Greets!
It has, both here and on his QW forum.
Actually, it was his original WSs that damned the BIB to a short term extinction due to its simplifying assumptions and no room loading considerations that caused Scott to start this thread and me come up with a simple enough way to calculate them without the need to sim them, though now that there's a relatively inexpensive way to sim them with some boundary considerations does allow a bit of fine tuning for those that desire it.
GM
Can anyone sim Tang Band W4-930SF 4"
I think it could be taller cab which is what I am after.
I just don't understand how to come up with
final dims or driver placement height.
I think it could be taller cab which is what I am after.
I just don't understand how to come up with
final dims or driver placement height.
Are there any other small drivers in 4 or 5 inch
range that would work great in a taller BiB
say 60" Height 7" Width 14" Deep.
range that would work great in a taller BiB
say 60" Height 7" Width 14" Deep.
The BiB calculator uses the Fs, VAS, Qts values of the driver determine the dimensions.
I use a Fostex Fe166en in a 64" (H) x 11" (w) x 16" cab.
The CSS EL70 (4" driver) would yield a cab dimension of around 53.5" height, 11" deep and 8.5 inches wide (roughly).
I use a Fostex Fe166en in a 64" (H) x 11" (w) x 16" cab.
The CSS EL70 (4" driver) would yield a cab dimension of around 53.5" height, 11" deep and 8.5 inches wide (roughly).
I got all my cuts done according to the chart. However im alittle confused about the slant. When it lines up to the top on the speaker side, do i line it up so the top corner is flush with the top, and then use wood filler in the gap, or do i line line it up so the bottom corner is flush with the top, and then sand down the point till it is flush?
The figures I have put are all external dims, taking 3/4" cabinet material thickness.
The BiBs sound very good - these are my first FR speaker build. Fell in love with FR immediately.. I wrote this on another thread earlier:
I am using Fostex Fe166en in BIBs in a 168 sq ft room, and the music is very enjoyable.
Corner/back wall placement is important though. At first I had them at a distance from the walls and bass was weak. Now I have one speaker near the corner, the other near the back wall (don't have 2 corners which I can use), bass is greatly improved.
Handles most type of music well except heavy metal, and I guess techno with a lot noise/distortion in it. Acoustic and jazz really shine and so does new age stuff (Medwyn Goodall, Enya). Listening gives that "one more track" feeling... and yes, the sound is open and airy, sounds natural. People who have listened to the setup have used words like "sound like live performance" to describe the feeling.
Also very easy to build! Only caveat can be the size... footprint is kind of ok (my one is 11" x 16") but pretty tall at 65"... makes it a BIG cabinet. the removable front panel makes it very easy to tune to your room or to your taste, and I have had good results playing around with the stuffing.
Fostex should do great with 8-10 watts. My BIB really sings with 9 watt amp and does decent even with the 3.5 wpc Miniwatt.
The BiBs sound very good - these are my first FR speaker build. Fell in love with FR immediately.. I wrote this on another thread earlier:
I am using Fostex Fe166en in BIBs in a 168 sq ft room, and the music is very enjoyable.
Corner/back wall placement is important though. At first I had them at a distance from the walls and bass was weak. Now I have one speaker near the corner, the other near the back wall (don't have 2 corners which I can use), bass is greatly improved.
Handles most type of music well except heavy metal, and I guess techno with a lot noise/distortion in it. Acoustic and jazz really shine and so does new age stuff (Medwyn Goodall, Enya). Listening gives that "one more track" feeling... and yes, the sound is open and airy, sounds natural. People who have listened to the setup have used words like "sound like live performance" to describe the feeling.
Also very easy to build! Only caveat can be the size... footprint is kind of ok (my one is 11" x 16") but pretty tall at 65"... makes it a BIG cabinet. the removable front panel makes it very easy to tune to your room or to your taste, and I have had good results playing around with the stuffing.
Fostex should do great with 8-10 watts. My BIB really sings with 9 watt amp and does decent even with the 3.5 wpc Miniwatt.
I would say it makes no difference,that would be a cosmetic call
for sure and would not affect the sound,I would just butt
the edges tightly together and caulk across top of that butt joint
to ensure no air is escaping there.
