Without a decent DAC there is little reason for Pure Music. Playback will be improved, but the improvement may be masked by the limiting quality of the Mac's internal DAC and even more the analog headphone output circuitry.
Thanks Steve; just as I suspected. Home renovations prevent me from using a "real" audio system probably for another two months, and my job involves travel for extended periods of time in remote areas, where no hifi will be following me, and they could call me anytime.
I'll revisit the idea when it's more relevant to my audio needs. Hopefully that will be before next fall, but in reality it could be that long.
I'll revisit the idea when it's more relevant to my audio needs. Hopefully that will be before next fall, but in reality it could be that long.
I plan to try it out with my Twin Alpair7, Quad SDX7 project (postponed until arrival of next batch of A7)
dave
dave
i'll be trying it with the exa usb interface and dual ackodacs, amps initially a alephjx and a panson chip/mos amp. driven initially by a g5, but probably with a new mac mini and scanspeak 2 ways
Oliver
I am strictly WIN7. Is there any way to use MAC software on WIN7?
If not, or if there would be no benefit even if I could.. do you have a preferred WIN solution. Wont pollute MAC based thread with more WIN7 stuff, but wondering what you thought. I just got a DAC and have been using J.River.
Uriah
I am strictly WIN7. Is there any way to use MAC software on WIN7?
If not, or if there would be no benefit even if I could.. do you have a preferred WIN solution. Wont pollute MAC based thread with more WIN7 stuff, but wondering what you thought. I just got a DAC and have been using J.River.
Uriah
Uriah,
If you get a mac-mini you can run windows, either in a virtual machine or natively in it's own partition. J-River is not bad, but seems to discover only half my music.
If you get a mac-mini you can run windows, either in a virtual machine or natively in it's own partition. J-River is not bad, but seems to discover only half my music.
No i haven't. I worry about it keeping up. Filter should be simple thou. 1st order, with little EQ. Drivers are essentially coincident at the expected XO frequency.
dave
Just a followup on this ... sort of ... but I checked out Fidelio and with the built-in 24/96 DAC doing D/A conversion and via and line-out to a modified T-amp and some relatively decent but certainly not high end speakers (Athena Point 5 pair) and the difference was clearly audible on first listen. Perhaps I should have tried a demo of Pure Music.
I would have, but was talked out of it, based on that I would not be able to hear a difference or improvement with the current Mac's Cirrus Logic 4206 a/dd/a chipset.
The experiment with Fidelio will stand as is, I won't be downloading Pure Music's demo.
I don't have much tolerance for bad behaving software; I expect an app to do it's job well and not to screw with the system, which is why I try to find out as much as I can before installing anything. I've had my share of badly written apps, apps that over-write the OS's files in directories that are supposed to be reserved, apps that leave orphan files on the system that interfere with operation mysteriously (and there is no such thing as a demo that doesn't leave orphan files ... it's the only way demos can work without a full registered install in the first place, so you are by definition placing your trust that the developer knows what he's doing when you install a demo of anything).
Some demos interfere with the very app they're demoing when you do pony for a full install, and not just from small firms ... it's been an issue with Adobe Photoshop, Microsoft Word, the list goes on. And Lord Help You if it's an audio or video app. Nightmares, every one will try to alter the file associations of any other similar app on your system, and many do much worse ... Real Player, anyone?
So, Pure Music will have to wait ... it was my first choice to check out but it's too late now. The doorman only lets one into the club, and on some nights, no-one gets in.
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I am just another customer, but I have been working closely at times, via email, with Rob the author of pure vinyl and pure music. He has been very responsive to my comments, questions, and even suggestions. The program has gotten better, both more reliable and more full featured with each revision.
There has never been a problem upgrading including going from the time limited demo which simply required entering the registration information to the already downloaded demo version.
At this point I feel that Pure Music is easily both more stable and capable than other programs that might claim a similar function. Unlike some others it also doesn't rely on a root kit installation and the insult of needing to buy a hardware dongle just to use it.
I have nothing but praise for this program, but the real reason for it is how it sounds. For that only a demo in your system can answer if you will value the improvement it offers. My earlier comment should be revised to say that the better your system of associated hardware ie DAC amp and speakers, the greater the improvement provided by Pure Music. While the built in audio output might sound better with Pure Music the true potential improvement will only be hinted at and it remains an open question if such an improvement would justify even the modest price of the software.
