for those keeping score at home...
Pipe 2
Kneadle 0
I've tried all the easy ways to do it, now I'm actually going to have to build a jig. Why?
Let's put it this way:
The wife ain't going to be asking me to put together any jungle gyms soon. Thank goodness I chose a career involving words, not numbers or shapes!
I should say, however, that I'm confident that it will work. I can saw within a 1/6th" margin for error, and it's not that hard sawing through my pipe. Once the jig is built, the thing should just fall together. It takes about 8 minutes per cut.
Dave
Pipe 2
Kneadle 0
I've tried all the easy ways to do it, now I'm actually going to have to build a jig. Why?
Let's put it this way:
The wife ain't going to be asking me to put together any jungle gyms soon. Thank goodness I chose a career involving words, not numbers or shapes!
I should say, however, that I'm confident that it will work. I can saw within a 1/6th" margin for error, and it's not that hard sawing through my pipe. Once the jig is built, the thing should just fall together. It takes about 8 minutes per cut.
Dave
Halftime Score
Pipe 2
Jig 3
Kneadle 1
Boys, we're down big; but it's only halftime. The jigs, of all things, have proven to be Achilles' heel to our defense. If it's not the height, then it's the width. If it's not the width, then it's the stability, and so forth.
My dear wife suggested I make a molded jig out of homemade modelling clay. She made the clay (True love, eh?). I've made the molding. Now it needs to set and dry.
We have a blasted birthing class all day on Saturday. Second half will most likely be played sometime Sunday afternoon. We'll see how the jig works.
Dave
Pipe 2
Jig 3
Kneadle 1
Boys, we're down big; but it's only halftime. The jigs, of all things, have proven to be Achilles' heel to our defense. If it's not the height, then it's the width. If it's not the width, then it's the stability, and so forth.
My dear wife suggested I make a molded jig out of homemade modelling clay. She made the clay (True love, eh?). I've made the molding. Now it needs to set and dry.
We have a blasted birthing class all day on Saturday. Second half will most likely be played sometime Sunday afternoon. We'll see how the jig works.
Dave
Jig didn't work? Must admit that I am a little surprised, but then I never cut 6" PVC pipe before.
If you can conquer the frustration, do you think you can give us a brief description of how you set the jig up? Maybe we can come up with some suggestions.
If you can conquer the frustration, do you think you can give us a brief description of how you set the jig up? Maybe we can come up with some suggestions.
I made two pieces of triangular wood that stood at the proper angle coterminous with the pipe at predetermined spots. Then I cut two holes in a cardboard box and shoved the pipe through it so that it wouldn't slide or roll.
I couldn't make it so that the blade could move a sufficient length at the same time having the proper angle. In other words, the saw housing would knock against my jig at one point or another while sawing.
I do think this molding will do the trick. It should act like a 3D jig, of sorts, without getting in the way. It's a sleeve, of sorts, a miniature-length pipe with an ID slightly bigger than my pipe's OD. Get it? will that work?
If that doesn't do it, I'll have to make a "real" jig, somehow. I never figured that the jig would be so hard to construct. Yes, I guess I need some suggestions for that.
Dave
I couldn't make it so that the blade could move a sufficient length at the same time having the proper angle. In other words, the saw housing would knock against my jig at one point or another while sawing.
I do think this molding will do the trick. It should act like a 3D jig, of sorts, without getting in the way. It's a sleeve, of sorts, a miniature-length pipe with an ID slightly bigger than my pipe's OD. Get it? will that work?
If that doesn't do it, I'll have to make a "real" jig, somehow. I never figured that the jig would be so hard to construct. Yes, I guess I need some suggestions for that.
Dave
If I understand correctly, your new jig will be a clay pipe, with the proper angle cut, (22.5°), that your PVC pipe slides into. Then you just cut along the edge of the clay pipe, remove and switch ends, shove the pipe back in and cut along the outside of the clay pipe again-after rotating it the 11°.
Is that it?
If it is, it sounds pretty good.
Not tonight, but maybe tomorrow we can have a crack at alternatives just in case this doesn't work. I'll probably come up with one. Anybody else got an idea?
