Oooohh! I been looking forward to this - definitly will be bookmarked.
I'm both lazy and incompetent when it comes to producing a first class finish - hopefully this will at least address the incompetency here. 😀
I'm both lazy and incompetent when it comes to producing a first class finish - hopefully this will at least address the incompetency here. 😀
ScottG said:
🙂
I'm thinking that I should have probably started a new thread since its hidden in this thread really. I think I'll duplicate the info over into a new thread where folks will more easily find the info.
My idea of a finished cabinet is to scrape the excess glue off the MDF 😉
If you're going for a single large box why not go back to a Volt?
If you're going for a single large box why not go back to a Volt?
BlackCatSound said:
I like it.Scott suggests that part of the problem is the distortion around Fs. He proposes to move this out of the operating range of the sub by careful driver selection. The Volt with its 29hz Fs doesn't meet that requirement unfortunately, is that right Scott?
Its only one of many Volts. I should try something with the 3823 I've got here before it goes back into the PA cab.
Reasonance is a problem, no-one in their right mind would use a tweet near its reasonance point.
Do you still have the R3863s?
Reasonance is a problem, no-one in their right mind would use a tweet near its reasonance point.
Do you still have the R3863s?
ShinOBIWAN said:
Scott suggests that part of the problem is the distortion around Fs. He proposes to move this out of the operating range of the sub by careful driver selection. The Volt with its 29hz Fs doesn't meet that requirement unfortunately, is that right Scott?
indeed. (..excepting of course that with a smaller cabinet you can push the in-box resonance up - at the expense of spl lower in freq.)
..there are other problems with volt drivers though.. power handeling (despite their inverted frame series) isn't that good. x-max for all but a few is low in comparison to eff.. (..yeah, I looked them over.) They have an 18 inch that is fairly nice, but were talking about a much larger enclosure (and there are a few Fane driver's I'd select before it).
ScottG said:
Scott, you've got to hear these Volts though, pant wettingly good and a real shame that they only reach to 30hz inroom. Some of the most dynamic bass I've heard yet when in a ported enclosure.
Like you've said, they need huge enclosures too otherwise you lose what makes them sound good and the extension is lessened even further.
You'd be surprised at how much power handling they have, I've heard a story from Tom and Bill about how they ran them on a few occasions with 100's of watts at stupid SPL's for hours at a gig and they just sucked it up, well one had the VC deform by the sounds of it but they can stand a lot of punishment. They also said the radial chassis was cooking too.
I do agree that they aren't suited to your sub idea though.
BlackCatSound said:
🙂
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Out of what I've tried so far these are the only ones to not be sold within a couple of months 😉 They're the best I've had yet so I'll be keeping them as a backup.
Should Scotts suggestion for a sub prove to be even better than I plan to use them in my next project.
ShinOBIWAN said:
I'm betting that the dual B&C's would be better still.. (just a guess though based on Bl and past experience).
These are the drivers I'd *REALLY* like to have (..several of them naturally).😀
http://www.tonianlabs.com/aer studiobass.htm
(not to different from GOTO drivers with a more extended response)
ScottG said:
I'm hoping so too.
TBH I'll be happy if they do what the Volts do but extend more.
Those AER look a bit fugly and why do you always pick *the* most obscure products? 😀
ShinOBIWAN said:
Oh, but lordy.. look at the field strength of magnet. Thats a whole 'nuther kind a pretty. (..thinking about the enclosure volume though is whole 'nuther kinda ugly.) 😀
hmm, something like a holy grail quest methinks.. (it is "nutty" behaviour.)
btw, where are the TS's on the 3863? (..searched their site and didn't find that particular model.) - might as well model it to see whats up..
Forgot to mention:
I've ordered the four BC 12TBX100 Scott.
I looked around and BlueAran was the cheapest and virtually only dealer I could find in the UK. £179 each unfortunately, I tried to wrangle a quantity purchase discount but Bluearan don't do this.
I'm not willing to ship from the states as postage is horrendous and I'll get hit for 17.5% + 4.5% VAT and import charges, in the end it looked like it was going to cost a little more!
Should be with me middle of next week if all goes well.
I'm working up a cabinet design right now and will post once I've got it finished. You can then suggestion changes, addition or whatever.
Ant
I've ordered the four BC 12TBX100 Scott.
I looked around and BlueAran was the cheapest and virtually only dealer I could find in the UK. £179 each unfortunately, I tried to wrangle a quantity purchase discount but Bluearan don't do this.
I'm not willing to ship from the states as postage is horrendous and I'll get hit for 17.5% + 4.5% VAT and import charges, in the end it looked like it was going to cost a little more!
Should be with me middle of next week if all goes well.
I'm working up a cabinet design right now and will post once I've got it finished. You can then suggestion changes, addition or whatever.
Ant
ShinOBIWAN said:
Sounds good to me. Keep your fingers crossed and remember that you'll need about 200-300 hours on the things before the suspension will loosen up enough to give you the extension as modeled (..or at least I've found that to be the case with most pro woofers). If after that point they don't provide values that are very close to what is advertised send the suckers back for a full return and make them pay postage.
ScottG said:
Sounds good to me. Keep your fingers crossed and remember that you'll need about 200-300 hours on the things before the suspension will loosen up enough to give you the extension as modeled (..or at least I've found that to be the case with most pro woofers). If after that point they don't provide values that are very close to what is advertised send the suckers back for a full return and make them pay postage.
Scott, my god man you need to be a rock when I just spent over £700 on woofers! They WILL give me everything I desire and more is the motto from now on 😀
ShinOBIWAN said:
NOT fair! 😀 .. that is your midrange you are talking about, correct?
You know BMS Pro has some astonishing technology in that "department" and unlike everyone else they are not charging the proverbial "arm and leg".
ScottG said:
Hehe!! someones never used Volts 😉
Power handling: double the quoted figures and you're in the right ball park. I've run the nuts of the R3823s in my PA rig without damage. At the end of the night the grille on the cab is too hot to touch and the whole cab itself is warm. The only time I've damaged a volt is by messing around with the clip limit on an amp and asymetrically clipping it into a pair of them, bent the voice coils against the backplate. Didn't stop them working but they scratched a bit.
X-max: the quoted figure is for the truly linear portion. x-mech is about 20mm each way for the 15". They will move until the cone hits the heatsink.
The new radial basket looks a bit better than the old one, for some odd reason the old baskets only had M5 holes!?
Its a bit odd they've never ventured into the sub 30Hz region. I'd like to know the specs of the 12" radial PMC use.
I've heard a few B&C drivers and they are very good. (I just can't get a good price) Their 18"ers have some grunt to them.
ShinOBIWAN said:
..and so it SHALL BE!
You SHALL have bass capable of disemboweling - relatives, friends, neighbors, and/or any poor b@stard willing to near your home within a 5 mile radius.
(ok.. that might have been overkill.) 😀
ShinOBIWAN said:
Andy being a tightwad again 😉 Don't worry, he won't even give ME a discount and I've known him since uni.
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