Nappylady said:
Hey NappyLady, just to update you on the kittie, her she is listening to the stereo whilst playing Jimmy Buffett's Banana Wind cd at a pretty good level.
She appears to prefer listening in the "near-field"!! 😀
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Look at her.... She looks so happy, doesn't she?!!😉
Just wanted to share a few things with everyone......
After some serious breaking-in and listening, I must say that these are probably the best sounding subs I have ever had the pleasure of listening to.
Everything I throw at them, they just take it and reproduce the most satisfying, full, natural bass I ever heard. It's just like actually being there.
They blend perfectly with my Maggies, never bottom out or distort, never get boomy or overpowering, and by no means do they ever draw attention to themselves.
And with movies, WOW! I watched "The Lord of the Rings", "Harry Potter", both of them, and "Star Trek - Nemesis". These dipoles play everything with ease and with plenty of oomph!
I can't ever see myself going back to any kind of monopole subwoofer ever. These things are just to darn good.
I highly suggest anyone who is interested in building dipole subs, and not worried about how big they are, and want them to play everything all the way down, if not lower than 20Hz, buy four of these 15" Pyles and you will not be dissapointed!
You will not need a monopole sub to help these babies out at all!!!! 😀
After some serious breaking-in and listening, I must say that these are probably the best sounding subs I have ever had the pleasure of listening to.
Everything I throw at them, they just take it and reproduce the most satisfying, full, natural bass I ever heard. It's just like actually being there.
They blend perfectly with my Maggies, never bottom out or distort, never get boomy or overpowering, and by no means do they ever draw attention to themselves.
And with movies, WOW! I watched "The Lord of the Rings", "Harry Potter", both of them, and "Star Trek - Nemesis". These dipoles play everything with ease and with plenty of oomph!
I can't ever see myself going back to any kind of monopole subwoofer ever. These things are just to darn good.
I highly suggest anyone who is interested in building dipole subs, and not worried about how big they are, and want them to play everything all the way down, if not lower than 20Hz, buy four of these 15" Pyles and you will not be dissapointed!
You will not need a monopole sub to help these babies out at all!!!! 😀
hey chops just wanted to say congrats on the subs...they really seem to have worked out for you...im gonna be building the same setup in a week when i get back to the states and ill keep you updated on my project...i think im gonna use a raven/phl combo for 100hz and up though...are you going to do anything to clean these up aesthetically??? i'd like to see some grills on both sides of the dipoles...i think they could look really nice...congrats once again
dipoles to the rescue
dipoles to the rescue
If these are the drivers you're talking about, PHL Audio, then I'm not sure if those will be good for dipoles. Eventhough they are extremely well built drivers, I noticed that their "Fs" is high and their "Qts" is low. This is the exact opposite of what you want to look for in a dipole driver, unless you plan on using lots of eq-ing. 
sorry i think you misinterpreted my post...if you check out the fullrange IB with dipole sub thread i started its described in there...i will be using the same dipole sub setup...but more or less an infinite box or aperiodic enclosure for the upper mid bass and on i.e. 100hz and up...i found a design on espeakers that i think would mate perfectly with the efficiency but now im not sure the raven is the tweeter for me...check this out and disregard the focal woofer...
http://speakercity.com/GRProject/PhlRevProject.shtml
however i might not use their x-over network exactly as a series x-over will provide me with a bit of impedance compensation...i might just use a .9 or .8 zeta
http://speakercity.com/GRProject/PhlRevProject.shtml
however i might not use their x-over network exactly as a series x-over will provide me with a bit of impedance compensation...i might just use a .9 or .8 zeta
I just read this whole thread and wanted to make a comment on OB's. I have been listening to OB's for about three months now and have never had a better sound in my home. I'm just using flat baffles that are 2.5 feet by 3 feet in size. The main driver in each is an EV LS12 fullrange with a piezo, the subs are some woofers I had lying around, which I surrounded the fullrange driver with. The subs are powered by their own ss amp (HK Citation 16). The EV's are powered be vintage tubes. Crossover is a passive between the tube amps speaker output and the ss amp. I have a graphic eg on the subs to boost levels from 50 Hz down and cut all higher levels, resulting in a steeper crossover slope.
The reason I'm commenting is to confirm the wonderful bass you can get with open baffle. Mine are strong and clean down to 30 Hz. I have measured them several times to be sure. Listening in the mid 90's dB range is a real treat with these. Also, the cones don't move much. Each baffle has a 12 inch and two 10 inch woofers. I hope to put matching 12's in them soon.
Pics here.
http://www.geocities.com/the_hurdy_gurdyman/
Click on Hi-Fi
The pics show my old 10 inch Jensens instead of my newer 12 inch EV's. I haven't posted new pics yet. Also have new grills. Look kinda like a pair of origional quads in the corner with the grills on. 😎
OB bass is great, as is the must be heard to believe mids.
Dave
The reason I'm commenting is to confirm the wonderful bass you can get with open baffle. Mine are strong and clean down to 30 Hz. I have measured them several times to be sure. Listening in the mid 90's dB range is a real treat with these. Also, the cones don't move much. Each baffle has a 12 inch and two 10 inch woofers. I hope to put matching 12's in them soon.