I was thinking along the lines of a big miter box.
Is that it?
If it is, it sounds pretty good.
Not tonight, but maybe tomorrow we can have a crack at alternatives just in case this doesn't work. I'll probably come up with one. Anybody else got an idea?
I was thinking along the lines of a big miter box.
I hope your clay sleeve works..don't know how strong the clay will be though...
I think mr. wizard is right.. what you need is simply a large miter box.. the width of the box needs to be the diameter of your pipe.. and the hieght needs to exceed the diameter so that you can get your blade in the guide. The box needs to be long enough to hold the pipe steady.. I'd guess at least 18 inches. This makes for a pretty big box.. easy to build with the right tools.. not so easy with a hacksaw..
lets me know what tools.. and what materials you have to work with.. and I'll try to come up with a plan..
I think mr. wizard is right.. what you need is simply a large miter box.. the width of the box needs to be the diameter of your pipe.. and the hieght needs to exceed the diameter so that you can get your blade in the guide. The box needs to be long enough to hold the pipe steady.. I'd guess at least 18 inches. This makes for a pretty big box.. easy to build with the right tools.. not so easy with a hacksaw..
lets me know what tools.. and what materials you have to work with.. and I'll try to come up with a plan..
Actually, I have access to a few more saws. In addition to my hacksaw, I own a hand mitre saw and a power scroll saw. I can get my hands on a circular saw and, I thing, a much longer hacksaw, the kind shaped like a a giant "D," as opposed to mine, which is an exaggerated "P."
I can get any wood products with relative ease, too.
I'll pick them up today.
Dave
* * Edit * *
That should read "an exaggerated 9," upon thinking about it.
In addtition to the saws metntioned, I can get a nice-sized handsaw, too.
I can get any wood products with relative ease, too.
I'll pick them up today.
Dave
* * Edit * *
That should read "an exaggerated 9," upon thinking about it.
In addtition to the saws metntioned, I can get a nice-sized handsaw, too.
Oh, the 'big' saws used for ripping limbs off trees? Teeth will probably be too big for 3/8" PVC. Rule of thumb is 2-3 teeth in the cut at any time, and that means 8TPI (one tooth every 1/8") for you.
An alternative that would work great would be to cut a sleeve that fits the pipe, and cut the 22° angle on *it* - then mark that angle on the pipe, and go around it with your scroll saw. Pop a hole in the pipe, go around it. The holes can be filled in later with caulk or whatever.
Tim (is the handheld powertool a scroll saw or a jig saw....)
An alternative that would work great would be to cut a sleeve that fits the pipe, and cut the 22° angle on *it* - then mark that angle on the pipe, and go around it with your scroll saw. Pop a hole in the pipe, go around it. The holes can be filled in later with caulk or whatever.
Tim (is the handheld powertool a scroll saw or a jig saw....)
sorry about the delay..
given your resources.. heres what I would do..
1. build a base using a 2-3 foot length of 2x6, add a strip of 1X2 to one edge .. this gives you a board that will be 6 3/8 wide.
2. attach two 'walls' of 1X10 to the edges of your base. this will give you a three sided 'box' 6.375X8Xlength.
3. attach 2 or more 1X2 braces.. each 6.25-6.375 inch to hold the walls steady. you can mark the center point of the braces to provide a reference point to line up your pipe. (these braces can be placed 6.25 inches above the base to help hold the pipe in place.
4. measure your 22 degree angle (across the top of the box).. draw vertical lines and make a cut through the walls.. be sure to brace the walls on each side of the cut.
this simple box will allow you make all your cuts..
I would first mount a stop ( just a piece of 1X2) at 7 inchs (I forget the exact length) from the cut. (make sure to mount the block on the leading edge) then just slide the pipe into the box until it hits the stop and make the first cut... repeating as needed.. for the next cut.. the one at 11 degrees offset.. I would replace the wood block with a piece of pipe that has been cut to 22 degrees.. and I would turn this pipe 11 degrees.. now it is just a matter of mating the first cut with this block and making the second cut..
