What if they said, "I've performed the test exactly how Amir has outlined, here are all the pictures etc confirming that, and here are all the results"?
Since the context of this part of the discussion is the audibility of non-linear distortion, are you familiar with the Gedlee Metric?
Hi, sorry for my English, I just want to share my experience
For me the measurements are important so I identified more with the philosophy of the ASR forum, but as this forum is ruthless with many people I decided to better register in this forum in which you can discuss topics that are simply prohibited by its leader in ASR forum.
This weekend I modified half of my amplifier to get out of doubt and form my own opinion on this, it is important to say that I am not trying to convince anyone, this is just my experience.
After making the modification I can tell the difference between one channel and the other, I will not use audiophile adjectives but there is something that changes between one channel and the other what makes me like it more.
The conclusion that I draw from this experiment is that there may be things that the current measurements are not detecting so it would be interesting to see research on these topics, for example soudstage or harshness, etc.
IMG_7375.jpg - Google Drive
For me the measurements are important so I identified more with the philosophy of the ASR forum, but as this forum is ruthless with many people I decided to better register in this forum in which you can discuss topics that are simply prohibited by its leader in ASR forum.
This weekend I modified half of my amplifier to get out of doubt and form my own opinion on this, it is important to say that I am not trying to convince anyone, this is just my experience.
After making the modification I can tell the difference between one channel and the other, I will not use audiophile adjectives but there is something that changes between one channel and the other what makes me like it more.
The conclusion that I draw from this experiment is that there may be things that the current measurements are not detecting so it would be interesting to see research on these topics, for example soudstage or harshness, etc.
IMG_7375.jpg - Google Drive
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Hello,
Since you have modified one channel, how would you like to try something similar to the test I mentioned a few posts back?
There is a phrase, "a change is as good as a rest" and I think quite often a change can be perceived as an improvement even when it's not, at least for a short while, and perhaps it's better to get used to the new sound before passing judgement on whether it sounds better to you.
Since you have modified one channel, how would you like to try something similar to the test I mentioned a few posts back?
There is a phrase, "a change is as good as a rest" and I think quite often a change can be perceived as an improvement even when it's not, at least for a short while, and perhaps it's better to get used to the new sound before passing judgement on whether it sounds better to you.
Din Don wake up greedy boyz 
at work.....learn at diyaudio.....https://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_dist_fdbk.pdf
at work.....learn at diyaudio.....https://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_dist_fdbk.pdfAttachments
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There is a relatively simple test almost anyone could do so long as their system is reasonably well balanced. First use a mono source and set up your speakers as symetrically as you can, nearfield might make things easier, sit in the sweet spot and check that you can get a stable, focused image exactly in the centre. The material shouldn't matter too much, preferably something you like.
The second stage is simply to change one capacitor in one speaker (leaving the other speaker untouched) and listen for any changes, particularly in the quality and position of the image, including widening, narrowing, shifting and smearing.
Hi Jazz Man
To be honest I did this test already with the two modified amplifiers (my system is bi-amped) and I noticed more differences but I did not wanted to write them because I was afraid somebody would tell me I was crazy
.These differences had to do with the soundstage of my system, there is some thing different.
As I mentioned, I don't want to generate more controversy because I do not have objective measurements to demonstrate what I can hear, there is no soudstage measurement so all this remains subjective.
For me this experiment changed some pre-established ideas
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Certainly.
Those with substantial experience in audio design/building/listening know very well that capacitors can have
real effects on the sound beyond their linear distortion, whether they are in speakers or amplifiers.
This is simply one of the "facts of life" in audio.
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It does seem to be a very sensitive test, I think it's due to differences between the channels and the way they disrupt ITD information. If the distortions in both channels were identical I'm guessing the image would stay focused and centred although I'm not sure the clarity of auditory objects wouldn't suffer regardless possibly because of distortions to the transient information affecting the timbre.Hi Jazz Man
To be honest I did this test already with the two modified amplifiers (my system is bi-amped) and I noticed more differences but I did not wanted to write them because I was afraid somebody would tell me I was crazy
These differences had to do with the soundstage of my system, there is some thing different.
I'm not aware of any way to measure soundstage.
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OK. Than, @johnmath, please do prove a positive: "There is subjective sound difference between different capacitors (brands, models)"![/QUOTE]
I never said that capacitor sound is inaudible. What I said is that it has yet to be proven to be audible. Big difference. But you either don't understand that or just don't to want to recognize it.
Nonsense. I never said that. This is an outright lie.
Nor did I say that either. Another lie.
Yet, another lie. I said it has not been proven. You still don't seem to understand the difference.
And if you really believe that blind testing isn't necessary to get to conclusions on speaker performance differences and 'logic' is sufficient, then you have lost any credibility whatsoever on the topic. However, if you can convince other people like Harman, for example, they might pay you a lot money since they could save millions of dollars by not doing blind testing on their products anymore.
Finally, you have lost any credibility that you might have had by posting these multiple statements that are not true. Sorry, but you don't get to make up things and attribute them to other people. It doesn't work that way.
I would be interested in seeing it. But whether I would accept any conclusions or not depends on the details. I can't answer that without see it first.
Someone simply saying that "I've performed the test exactly how Amir has outlined" is not sufficient enough. Anyone can say that, but it doesn't mean it's true. I need to see what they have done.
Ok, thanks I can understand that. To see what they have done you'd really need to be there. Amir's video describes a test for people to do for themselves for their own interest and to find out if they are really hearing a difference, not to provide any scientifically acceptable "proof", that requires more stringency, something that no one here is able to do.
IACC ( Inter Aural Coherence Coefficient) implemented within Acourate is one.
Based on works of Blauert, Braasch and Griesinger.
It define a value over 4 time windows of importance (10ms, 20ms, 80ms and 'late').
To my knowledge it is inline with the most recent research about H(uman)A(uditory)S(ystem) behavior and psychoacoustic.
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