26 mH with a minimum resistance of 800 ohms impedance will doubling approximately 5 kHz.
That very early for full-range speakers:
F = (159,2 x 800 ohms)/26 mH = 4,9 kHz
Inductance very uncomfortable. It varies with frequency, though non-linearly.
Therefore, use a different, very convenient parameter. Which is easy to measure and standardize. Its easy to see in the impedance curve. Which usually results in a single graph of the amplitude frequency response.
This is the frequency doubling of the minimum impedance: F2z. This point roughly corresponds to the double maximum possible reduction of the current at a constant level of the input voltage through the speaker.
Minimum impedance in these speakers typically at frequencies of 150-300 Hz.
Has set for itself for optimum resonance in 8" full-range speakers.
This 45-60 Hz.
Then, at low frequencies there is no problem. And sensitivity is non reduced.
Parameter F2z full-range speakers with a wide range of often 15-27 kHz.
Very well when more than 40 kHz.
This area of work is very good tweeters.
That very early for full-range speakers:
F = (159,2 x 800 ohms)/26 mH = 4,9 kHz
Inductance very uncomfortable. It varies with frequency, though non-linearly.
Therefore, use a different, very convenient parameter. Which is easy to measure and standardize. Its easy to see in the impedance curve. Which usually results in a single graph of the amplitude frequency response.
This is the frequency doubling of the minimum impedance: F2z. This point roughly corresponds to the double maximum possible reduction of the current at a constant level of the input voltage through the speaker.
Minimum impedance in these speakers typically at frequencies of 150-300 Hz.
Has set for itself for optimum resonance in 8" full-range speakers.
This 45-60 Hz.
Then, at low frequencies there is no problem. And sensitivity is non reduced.
Parameter F2z full-range speakers with a wide range of often 15-27 kHz.
Very well when more than 40 kHz.
This area of work is very good tweeters.
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Thank You, Svjatoslav.
So I can conclude - my Philips AD3800AM speakers have no real bass and no real treble. 🙂
They do a very fine midrange, though.
Best
Ole, Copenhagen
So I can conclude - my Philips AD3800AM speakers have no real bass and no real treble. 🙂
They do a very fine midrange, though.
Best
Ole, Copenhagen
Diagram complex impedance with frequency TFR8-2000, №14
Clearly seen that the inductance of the coil (at 1 kHz) does not matter much.
150 Hz / 20 kHz - almost a straight slanted line!
Z very complicated dependence on frequency.
Expressed in dB: 0 dB = 2 kOhm.
Full-range speaker, 2 kOhm nominal.
Clearly seen that the inductance of the coil (at 1 kHz) does not matter much.
150 Hz / 20 kHz - almost a straight slanted line!
Z very complicated dependence on frequency.
Expressed in dB: 0 dB = 2 kOhm.
Full-range speaker, 2 kOhm nominal.
Attachments
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Couple TFR8-1000, №22, №23.
This pair experienced. More than the usual reduced inductance. As a result, the shifted F2z to higher 5-10 kHz range. The mechanical quality factor is reduced.
Deviation of the impedance in the band 80-20000 Hz at №22 was 1.44; at №23 - 1,51 times.
Thiele-Small parameters: DC resistance, Re; resonance frequency, Fs, Hz; Q-- mechanical, Qa; electric, Qe; complete, Qt; equivalent volume Vas. Frequency doubling of the minimum impedance F2z, kHz.
........Re, Ом;....Fs, Гц;.....Qa;.......Qe;.....Qt....Vas, л,....F2z, кГц.
№22...770.........51,8......5,20.....1,60...1,20....-...........53
№23...760.........50,5......4,96.....1,53...1,17....-...........48
This pair experienced. More than the usual reduced inductance. As a result, the shifted F2z to higher 5-10 kHz range. The mechanical quality factor is reduced.
Deviation of the impedance in the band 80-20000 Hz at №22 was 1.44; at №23 - 1,51 times.
Thiele-Small parameters: DC resistance, Re; resonance frequency, Fs, Hz; Q-- mechanical, Qa; electric, Qe; complete, Qt; equivalent volume Vas. Frequency doubling of the minimum impedance F2z, kHz.
........Re, Ом;....Fs, Гц;.....Qa;.......Qe;.....Qt....Vas, л,....F2z, кГц.
№22...770.........51,8......5,20.....1,60...1,20....-...........53
№23...760.........50,5......4,96.....1,53...1,17....-...........48
Attachments
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There are measurement results speakers with a nominal 1000 and 2000 ohms, in the anechoic chamber, strictly according to the classical method.
Deviation in the range above 100 Hz is not more than 0.5 dB.
Parameters Thiele-Small:
Z=1000:
Re - 771om
Fs - 53.17Hz
Vas- 48.3L
Mms- 13.21grm
Qms- 5.5
Qes- 1.726
Z=2000:
Re - 1483 om
Fs - 54.65hz
vas- 44.8
Mms- 13.44 grm
Qms- 7.713
Qes- 0.5358
In attachments, frequency response speakers with a nominal 2000 ohms, impedance, frequency response apmlitudno and THD speakers with a nominal 1000 ohms.