I suspect that you'll want to use your..'good size' hand saw to make these cuts..
Hope this helps..
good luck
given your resources.. heres what I would do..
1. build a base using a 2-3 foot length of 2x6, add a strip of 1X2 to one edge .. this gives you a board that will be 6 3/8 wide.
2. attach two 'walls' of 1X10 to the edges of your base. this will give you a three sided 'box' 6.375X8Xlength.
3. attach 2 or more 1X2 braces.. each 6.25-6.375 inch to hold the walls steady. you can mark the center point of the braces to provide a reference point to line up your pipe. (these braces can be placed 6.25 inches above the base to help hold the pipe in place.
4. measure your 22 degree angle (across the top of the box).. draw vertical lines and make a cut through the walls.. be sure to brace the walls on each side of the cut.
this simple box will allow you make all your cuts..
I would first mount a stop ( just a piece of 1X2) at 7 inchs (I forget the exact length) from the cut. (make sure to mount the block on the leading edge) then just slide the pipe into the box until it hits the stop and make the first cut... repeating as needed.. for the next cut.. the one at 11 degrees offset.. I would replace the wood block with a piece of pipe that has been cut to 22 degrees.. and I would turn this pipe 11 degrees.. now it is just a matter of mating the first cut with this block and making the second cut..
I suspect that you'll want to use your..'good size' hand saw to make these cuts..
Hope this helps..
good luck
wow, sounds like you're having quite a time with the pipecutting. i've never cut a pipe that large before, so i don't really have many good ideas.
is renting a power tool out of the question? money aside, i think you would save a lot of grief if you used something like a radial arm saw. you can set the angle, and if you need to make 2 passes to cut all the way through, it's just a matter of flipping the pipe the other direction.
that's the way i would go, if the rental cost was reasonable.
keep us updated!!
/andrew 🙂
is renting a power tool out of the question? money aside, i think you would save a lot of grief if you used something like a radial arm saw. you can set the angle, and if you need to make 2 passes to cut all the way through, it's just a matter of flipping the pipe the other direction.
that's the way i would go, if the rental cost was reasonable.
keep us updated!!
/andrew 🙂
I agree that a compound miter saw would be much easier.. and I'm sure the rental costs wouldn't be to bad.. that would be my choice.. but then I'm not a graduate student attending birthing classes.
Hey everyone,
I want to say thanks again for all your help. You all continue to contribute above and beyond what I ever expected.
The pipe itself is no longer the problem, just to be clear. It will cut (with some effort) without much difficulty. I was pleased and excited by that. I can't seem to build a jig worth a rip. I'm unhappy about that.
In fact, the reason I'm spending time on the jig now is because I know that we can pull this project through. I'm thinking: an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
The REAL problem is that I have to keep coming at this thing half-cocked. I have a spare hour or two here and there, and I can never string together several hours of thinking and designing and building. It's like I'm always starting fresh with only a little time to solve all the same problems again.
I'm learning a lot about the process itself, even after spending so much time on the design.
At any rate, I'm spending the rest of today (Saturday) gathering materials and devising a plan, written, recorded and whatever. Sunday afternoon and evening is completely dedicated to the project. I'm hoping to post some real results by Monday morning.
Many thanks, and keep checking back for my next series of questions.
Dave
I want to say thanks again for all your help. You all continue to contribute above and beyond what I ever expected.
The pipe itself is no longer the problem, just to be clear. It will cut (with some effort) without much difficulty. I was pleased and excited by that. I can't seem to build a jig worth a rip. I'm unhappy about that.
In fact, the reason I'm spending time on the jig now is because I know that we can pull this project through. I'm thinking: an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
The REAL problem is that I have to keep coming at this thing half-cocked. I have a spare hour or two here and there, and I can never string together several hours of thinking and designing and building. It's like I'm always starting fresh with only a little time to solve all the same problems again.
I'm learning a lot about the process itself, even after spending so much time on the design.
At any rate, I'm spending the rest of today (Saturday) gathering materials and devising a plan, written, recorded and whatever. Sunday afternoon and evening is completely dedicated to the project. I'm hoping to post some real results by Monday morning.
