Telstar, Hi! I forgot to mention the fantastic wide range "super esoteric" Manger MSW. Obviously in MT arrangment (not MTM - never forever, no one of commercial speaker emploing it sounds good, IMHO!). The Manger isn't cheap, but you save two tweeter, it's nearly resistive, and has high efficency. If you don't have never heared it, absolutely go to an Hi-Fi shop and try.
Cheers.
Cheers.
I have but it didn't win me over, I think I'm more of a traditional paper cones/silk tweeter still.
I agree it is too large for MTM.
Hi Paolo,
I missed this because I thought you would reply in my thread.
Do you have datasheets of the discontinued PR170X0? I cant find it. Because Audax is remaking the site and all old products are listed together.
I decided that I will test 2 or 3 midrange units (as pair in MTM and mono) and resell those I like the less.
The smaller ones seem problematic to cross at 200hz and cone area is too small for my likes, but i'll try to get a 6" audax to test.
I'm pretty sure the cabinet construction will give me even more headaches than this
That's the main reason why I want to split low and HF sections in two cabinets.
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4 midrange is actually my system crossed at 200 6dB oct with 100 mF in serie, without impedence compensation. The midrange is immobile also at very high level.
About the datasheet, I have it, but you have to let me some time to find & scan it.
Anyway, the z0 is better in my opinion.
But also the PR170M0 isn't that bad, 1mm of excursion.
Bye!
About the datasheet, I have it, but you have to let me some time to find & scan it.
Anyway, the z0 is better in my opinion.
But also the PR170M0 isn't that bad, 1mm of excursion.
Bye!
excuse me i obiouvsly was intended single 4 inch mid cone with +/- 1,25 mm x max
Hi!
This is my first demonstration.
You can see the first graph is the original frequency response & phase of Sonus Faber Minima, which is very belowed and have sold 16.000 pairs. You can see easily the phase that shift of 90 degrees due to the inversion of the tweeter.
In the second graph instead you can see the frequency response of my "clone" of the Minima, the phase is on the 0 degrees, due to the 6db/oct crossover with driveunits in right polarity. I think it's very explicative.
On the listen, the second version is much better in imaging, presence and the timbre is much more natural. The second speakers is clearly derived by first original, but it's much better in every parameters.
I hope you find this interesting.
Bye!
This is my first demonstration.
You can see the first graph is the original frequency response & phase of Sonus Faber Minima, which is very belowed and have sold 16.000 pairs. You can see easily the phase that shift of 90 degrees due to the inversion of the tweeter.
In the second graph instead you can see the frequency response of my "clone" of the Minima, the phase is on the 0 degrees, due to the 6db/oct crossover with driveunits in right polarity. I think it's very explicative.
On the listen, the second version is much better in imaging, presence and the timbre is much more natural. The second speakers is clearly derived by first original, but it's much better in every parameters.
I hope you find this interesting.
Bye!
Your second example has some typical 1st order issues. It has over 2 Octaves of overlap and 90 degree phase shift between the sections. The response is quite good at the measured (simulated?) axis but any up or down movement will strongly degrade the response over a wide frequency range. Both peaks and response holes will come into effect at any position higher or lower than the measurement position.
Overall response at that point is nice, in fact better than the first example. If you situate your speakers exactly and never move then it may be a much better speaker for you than the first. Otherwise....
Overall response at that point is nice, in fact better than the first example. If you situate your speakers exactly and never move then it may be a much better speaker for you than the first. Otherwise....
Yes, you are right. The artifact below 200Hz is due to the incorrect graphics simulation of the woofer.
110 out of phase is correct, but it is slightly worse of 90 but works perfectly.
Yes, you are right. But IMHO 2 octaves of overlap is the mild blend of the two drivers. Yes the respose is simulated but with measured data.
And yes, finally, if you move in the vertical axis the notch come in. But the ears says nothing.
Bye!
Fair enough, but the vertical polar response around 3-6kHz must look something like this red line I've crudely sketched. If you brought the woofer forward a bit and re-did the crossover, maybe you could get much closer to ideal 1st order behavior, or maybe even redesigning with a tilt would be enough... you need what, 2.5-3cm shift or so I think.
Attachments
"EL CHEAPO", 98 dB speaker ,28- 20.000 hz, 4 way, no horns
hi guys,
I have simulated with big precision a super tower ( 150 litres) 6 db /oct ( excluded wf that is second order at 150 hz L2) ,4 way wf 15 " RCF L15P200AK B6 N15 Thiele 120 litres FB=Fa=28 Hz Q=2, midbass 8" Beyma 8 M100 up to 400 Hz, midhigh 5" B&C up to 2600 hz , high ribbon HI-VI RT2 PRO.
someone is interested to see graphs and drawing? : cool:
cheers
inertial
hi guys,
I have simulated with big precision a super tower ( 150 litres) 6 db /oct ( excluded wf that is second order at 150 hz L2) ,4 way wf 15 " RCF L15P200AK B6 N15 Thiele 120 litres FB=Fa=28 Hz Q=2, midbass 8" Beyma 8 M100 up to 400 Hz, midhigh 5" B&C up to 2600 hz , high ribbon HI-VI RT2 PRO.
someone is interested to see graphs and drawing?
: cool:cheers
inertial
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:Oh yes.
Cabinet is 120 liters, MDF 30mm, reinforced internally.
Lower mid is a closed box by 20 liters, and the tweeter sit on it.
Any comment will be much appreciated.
Obviously this is only a simulation but the data is imported from anechoic chamber RCF and it is very precise. I expect big sound with a little tube amp with 4W.
Cheers.
Cabinet is 120 liters, MDF 30mm, reinforced internally.
Lower mid is a closed box by 20 liters, and the tweeter sit on it.
Any comment will be much appreciated.
Obviously this is only a simulation but the data is imported from anechoic chamber RCF and it is very precise. I expect big sound with a little tube amp with 4W.
Cheers.
NEWS
Hi,
A little speaker factory ( canada) have express interest and make me congratulations for my job showed.
Now majbe we will have business..
thanks DIYAUDIO!!!
P.S.: I have upgradated 6 dB / octave perfect phase response, different commercial speakers like thiel 3.5, sonus faber Minima,Minima Amator,Guarnieri,Extrema and mutch others.
ALWAYS IMHO excellent result with a few buks...;-)
If someone of you is interested for his speakers or anything models, i can make simulations and post it here.
Thanks for reading
Paolo ,Venezia ITALY
Hi,
A little speaker factory ( canada) have express interest and make me congratulations for my job showed.
Now majbe we will have business..
thanks DIYAUDIO!!!
P.S.: I have upgradated 6 dB / octave perfect phase response, different commercial speakers like thiel 3.5, sonus faber Minima,Minima Amator,Guarnieri,Extrema and mutch others.
ALWAYS IMHO excellent result with a few buks...;-)
If someone of you is interested for his speakers or anything models, i can make simulations and post it here.
Thanks for reading
Paolo ,Venezia ITALY
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