There has never been a problem upgrading including going from the time limited demo which simply required entering the registration information to the already downloaded demo version.
At this point I feel that Pure Music is easily both more stable and capable than other programs that might claim a similar function. Unlike some others it also doesn't rely on a root kit installation and the insult of needing to buy a hardware dongle just to use it.
I have nothing but praise for this program, but the real reason for it is how it sounds. For that only a demo in your system can answer if you will value the improvement it offers. My earlier comment should be revised to say that the better your system of associated hardware ie DAC amp and speakers, the greater the improvement provided by Pure Music. While the built in audio output might sound better with Pure Music the true potential improvement will only be hinted at and it remains an open question if such an improvement would justify even the modest price of the software.
I made no specific comments about Pure Music itself; had I decided to install it I would have made a tighter audit of what and where it installs components but naturally that didn't happen, for the reasons I mentioned earlier. I am quite familiar with Channel D and it might be worth mentioning that it was their involvement that piqued my interest in the first place. Audio Engineering (makers of Fidelia) also are capable of good software engineering. That's not an endorsement, that's a minimum prerequisite.
I have a somewhat old-fashioned approach to computer performance ... first it has to work, and work robustly. Next, it must do no harm. Performance compared to it's rivals is irrelevant until those are established.
Installation is in a test machine with a newly formatted drive, and a fresh install of the most recent but tested stable version of the OS and the minimal relevant supporting software. Then we evaluate stability. And last, we evaluate usability and performance. Finally we reformat with the working software load and re-test.
If I have a HD that I can re-purpose I may yet try Pure Music, but right now that's not possible.
For what it's worth, Fidelia is proving to be reasonably robust but I would still classify it as beta software. Sound quality is good (Mac's Cirrus Logic 4206 --> Ultimate Ears in-ear headphones) but I still need access to a DAC and the main audio system is down during renovations, so no final word yet there.
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Pure Music Community Settings
Hi to all,
it would be interested to see witch settings you have for the following points:
HOG mode: on or off
Preallocate: on or off
Memory Play mode: on or off
Upsampling: on or off
Upsampling method: Max. Fidelity or NOS type
Installed Memory: 2, 4 or more GB
Feel free to post your settings.
Hi to all,
it would be interested to see witch settings you have for the following points:
HOG mode: on or off
Preallocate: on or off
Memory Play mode: on or off
Upsampling: on or off
Upsampling method: Max. Fidelity or NOS type
Installed Memory: 2, 4 or more GB
Feel free to post your settings.
I use two modes primarily:
1. HOG ON
2. Preallocate ON
3. Memory play ON
4. Upsampling ON power of 2
5. Max Fidelity
OR
4. upsampling OFF
4 gig ram
1. HOG ON
2. Preallocate ON
3. Memory play ON
4. Upsampling ON power of 2
5. Max Fidelity
OR
4. upsampling OFF
4 gig ram
My Settings
1. HOG Mode: ON
2. Preallocate: ON
3. Memory Play: ON
4. NOS: ON
5. Less is More: ON
6. Other: 4 gig RAM, 64 bit kernel enabled
1. HOG Mode: ON
2. Preallocate: ON
3. Memory Play: ON
4. NOS: ON
5. Less is More: ON
6. Other: 4 gig RAM, 64 bit kernel enabled
I read about Pure Music in The Absolute Sound forums and downloaded the demo.
In my initial listening tests, I found PM (compared to iTunes) to be anemic with the volume severely damped, attack and decay of drums and cymbals shortened and the sound stage all but removed. My speakers were no longer transparent and the instrumentation of music, was muted and confined to either the left or right channels.
I then tried the Amarra demo as well, with the same result and thus pointing the problem away from the software.
I called Pure Music and spoke to them to find out what could be wrong.
They were extremely helpful.
After hearing the audible differences over the phone, between iTunes and PM, their tech accessed my computer with a VNC program to check everything. It took about 20 minutes of going through the settings, before he realized (and I remembered) that I had used the iTunes equalizer "Acoustic" preset on all of my stored music along with a gain adjustment set to 70%.
(I'm not fond of computer music, but I do listen to an iPod when I'm out and about and I have found that the iTunes"Acoustic" preset opened up every genre of music, revealing the articulation of the instruments and creating a sound stage. Even on my stereo system, it's close to CD sonic quality, but still falls a bit short.)