This one for the Dayton you asked for is almost as tall as T.C.'s original and all the necessary inside [i.d.] dimensions are listed: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...e-fostex-craft-handbooks-120.html#post2547591
GM
>>> depth (in) 6.537
With that depth you will probably need a supra baffle... maybe two. Be careful and measure things out first.
With that depth you will probably need a supra baffle... maybe two. Be careful and measure things out first.
Yeah, just 'running numbers' in a designer calculator doesn't mean it can be built without tweaking and in some cases it's not a viable one at all, a common problem with many of the tapped variants I've simmed.
GM
GM
Well, I added a BIB calculator to my e-snips account to use for now and as an alternate, but they now require you/me to install their 'downloader' to access them, so maybe not so useful anymore, what with all the bad stuff that can happen as a byproduct of a 'free' site: http://www.esnips.com/doc/f3ea7b2b-0a64-47a4-8b64-394045de5b85/BIB_166_GM_v2a
GM
GM
Hi all! I tried sending email to everyone tonight with the BIB Calculator attached. It appears you can download it now from the ZillaAudio.com website to there are still problems with other links.
BIB Calculator - Bigger Is Better Loudspeaker Design
Attached is a screen shot of what i did to calculate my BIB using the Dayton PA130... a cheep driver that's built robustly. To be honest, this BIB is a compromise that's intended for swapping similarly sized drivers. I started with the Fostex 127e and the Dayton. I would not say one is better than the other but i will say the Dayton was good enough and fun enough for me to install one in each BIB and save the 127e for a future project which will probably be some kind of small, efficient bookshelf speaker. What makes the Dayton fun for me is that i hated it in a small sealed/ported box... too bright... too muddled... just not good enough. Since it shared the same size opening with the 127e i gave it another listen and was VERY surprised how it opened up and 'sung'... the bass is very sufficient and the overall sound just balanced out so nicely. I think it would benefit from a super tweeter but have been enjoying without. It's the kind of sound you can listen to without any fatigue. I listen slightly off axis. The speaker is very musical sounding to me and doesn't call attention to itself. You can play it softly or crank it up and it will rock. Instruments pop and vocals can sound ghostly real. I love them and would build another pair without hesitation. The Fostex 127e may have resolved more and could sound more delicate but the overall sound was more forward and more 'airy fairy'... whatever that means. But my wife thought it was 'the best speaker i've built' because it sounded 'sweetest'... and she's pretty critical. I'd say people were divided on which they preferred. They do sound different. Drum thwacks and guitar plucks jump and sound real... all supported by a nice, full bass. I hope others build this and try different tweeters! Or just enjoy the simplicity of a single full range driver on the cheap and revel in that crossoverless, open, direct and easy going sound of a BIB. Or maybe someone can try the new Fostex 126en after they've heard the Dayton. You may lose a bit of richness of sound if it's like the 127e but gain that sweetness and extra detail. Switch them around and enjoy them both.
Also, attached is the 'optimal' BIB dims (first column) and the one i built (second column). The first one looks like a pretty small BIB and probably worth a try. I wonder how it compares to what i built... which is taller and less deep. I'd bet they are similar for sure. The 'optimal' short one might benefit from down firing but i thought the same of what i built and they are great firing upwards. As i listen now, they just image so nicely and fill my space (13" x 16" with 11" ceilings). Piano sound like a full size instrument... I think BIBs just do this well in general. I am using a Dayton T-amp... just perfect but i wonder how they will sound with tubes. Someone try and report back.
I must apologize, i have switched jobs after working for myself the past 14 years! It was not an easy change to make (working for someone... and the commute is much longer into NYC). I doubt i will be here as often but expect i won't be able to stay away too much. I'll certainly pop by as often as i can!
Peace!
