In general, it was a transformer, and it does not work on direct current. The actions of these two kinds of AC and DC voltages on the transformer are completely different, therefore they can not be compared in decibels.
It is possible that I poked into a wasps nest as we say when I see that the
avatar of the OP is a toroidal transformer. I have a bad opinion about these.
avatar of the OP is a toroidal transformer. I have a bad opinion about these.
Presumably it is an amorphous core toroidal transformer. I had little to no idea what they were talking about in the first place but it would appear the OP is concerned about low frequency mains disturbances and their effect on the transformer in respect of the possibility of core saturation. No doubt amorphous materials have a softer saturation characteristic and are therefore much better than other materials so everyone should be using them. Maybe I should divest from BitCoin and buy into this type of technology.
to as_audio
What does this particular Avator have to do with it? If most of the modern top-end amplifiers have long been worth the toroids?
https://38.img.avito.st/640x480/4343913238.jpg
http://the-ear.net/sites/default/files/naim-nap250-dr.jpg
What does this particular Avator have to do with it? If most of the modern top-end amplifiers have long been worth the toroids?
https://38.img.avito.st/640x480/4343913238.jpg
http://the-ear.net/sites/default/files/naim-nap250-dr.jpg
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Well, I criticised toroids used as mains transformers in post 10
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/powe...ge-network-myths-reality-0-a.html#post5397155
At that point I was not aware that you are a promoter of toroids.
Sorry
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/powe...ge-network-myths-reality-0-a.html#post5397155
At that point I was not aware that you are a promoter of toroids.
Sorry
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With the same success, you can criticize electricity, for example, there are too many wires ... and that all of them want to be distributors have nothing more ...
How did you measure the 45 mV DC in your outlet? Was this a plus or minus relative to the zero phase?
How did you measure the 45 mV DC in your outlet? Was this a plus or minus relative to the zero phase?
In one way or another, all the trasformers are buzzing, and this depends on the quality of the silicon steel used and its magnetostriction, and also on how correctly any transformer is designed and manufactured.
All power C-core transformers are always assembled without air gaps, and EI-core transformers are assembled in an overlap and they all have no air gaps and advantages over toroids.
Moreover, to cut a toroid or R-core to make an air gap in them is very easy and simple, but nobody does it in power transformers.
All power C-core transformers are always assembled without air gaps, and EI-core transformers are assembled in an overlap and they all have no air gaps and advantages over toroids.
Moreover, to cut a toroid or R-core to make an air gap in them is very easy and simple, but nobody does it in power transformers.
No, I don't agree, this is not my experience.
Every time a customer complains about humming transformers it is a toroid. Regardless of class and price, be it Gryphon or Musical Fidelity.
Your picture of Accuphase in post 25 by the way is a good example how a transformer should not be done, have a look at: Accuphase C-280, E-303X, P-266, P-300L, P-500 and others diagrams, repair etc..
I have seen more than one defective Accuphase trannies and I use two of their round bottom plates as coasters for cooking on my kitchen gas cooker.
Please note that the round pot on Accuphase transformers does not necessarily indicate that a round transformer is potted inside. I learned this the hard way when I drilled down a pot like this in order to fill it again wlth a real toroidal mains transformer.
Every time a customer complains about humming transformers it is a toroid. Regardless of class and price, be it Gryphon or Musical Fidelity.
Your picture of Accuphase in post 25 by the way is a good example how a transformer should not be done, have a look at: Accuphase C-280, E-303X, P-266, P-300L, P-500 and others diagrams, repair etc..
I have seen more than one defective Accuphase trannies and I use two of their round bottom plates as coasters for cooking on my kitchen gas cooker.
Please note that the round pot on Accuphase transformers does not necessarily indicate that a round transformer is potted inside. I learned this the hard way when I drilled down a pot like this in order to fill it again wlth a real toroidal mains transformer.
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I never liked Musical Fidelity products. Well also we will assume that Accuphase and Gryphon are fakes and there are hidden C-core, but Naim Audio too? Pay attention to the size of the toroidal transformer in Naim-NAP250!
http://www.the-ear.net/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/naim-nap250-dr.jpg?itok=RjGgZ8rn
http://www.the-ear.net/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/naim-nap250-dr.jpg?itok=RjGgZ8rn
I say that when you criticize a toroidal transformer, because of the promoter, you can just as well criticize all of the electricity in general. Since there are also many drawbacks, for example, because of electricity, they dig the ground for cables or install ugly masts. Everywhere wires hang, and still a lot of interference in this network. And there are a lot of businessmen and promoters in this field. But you never reported a specific flaw in the toroid ...
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Again I do not agree.
I thought the topic was transformers and behaviour of these with dc and noise on mains. Correct me if I am wrong.
If I am to build an amplifier I will certainly not use a toroidal, because it is less efficient compared with what I use and takes up more space (space inside can not be used and it is not rectangular on the outside). But it is a little bit lighter in weight.
It has strong stray field opposed to public belief, chance of early failure due to crossed wires and will probably be humming in my or other homes.
I will make no assumptions about other Accuphase models, certain only with the one where I drilled up the pot, but I still keep two other round Accu trannies ready for your inspection. I remember it was an EI-cored transformer inside.