At this point, the tech tried adjusting the PM AUgraphic EQ and got the playback similar to the sound quality of the iTunes Acoustic" preset.. The tech suggested adjusting the AUDynamics processor. Not being a sound engineer and unfamiliar with the effect and use of "expansion ratio" "attack time" adjustments etc., I did the best I could to reproduce the quality of my iTunes preset, but never quite got it there.
As I mentioned to the PM tech, I thought that Pure Music was supposed to be a sizable improvement in sonics over iTunes and not an attempt to match it (which is what he and I were trying to do together).
Because of it's audio plug-ins, I think that one could do a lot with Pure Music and get more out of it than I can, but, that person would have to have a good understanding of what each of the settings in the 17 different audio plug-ins do, and the impact of that on the other plug-in adjustments, along with what bus to put that plug-in on, etc.
Pure Music's manual doesn't explain what each plug-in and adjustment does (like expansion, head room, attack time...etc.).
I'm not a sound engineer and I don't have the time to study up on all of these aspects of playback in order to take the Pure Music playback beyond what iTunes is doing for me now.
I've since gone back and tried to adjust these various plug-ins, but none of my adjustments could match the sonic quality that I get from iTunes "acoustic" setting.
I'm using a multi-strand fiber optic cable.
I gave it a try and it's definitely not better sounding than the iTunes EQ adjustment that I'm using...
So, if someone can explain something to me that will help me adjust Pure Music to exceed what I'm hearing, I would be grateful.
Equipment:
Computer : Mac Pro 2 x 2.8 GHz Quad Core Intel Xeon
DAC: Nova
Amp: ML Noº 334
Speakers: Martin Logan Prodigy
In my initial listening tests, I found PM (compared to iTunes) to be anemic with the volume severely damped, attack and decay of drums and cymbals shortened and the sound stage all but removed. My speakers were no longer transparent and the instrumentation of music, was muted and confined to either the left or right channels.
I then tried the Amarra demo as well, with the same result and thus pointing the problem away from the software.
I called Pure Music and spoke to them to find out what could be wrong.
They were extremely helpful.
After hearing the audible differences over the phone, between iTunes and PM, their tech accessed my computer with a VNC program to check everything. It took about 20 minutes of going through the settings, before he realized (and I remembered) that I had used the iTunes equalizer "Acoustic" preset on all of my stored music along with a gain adjustment set to 70%.
(I'm not fond of computer music, but I do listen to an iPod when I'm out and about and I have found that the iTunes"Acoustic" preset opened up every genre of music, revealing the articulation of the instruments and creating a sound stage. Even on my stereo system, it's close to CD sonic quality, but still falls a bit short.)
At this point, the tech tried adjusting the PM AUgraphic EQ and got the playback similar to the sound quality of the iTunes Acoustic" preset.. The tech suggested adjusting the AUDynamics processor. Not being a sound engineer and unfamiliar with the effect and use of "expansion ratio" "attack time" adjustments etc., I did the best I could to reproduce the quality of my iTunes preset, but never quite got it there.
As I mentioned to the PM tech, I thought that Pure Music was supposed to be a sizable improvement in sonics over iTunes and not an attempt to match it (which is what he and I were trying to do together).
Because of it's audio plug-ins, I think that one could do a lot with Pure Music and get more out of it than I can, but, that person would have to have a good understanding of what each of the settings in the 17 different audio plug-ins do, and the impact of that on the other plug-in adjustments, along with what bus to put that plug-in on, etc.
Pure Music's manual doesn't explain what each plug-in and adjustment does (like expansion, head room, attack time...etc.).
I'm not a sound engineer and I don't have the time to study up on all of these aspects of playback in order to take the Pure Music playback beyond what iTunes is doing for me now.
I've since gone back and tried to adjust these various plug-ins, but none of my adjustments could match the sonic quality that I get from iTunes "acoustic" setting.
I'm using a multi-strand fiber optic cable.
I gave it a try and it's definitely not better sounding than the iTunes EQ adjustment that I'm using...
So, if someone can explain something to me that will help me adjust Pure Music to exceed what I'm hearing, I would be grateful.
Equipment:
Computer : Mac Pro 2 x 2.8 GHz Quad Core Intel Xeon
DAC: Nova
Amp: ML Noº 334
Speakers: Martin Logan Prodigy
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