Zilla
PS... always feel free to email me at ZillaSpeakers@gmail.com
BIB Calculator - Bigger Is Better Loudspeaker Design
Attached is a screen shot of what i did to calculate my BIB using the Dayton PA130... a cheep driver that's built robustly. To be honest, this BIB is a compromise that's intended for swapping similarly sized drivers. I started with the Fostex 127e and the Dayton. I would not say one is better than the other but i will say the Dayton was good enough and fun enough for me to install one in each BIB and save the 127e for a future project which will probably be some kind of small, efficient bookshelf speaker. What makes the Dayton fun for me is that i hated it in a small sealed/ported box... too bright... too muddled... just not good enough. Since it shared the same size opening with the 127e i gave it another listen and was VERY surprised how it opened up and 'sung'... the bass is very sufficient and the overall sound just balanced out so nicely. I think it would benefit from a super tweeter but have been enjoying without. It's the kind of sound you can listen to without any fatigue. I listen slightly off axis. The speaker is very musical sounding to me and doesn't call attention to itself. You can play it softly or crank it up and it will rock. Instruments pop and vocals can sound ghostly real. I love them and would build another pair without hesitation. The Fostex 127e may have resolved more and could sound more delicate but the overall sound was more forward and more 'airy fairy'... whatever that means. But my wife thought it was 'the best speaker i've built' because it sounded 'sweetest'... and she's pretty critical. I'd say people were divided on which they preferred. They do sound different. Drum thwacks and guitar plucks jump and sound real... all supported by a nice, full bass. I hope others build this and try different tweeters! Or just enjoy the simplicity of a single full range driver on the cheap and revel in that crossoverless, open, direct and easy going sound of a BIB. Or maybe someone can try the new Fostex 126en after they've heard the Dayton. You may lose a bit of richness of sound if it's like the 127e but gain that sweetness and extra detail. Switch them around and enjoy them both.
Also, attached is the 'optimal' BIB dims (first column) and the one i built (second column). The first one looks like a pretty small BIB and probably worth a try. I wonder how it compares to what i built... which is taller and less deep. I'd bet they are similar for sure. The 'optimal' short one might benefit from down firing but i thought the same of what i built and they are great firing upwards. As i listen now, they just image so nicely and fill my space (13" x 16" with 11" ceilings). Piano sound like a full size instrument... I think BIBs just do this well in general. I am using a Dayton T-amp... just perfect but i wonder how they will sound with tubes. Someone try and report back.
I must apologize, i have switched jobs after working for myself the past 14 years! It was not an easy change to make (working for someone... and the commute is much longer into NYC). I doubt i will be here as often but expect i won't be able to stay away too much. I'll certainly pop by as often as i can!
Peace!
Zilla
PS... always feel free to email me at ZillaSpeakers@gmail.com
Attachments
Not for me:
Not Found
The requested URL /BIB_Calculator_V1.xls was not found on this server.
Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request.
Apache Server at Outdoor Speakers | Rock Garden Speakers | Garden Speakers | Patio Speakers | In Wall Speakers | Ceiling Speakers - ZillaAudio.com Port 80
So, the first calculator I sent Vadim was the right one and I have rev. V1, so wonder why mine won't calculate the cells beginning on row 28?
Bummer about the self employment floundering, but at least you found something to fall back on, which is more than I can say for a couple of my friends that had to 'close their doors'.
GM
Not Found
The requested URL /BIB_Calculator_V1.xls was not found on this server.
Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request.
Apache Server at Outdoor Speakers | Rock Garden Speakers | Garden Speakers | Patio Speakers | In Wall Speakers | Ceiling Speakers - ZillaAudio.com Port 80
So, the first calculator I sent Vadim was the right one and I have rev. V1, so wonder why mine won't calculate the cells beginning on row 28?
Bummer about the self employment floundering, but at least you found something to fall back on, which is more than I can say for a couple of my friends that had to 'close their doors'.
GM
Zilla and all,
I still have the original calculator you posted on the site. I can make any recommended revisions to the spreadsheet you all would like. It looks like the general consensus would be to give a few more blank spaces at the beginning. We can also add some of the newer drivers, and delete a few that are no longer available. The file is password protected, but that was only out of habit to maintain the formulas. I always wanted to make the spreadsheet switchable between imperial and metric, but ran out of time and then forgot. So maybe this would be the time.
Anyway, let me know what I can do to make the calculator better for everyone.
I still have the original calculator you posted on the site. I can make any recommended revisions to the spreadsheet you all would like. It looks like the general consensus would be to give a few more blank spaces at the beginning. We can also add some of the newer drivers, and delete a few that are no longer available. The file is password protected, but that was only out of habit to maintain the formulas. I always wanted to make the spreadsheet switchable between imperial and metric, but ran out of time and then forgot. So maybe this would be the time.
Anyway, let me know what I can do to make the calculator better for everyone.
No way!, The thanks is to everyone who designed these things, and to you for keeping it alive and spreading the knowledge.