Your drills will suffer quickly, because the potting compound is bulked up with sand or something. I will not do this again.
My Gryphon DM-100 contained two heavy toroids, I sold it because it was humming. If you write "we will assume that Accuphase and Gryphon are fakes" you have to read carefully. This is not backed by my post, I wrote "every time a customer complains about humming transformers it is a toroid. Regardless of class and price, be it Gryphon or Musical Fidelity."
However it is not my task here to report "a specific flaw in the toroid". I am fine if all other people use these.
I thought the topic was transformers and behaviour of these with dc and noise on mains. Correct me if I am wrong.
If I am to build an amplifier I will certainly not use a toroidal, because it is less efficient compared with what I use and takes up more space (space inside can not be used and it is not rectangular on the outside). But it is a little bit lighter in weight.
It has strong stray field opposed to public belief, chance of early failure due to crossed wires and will probably be humming in my or other homes.
I will make no assumptions about other Accuphase models, certain only with the one where I drilled up the pot, but I still keep two other round Accu trannies ready for your inspection. I remember it was an EI-cored transformer inside.
Your drills will suffer quickly, because the potting compound is bulked up with sand or something. I will not do this again.
My Gryphon DM-100 contained two heavy toroids, I sold it because it was humming. If you write "we will assume that Accuphase and Gryphon are fakes" you have to read carefully. This is not backed by my post, I wrote "every time a customer complains about humming transformers it is a toroid. Regardless of class and price, be it Gryphon or Musical Fidelity."
However it is not my task here to report "a specific flaw in the toroid". I am fine if all other people use these.
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Transformers sing, only because of cheap silicon steel and wrong calculation, and not from the design or complaints of customers. Read the reviews of the owners of Naim, in their transformers do not sing anything. Also pay attention to the size of the transformer and the capacitance of the filter capacitors and the power of the amplifier.
Аlready this alone suggests that such an amplifier may not be all right ... I would never use two toroids in a stereo amplifier instead of one big one.
Yes. One of my friends from Europe, ordered toroids in different countries of Europe, in Germany, Poland and Italy and then wrote me that the toroids in Europe make of cheap silicon steel it is not clear how and where annealed, and very poorly wound. He is at this forum.
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So do you think that Gryphon people use cheap silicon steel transformers and do their calculations wrong?
Gryphon DM 100 is a dual mono amp, completely independent channels, so two transformers.
Your suggestion is ridiculous.
Naim transformers - you mentioned these as a good example in your post before - are not made in Europe ?
Mains Transformers and Noise
An interesting and gentle thread can be seen here:
Types of transformers used in high end audio - 2 Channel Debate - HiFi WigWam
An interesting and gentle thread can be seen here:
Types of transformers used in high end audio - 2 Channel Debate - HiFi WigWam
What's the problem.
I often see audiophiles complain about time-based fidelity of their AC power and/or digital waveforms. They falsely expect these to have the same purity as the sine or square waves from a function generator displayed at the output of their amps. The thing is, they never talk about the goodness of modern regulated power supplies, negative feedback, and error correction techniques. The snake oil peddlers know this, all they have to do is to create a pseudo problem to sell their 'solutions'. Some boutique audio have poor designs that may benefit from such system add-ons like power (air?) conditioners, that doesn't mean a well engineered design has to use it too. Often if the so called 'problem cant be ruled out with definitive proof, they cont6inue to have the foot in the door. This is a sales gimmick, also known as FUD Fear, uncertainty and doubt - Wikipedia. After all who doesn't want perfection esp. talk to an audiophile! see what perfect power means to this one , see at 2:14
The Audiophile Club of Athens on Vimeo
I often see audiophiles complain about time-based fidelity of their AC power and/or digital waveforms. They falsely expect these to have the same purity as the sine or square waves from a function generator displayed at the output of their amps. The thing is, they never talk about the goodness of modern regulated power supplies, negative feedback, and error correction techniques. The snake oil peddlers know this, all they have to do is to create a pseudo problem to sell their 'solutions'. Some boutique audio have poor designs that may benefit from such system add-ons like power (air?) conditioners, that doesn't mean a well engineered design has to use it too. Often if the so called 'problem cant be ruled out with definitive proof, they cont6inue to have the foot in the door. This is a sales gimmick, also known as FUD Fear, uncertainty and doubt - Wikipedia. After all who doesn't want perfection esp. talk to an audiophile! see what perfect power means to this one , see at 2:14
The Audiophile Club of Athens on Vimeo
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They are made in Spain by order of Naim
You yourself confirmed that their transformers are singing and customers are disappointed
This is a story for the townspeople. What qualitative sound can you get from a double mono, if you yourself make sure that these transformers have been rejected by the customers themselves, because they are horribly singing?
The advantage of dual mono is very doubtful, and only that you can disable one channel and use the other in mono. But who cares? There are no more advantages than many disadvantages. The stereo is better not to become accurate, because the dual mono does not affect the stereo effect at all.
Getting smaller losses and greater inductance in one large transformer is much easier than in two smaller ones. There are many good amplifiers with one large transformer where customers do not complain about childhood illnesses in the power source.
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