40-22000 Hz from a single 8"- not bad.
"In the regiment" 22,000 Hz and a 2000-ohm speakers!
Confirmed peculiar characteristic of the complex impedance. Very small increase with frequency, instead of the classic quadratic curve - almost straight sloping line.
Deviation in the range above 100 Hz is not more than 0.5 dB.
Parameters Thiele-Small:
Z=1000:
Re - 771om
Fs - 53.17Hz
Vas- 48.3L
Mms- 13.21grm
Qms- 5.5
Qes- 1.726
Z=2000:
Re - 1483 om
Fs - 54.65hz
vas- 44.8
Mms- 13.44 grm
Qms- 7.713
Qes- 0.5358
In attachments, frequency response speakers with a nominal 2000 ohms, impedance, frequency response apmlitudno and THD speakers with a nominal 1000 ohms.
40-22000 Hz from a single 8"- not bad.
"In the regiment" 22,000 Hz and a 2000-ohm speakers!
Confirmed peculiar characteristic of the complex impedance. Very small increase with frequency, instead of the classic quadratic curve - almost straight sloping line.
Attachments
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Measurements alternative: "... do not claim to infallibility metrology, and can not be used for comparison with the results of other similar tests ..."
Shows the spectrum of harmonics. Range is measured in a wider lane:
?????????????? ????????
?????????????? ????????
Shows the spectrum of harmonics. Range is measured in a wider lane:
?????????????? ????????
?????????????? ????????
TFR8-800, №24, №25.
Thiele-Small parameters: DC resistance, Re; resonance frequency, Fs, Hz; Q-- mechanical, Qa; electric, Qe; complete, Qt; equivalent volume Vas. Frequency doubling of the minimum impedance F2z, kHz.
........Re, Оhm;....Fs, Hz;....Qa;.....Qe;.....Qt....Vas, l.
№24...596.........40,1.....11,0....0,54...0,51....64
№25...593.........42,4.....11,1....0,56...0,53....56
Thiele-Small parameters: DC resistance, Re; resonance frequency, Fs, Hz; Q-- mechanical, Qa; electric, Qe; complete, Qt; equivalent volume Vas. Frequency doubling of the minimum impedance F2z, kHz.
........Re, Оhm;....Fs, Hz;....Qa;.....Qe;.....Qt....Vas, l.
№24...596.........40,1.....11,0....0,54...0,51....64
№25...593.........42,4.....11,1....0,56...0,53....56
Attachments
TFR8-800, №26, №27.
Thiele-Small parameters: DC resistance, Re; resonance frequency, Fs, Hz; Q-- mechanical, Qa; electric, Qe; complete, Qt; equivalent volume Vas. Frequency doubling of the minimum impedance F2z, kHz.
........Re, Ом;.....Fs, Гц;.....Qa;......Qe;.....Qt;...Vas, л.
№26...1500.........61,9.....12,4....0,51....0,49....46
№27...1500.........59,3......8,9.....0,52....0,49....53
Thiele-Small parameters: DC resistance, Re; resonance frequency, Fs, Hz; Q-- mechanical, Qa; electric, Qe; complete, Qt; equivalent volume Vas. Frequency doubling of the minimum impedance F2z, kHz.
........Re, Ом;.....Fs, Гц;.....Qa;......Qe;.....Qt;...Vas, л.
№26...1500.........61,9.....12,4....0,51....0,49....46
№27...1500.........59,3......8,9.....0,52....0,49....53
Attachments
Suspension translucent, thin cloth. On measurements frequency response and harmonic distortion. Improved high-frequency diffuser. Subjectively, much better.
On line impedance in the ultrasonic region has maximum impedance at the frequency of 90 kHz at 9,2 kOhms. Next - to 200 kHz resistance of 2,9 kOhms.
On line impedance in the ultrasonic region has maximum impedance at the frequency of 90 kHz at 9,2 kOhms. Next - to 200 kHz resistance of 2,9 kOhms.
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Measurements №26, №27. (The new version of the speaker.)
Improved high-frequency cone design.
The results of precise measurement.
Improved high-frequency cone design.
The results of precise measurement.
Attachments
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Phillips 9710. Comparison of high-resistance (700 ohms) and a low-resistance (5.7 ohm).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkS1bWu6maE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47mq6hMpLZ8
Article:
Phillips 9710 ??? 700Om vs 5,7Om.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkS1bWu6maE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47mq6hMpLZ8
Article:
Phillips 9710 ??? 700Om vs 5,7Om.
Congratulations on an incredible development.
Much more so for such good results 🙂
That very even frequency response is to be commended in any full range speaker; getting it in a high Z speaker is going beyond the limits.
Just curious, what diameter wire was used to wind the voice coil?
Is it copper or aluminum?
Thanks.
Much more so for such good results 🙂
That very even frequency response is to be commended in any full range speaker; getting it in a high Z speaker is going beyond the limits.
