audio-kraut said:
3. Learn to respect others, and you will be respected.
I know that. You know that. But still... You know, the difference between engineers and humanitarians is, engineers can estimate measurements, and can calculate impact of measured parameters on the equipment.
audio-kraut said:
It was mentioned only in passing.
The gap between 'could have' and 'was' is as vast as that between fiction and evidence. More details are required: for most.
All conjectural, for sure. Since he wasn't permitted to use his cable - the point would be moot, you however asked what the harm might be - so, I answered.
To trust an audiophile like Fremer is like trusting Uri Geller - this is only my assessment. Maybe others are of the same opinion.
cbdb said:
This exceedingly annoying comment props up often enough, so maybe i should address it.
Could the reason for audiophiles' buying pattern be that most are not complete idiots?
The cable market is so liquid that one can easily try an expensive second hand cable and sell it with a minimum loss. Or you can borrow cables from a dealer or a friend and see if they achieve what you expect. And what's the big deal if you invest a couple of grand in cables. Seems to be safer than most banks (over 40 gone belly up this year in the US alone).
Now compare this to room treatment. It is certainly not an exact science and results may vary from good to spectacularly bad. Whether you're happy with the result or not you still have to pay. What percentage of a room treatment investment can you recoup if it didn't work? 10%? What if you move?
A cable called 'SY' is a shielded power supply cable. It has a woven-braided screen and any number of cores internally. You often see this stuff on high-end cable manufacturers own 'super' cables, perhaps albeit with PC-OFC or LC-OFC conductors internally.
You can also get 'CY' which has a copper sheath. The woven braids of these type of cables cover from 60% to 90% of the outer surface of the cable itself, depending on where/which manufacturer you buy from.
Cheers
Gareth
P.S. This cable is specifically designed to reject RFI in noisy industrial environments. I am an Electrician and often install it in 'specific' contracts. Have a look at the LAPP Kabel website in Germany.
You can also get 'CY' which has a copper sheath. The woven braids of these type of cables cover from 60% to 90% of the outer surface of the cable itself, depending on where/which manufacturer you buy from.
Cheers
Gareth
P.S. This cable is specifically designed to reject RFI in noisy industrial environments. I am an Electrician and often install it in 'specific' contracts. Have a look at the LAPP Kabel website in Germany.
analog_sa said:
Can you explain the relationship between the last 2 sentences?
Surely you are not offering cable swapping as an alternative to room treatments, simply because they may be less expensive??
What cable swap will cure a 150Hz room resonance?
cliffforrest said:
Actually nothing will remove the resonance. The best you can hope for is to reduce it and not make the room worse in other respects. Extensive room treatments are too expensive, require too much work and carry no guarantees. Cable swaps otoh are almost for free and can be lots of fun. They may even improve one's enjoyment of music. It may be accidental but some of the worst sounds i've heard were reproduced inside "treated" rooms.
analog_sa said:
That seems a pointless argument to me: Room treatments are hard work and expensive so juggle cables instead! ?
It's exactly the way i see it. People want easy and immediate improvements and they like seeing a resale value. Only the most devoted will spend months working on a room.
Good point. I think all these things are important; just a matter of priority,
Let's say I want to build a professional mastering studio. The purpose of this studio is to listen to recorded music all day long and make final adjustments to the EQ, level, dynamics, and arrangement of record albums. The quality of the listening experience is very important; top goals being faithful, accurate reproduction, and low ear fatigue. The room must also be comfortable and have a broad sweet spot. What are the priorities? Here's my list:
1. Room dimensions. If this is wrong there will be too much remedial treatment needed and sound will suffer ultimately.
2. Loudspeaker location (hopefully designed-in at step 1)
3. Room surfaces. Not too much reflection, not too dead.
4. Room treatment to deal with corners and to break up surfaces
5. Loudspeaker design (make and model)
6. Loudspeaker integration into the room
7. Listening station and control console
8. Power amplifiers and crossovers for loudspeakers
9. Source gear (PMI D/A converters, etc)
10. Signal processing gear (depends on the engineer and typr of music sometimes)
11. Level structure
12. Interior colors scheme and fabrics, comfy couch and chair
13. Machine room
14. Cable routing
15. Cable construction and connectors
I probably missed a few items that would come before cable construction...
Let's say I want to build a professional mastering studio. The purpose of this studio is to listen to recorded music all day long and make final adjustments to the EQ, level, dynamics, and arrangement of record albums. The quality of the listening experience is very important; top goals being faithful, accurate reproduction, and low ear fatigue. The room must also be comfortable and have a broad sweet spot. What are the priorities? Here's my list:
1. Room dimensions. If this is wrong there will be too much remedial treatment needed and sound will suffer ultimately.
2. Loudspeaker location (hopefully designed-in at step 1)
3. Room surfaces. Not too much reflection, not too dead.
4. Room treatment to deal with corners and to break up surfaces
5. Loudspeaker design (make and model)
6. Loudspeaker integration into the room
7. Listening station and control console
8. Power amplifiers and crossovers for loudspeakers
9. Source gear (PMI D/A converters, etc)
10. Signal processing gear (depends on the engineer and typr of music sometimes)
11. Level structure
12. Interior colors scheme and fabrics, comfy couch and chair
13. Machine room
14. Cable routing
15. Cable construction and connectors
I probably missed a few items that would come before cable construction...
I'm beginning to think there must be some kind of political correctness motivated transference of suppressed racism in the direction of audiophiles on this forum. This kind of generalization is unwarranted; why don't you simply call out individuals who offend you and leave out the people you don't know or have never met? Only Johan Potgeiter's posts are written fairly enough to recognize that there are a different kinds of people who are audiophiles. Based on most of Stuart's posts as well as those of the more obnoxious members of the forum, I would say that their only experience is with audiophile wannabees.
John
jlsem said:
Hi John;
my friend who asked about a microphone cable is not an audiophile, but he could not decide which cable to buy based on contradictory information on forums, so strong were suggestions and so different opinions:
Wavebourn said:
Oh, what a precious dear you are. I speak directly in person and don't give a sod for political correctness. Whether you were my brother, best friend, or someone I have never met except as a name on a screen, I will call it how I see it. If you wish to get offended fine.jlsem said:
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