every load is purely resistive. So if you see a ecommerce site that sells transformers and only lists the power in Watts, you know that it is targeting the general public. It is a fair assumption that a more specialized seller that lists all the technical specification in a proper way does have a better product portfolio and prices.
amp load is 400W. Sounds like crap on the 500W transformer. I have a 5000 watt transformer coming tomorrow. these are not industrial. These are just consumer items sold on Amazon.
HOWEVER! This has become a moot point now. Amp had a borderline tube that was making the "bad tube" light come on. When I borrowed a tube and replaced it, the amp works perfectly on US current. It seems the bad tube alarm causes a lot of things to go whacky--maybe it is the bad tube alarm plus the US voltage but without the bad tube light on, it works on US voltage (just like I hoped it would). All the transformers going back.
Of course I would have replaced the tube sooner if I had one. on order.
-Jerry
HOWEVER! This has become a moot point now. Amp had a borderline tube that was making the "bad tube" light come on. When I borrowed a tube and replaced it, the amp works perfectly on US current. It seems the bad tube alarm causes a lot of things to go whacky--maybe it is the bad tube alarm plus the US voltage but without the bad tube light on, it works on US voltage (just like I hoped it would). All the transformers going back.
Of course I would have replaced the tube sooner if I had one. on order.
-Jerry
