OPA1622 PCB trace inductance causes gain margin issues

1702218564970_adobe.jpg
The output trace length, including the relay, is almost 65mm, the trace width is 0.8mm, and the relay contributes 20mm :cry:
 
Just a minute - you have built this, and it works fine. So why are you worried? Just a dose of audio paranoia?
TI's official documents use TINA TI simulation extensively for verification. However, as mentioned earlier, there are problems with TINA TI simulations. Although the actual build works fine, it can be a bit unstable. I found the sound a bit harsh.
However, there seem to be some problems with the simulation model of TI OPA1622. Since I don't have a company email, I can't give feedback on the TI official forum. I have sent a message to johnc124, but he has not responded yet.
 
Use square wave input to see the phase margin of your circuit from the spike hight of the output. If you think the harshness is a matter of stability, apply 20khz input filter and listen, if still harsh, stability is innocent.
1 inch trace is 7.5nH if single trace. If ground traces in parallel, it gets halved.
The positive input must have a grounding capacitor of >100pF.
 

Attachments

  • without.JPG
    without.JPG
    52.8 KB · Views: 23
  • with 220p.JPG
    with 220p.JPG
    53.6 KB · Views: 24
Last edited:
Use square wave input to see the phase margin of your circuit from the spike hight of the output. If you think the harshness is a matter of stability, apply 20khz input filter and listen, if still harsh, stability is innocent.
1 inch trace is 7.5nH if single trace. If ground traces in parallel, it gets halved.
The positive input must have a grounding capacitor of >100pF.
I checked some information and it is correct that 1mm wire is about 1nh. If there is a ground layer under the wire, it should indeed be smaller.
The input is a multi-order filter with fp=20k~22khz. The stability comes from the OPA1622's own loop and has nothing to do with the input.
 
Use square wave input to see the phase margin of your circuit from the spike hight of the output. If you think the harshness is a matter of stability, apply 20khz input filter and listen, if still harsh, stability is innocent.
1 inch trace is 7.5nH if single trace. If ground traces in parallel, it gets halved.
The positive input must have a grounding capacitor of >100pF.
The inductance generated by the relay is the largest, the combined length of the two contacts is close to 2cm, and there is no ground around it.
 

https://resources.system-analysis.c...is-there-a-pcb-trace-inductance-rule-of-thumb
It is important as I show, to ground the input with a capacitor.
If the opamp is not oscillating, the input signal controls the behavior. This opamp has 10Mhz loop frequency, it can never get excited by the 20khz signal.
You can bypass the relay with a RC snubber to shunt the inductance.
You can also add a few ohms resistor just at the opamp output.
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot_20231211_103647_Chrome.jpg
    Screenshot_20231211_103647_Chrome.jpg
    150.6 KB · Views: 21