Just curious, what diameter wire was used to wind the voice coil?
Is it copper or aluminum?
Thanks.
I am interested in an update on these high impedance speakers.
Are they available for purchase?
Jim
Are they available for purchase?
Jim
Hi, Jim.
Thank you for your interest in the subject. I apologize for the long absence. There are problems that are not relevant to the topic. I can make high-resistance speakers on request.
While in small quantities.
Thank you for your interest in the subject. I apologize for the long absence. There are problems that are not relevant to the topic. I can make high-resistance speakers on request.
While in small quantities.
A comment about high-Z speakers...
Some people like John Broskie says that a world needs is a good 100R (or so) speaker (see The Tube CAD Journal, Hybrid amplifiers , for example), basically related to OTL world. Even in this forum I've seen this comment several times.
But I say that the audio tube world need is a great 2000R speaker 😉😀🙂 . No need for high-current cathode-emission-exaust OTL amps. Since here is proved to be possible to manufacture speakers like this, and with great results, why no single one "traditional" maker offers some high-Z model, besides the cost? 😕
Interesting exercise, at least.
Some people like John Broskie says that a world needs is a good 100R (or so) speaker (see The Tube CAD Journal, Hybrid amplifiers , for example), basically related to OTL world. Even in this forum I've seen this comment several times.
But I say that the audio tube world need is a great 2000R speaker 😉😀🙂 . No need for high-current cathode-emission-exaust OTL amps. Since here is proved to be possible to manufacture speakers like this, and with great results, why no single one "traditional" maker offers some high-Z model, besides the cost? 😕
Interesting exercise, at least.
Thank you, DIYBras.
An option, is made of high-current cathode-emission-exaust OTL amps.
Preamp and two monoblock amplifiers "Cyrclotron 6P45C". One powerful tube in the shoulder. Without the case, on the chassis.
Load - 32 consecutive fullranges speakers of 4 Ohms.
A little over 100 ohms. 25 W power.
Measured the real emissions of several high-current tubes at 14.5 V.
An option, is made of high-current cathode-emission-exaust OTL amps.
Preamp and two monoblock amplifiers "Cyrclotron 6P45C". One powerful tube in the shoulder. Without the case, on the chassis.
Load - 32 consecutive fullranges speakers of 4 Ohms.
A little over 100 ohms. 25 W power.
Measured the real emissions of several high-current tubes at 14.5 V.
Attachments
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Full-range speakers 5 ", 200 Ohm. TFR5-1-200.
Sound coil 1 ".
Low inductance is also, characteristic.
F, КHz,......Z, Ohm, №1....Z, Ohm, №2
0,2...........205...............210
0,3...........170...............170 (Zmin)
0,5...........170...............170
1..............190...............190
2..............210...............210
5..............230...............235
8..............245...............245
10............255...............255
15............260...............260
20............270...............270
40............340...............340 (F2z)
........Re, Ohm;....Fs, Hz;......Qa;.....Qe;.......Qt.....Vas, l.
№1......160.........130.......4,02....1,35.....1,0......-
№2......155.........132.......4,05....1,47.....1,08....-
Sound coil 1 ".
Low inductance is also, characteristic.
F, КHz,......Z, Ohm, №1....Z, Ohm, №2
0,2...........205...............210
0,3...........170...............170 (Zmin)
0,5...........170...............170
1..............190...............190
2..............210...............210
5..............230...............235
8..............245...............245
10............255...............255
15............260...............260
20............270...............270
40............340...............340 (F2z)
........Re, Ohm;....Fs, Hz;......Qa;.....Qe;.......Qt.....Vas, l.
№1......160.........130.......4,02....1,35.....1,0......-
№2......155.........132.......4,05....1,47.....1,08....-
Attachments
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Full-band speaker 6 ", 50 ohm.
Sound coil 15 mm. Outputs of the wire from the coil are ribbons.
In the amount of 32 you can combine the connection.
From sequential - to parallel.
Getting different resistance. Even 1600 ohms.
........Re, Ohm;....Fs, Hz;....Qa;.....Qe;.....Qt....Vas, l.
№1......39..........92........6,4.....2,6.....1,8....-
F, KHz,......Z, Ohm
0,2...........42
0,3...........42 (Zmin)
0,5...........43
1..............46
2..............54
5..............65
8..............70
10............73
15............75
20............77
29............84 (F2z)
Sound coil 15 mm. Outputs of the wire from the coil are ribbons.
In the amount of 32 you can combine the connection.
From sequential - to parallel.
Getting different resistance. Even 1600 ohms.
........Re, Ohm;....Fs, Hz;....Qa;.....Qe;.....Qt....Vas, l.
№1......39..........92........6,4.....2,6.....1,8....-
F, KHz,......Z, Ohm
0,2...........42
0,3...........42 (Zmin)
0,5...........43
1..............46
2..............54
5..............65
8..............70
10............73
15............75
20............77
29............84 (F2z)
Attachments
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