Many thanks, and keep checking back for my next series of questions.
Dave
oh yeah, and renting is NOT out of the question. I live in an apartment complex, though, and I have to be a good neighbor (I like quiet, too). On the other hand, if push comes to shove, and I absolutely have to rent, I'll move the whole operation to a better place.
Do you guys rent these at Home Depot or what?
Dave
Do you guys rent these at Home Depot or what?
Dave
kneadle said:
Power scroll saw. Do yo mean one of those small hand held jobs, or one with a table?
Not sure what a miter saw is.
Circular saw-handheld or small table saw?
Just asking.
A miter saw is a short handsaw (7"?). Mine came with a little miter box, of sorts.
The scroll saw is a power jigsaw whose vertical blade angle you can turn while sawing. I think its horizontal angle can be adjusted, too. The blade is about 2" long. It's great for cutting out odd shapes and such. It did not come with a table. They're both rather light-duty, and neither would serve to cut 6"PVC pipe.
The miter saw, however, will serve well to make my jig, which I am about to do now, just as soon as I copy and paste Steve's suggestions from a page back 🙂.
The circular saw is handheld. I only wish it were a table saw.
Dave
The scroll saw is a power jigsaw whose vertical blade angle you can turn while sawing. I think its horizontal angle can be adjusted, too. The blade is about 2" long. It's great for cutting out odd shapes and such. It did not come with a table. They're both rather light-duty, and neither would serve to cut 6"PVC pipe.
The miter saw, however, will serve well to make my jig, which I am about to do now, just as soon as I copy and paste Steve's suggestions from a page back 🙂.
The circular saw is handheld. I only wish it were a table saw.
Dave
Okay, I was going to give you my suggestion for a jig, which would be pretty much along the lines of Steve's idea anyway, only cheaper. As long as you are going to build it now, go with Steve's suggestions.
I haven't still worked out the details.
I haven't still worked out the details.
Happy to hear you're going at it in true DIY fashion.
Like I mentioned before, a power miter saw would have to be a large one to do the job. The typical 10" er would have to tilt both ways to be easy to use. You'd have to rent one with a 14" blade. If getting help, a bandsaw is what you'd be looking for. (Getting on the phone and asking local small-shop operators with a similar interest, is what I might be up to.)
But back to doing it yourself... I suggest building a handsaw, miter-box type jig out of 2x2's...a simple A-frame for each side of the saw. Make the horizontal cross member just tall enough so a wedge can be driven in to hold the pipe down tight, and sticking out far enough in the back so the two can be connected together and out of the way of the saw. and down to the table, (the same as legs of the A's.)
This way, the only tool you really need is a nice crosscut handsaw, one tool everyone should have anyway.
I'm still wondering if edge gluing the pipes is going to be strong enough, but I'm sure if PVC cement doesn't work, something will.
Like I mentioned before, a power miter saw would have to be a large one to do the job. The typical 10" er would have to tilt both ways to be easy to use. You'd have to rent one with a 14" blade. If getting help, a bandsaw is what you'd be looking for. (Getting on the phone and asking local small-shop operators with a similar interest, is what I might be up to.)
But back to doing it yourself... I suggest building a handsaw, miter-box type jig out of 2x2's...a simple A-frame for each side of the saw. Make the horizontal cross member just tall enough so a wedge can be driven in to hold the pipe down tight, and sticking out far enough in the back so the two can be connected together and out of the way of the saw. and down to the table, (the same as legs of the A's.)
This way, the only tool you really need is a nice crosscut handsaw, one tool everyone should have anyway.
I'm still wondering if edge gluing the pipes is going to be strong enough, but I'm sure if PVC cement doesn't work, something will.
yeah, yeah, if your wife doesn't find you handy, she better find you handsome...
Also a fellow, life-long contractor friend suggested that there's a wrap-on, pipe heater blanket for just this very purpose (bending PVC) and suggested a waterbed heater might work.
Also a fellow, life-long contractor friend suggested that there's a wrap-on, pipe heater blanket for just this very purpose (bending PVC) and suggested a waterbed heater might work.
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