Pics here.
http://www.geocities.com/the_hurdy_gurdyman/
Click on Hi-Fi
The pics show my old 10 inch Jensens instead of my newer 12 inch EV's. I haven't posted new pics yet. Also have new grills. Look kinda like a pair of origional quads in the corner with the grills on. 😎
OB bass is great, as is the must be heard to believe mids.
Dave
I know exactly what you mean. I still can not believe the bass I am getting out of my dipoles. And they sure as heck do not roll off around 40Hz like everyone says. If anything, they start rolling off at 20Hz or below, and I am not exaggerating.
Hurdy, I noticed that old Bell 2420 integrated of yours. My parents have an old pair of Bell bookshelf speakers of the same vintage. Before now, those were the only things I have ever seen from that company! Anyway, I just thought that was kinda neat. 😉
Hurdy, I noticed that old Bell 2420 integrated of yours. My parents have an old pair of Bell bookshelf speakers of the same vintage. Before now, those were the only things I have ever seen from that company! Anyway, I just thought that was kinda neat. 😉
Yeah, that Bell amp is cool. Very clean mids and highs. Best I've had so far. I've never seen any Bell speakers before.
Dave🙂
Dave🙂
Passive RC eq
Ive been researching the Phoenix/Orion speakers and then came upon this discussion and it prompted me into action. Im going to build a small dipole speaker that uses 2 Pioneer 10" woofers ($6 ea.@PE) and a fostex 103 or 85 fullrange. I realize the woofers will have limited SPL but I want a taste of all dipole before spending big $$$. I would like to use the below passive RC eq/xo that S. Linkwitz shows to use w/ 12" drivers but I would like to raise the xo point from 100 to 140 or higher. I have no idea what components do what or which to change. Anyone using this setup or know which components relate to the xo point?
thx amt
Ive been researching the Phoenix/Orion speakers and then came upon this discussion and it prompted me into action. Im going to build a small dipole speaker that uses 2 Pioneer 10" woofers ($6 ea.@PE) and a fostex 103 or 85 fullrange. I realize the woofers will have limited SPL but I want a taste of all dipole before spending big $$$. I would like to use the below passive RC eq/xo that S. Linkwitz shows to use w/ 12" drivers but I would like to raise the xo point from 100 to 140 or higher. I have no idea what components do what or which to change. Anyone using this setup or know which components relate to the xo point?
thx amt
Attachments
I recommend you just go to diysubwoofer.org to get Brian's dipole.xls spreadsheet.
Just punch in your driver parameters and baffle size into that, and then play with xover point and order to fine tune your response. It'll plot your reponse for you as you play with the parameters.
Then just find some PLLXO design equations, like at t-linespeakers.org, and you're all set.
Just punch in your driver parameters and baffle size into that, and then play with xover point and order to fine tune your response. It'll plot your reponse for you as you play with the parameters.
Then just find some PLLXO design equations, like at t-linespeakers.org, and you're all set.
Very interesting thread...
I have a pair of Magnepan MMG's and right now I have a sonotube sub that I'm using. Since I love the sound of the Maggies so much I wanted to try and build some Dipole subs. The maggies put out bass, but due to extremem excursion limitations, they don't put out alot of bass.
So I thought I would accent them with maybe 4 12" drivers, probably Dayton 295-320's. Heres the link
I figured they kinda went along the lines of what you need in a dipole. I however want to use a different "box" than you guys are. I want to just use a 14"x50" baffle....something similar to my maggies. Theoretically the speaker should produce the same response that is listed on PE's website, since it would essentially be an open baffle. I know the sensitivity will decrease due to no enclosure, but having 4 should compensate for that. Does this sound like a good idea?? I mean something that behaves like my maggies for about $130 total....I already have a plate amp to use with these.
Also I like the legs you have on your maggies...allows them to be upright and secure. Mine just have those little L shaped legs. Had an unfortonate accident with a cat 1 month after I first got them...which led to me sending back to factory for a good 2 months after I had just waited 3 months to get the freegin things!
I have a pair of Magnepan MMG's and right now I have a sonotube sub that I'm using. Since I love the sound of the Maggies so much I wanted to try and build some Dipole subs. The maggies put out bass, but due to extremem excursion limitations, they don't put out alot of bass.
So I thought I would accent them with maybe 4 12" drivers, probably Dayton 295-320's. Heres the link
I figured they kinda went along the lines of what you need in a dipole. I however want to use a different "box" than you guys are. I want to just use a 14"x50" baffle....something similar to my maggies. Theoretically the speaker should produce the same response that is listed on PE's website, since it would essentially be an open baffle. I know the sensitivity will decrease due to no enclosure, but having 4 should compensate for that. Does this sound like a good idea?? I mean something that behaves like my maggies for about $130 total....I already have a plate amp to use with these.
Also I like the legs you have on your maggies...allows them to be upright and secure. Mine just have those little L shaped legs. Had an unfortonate accident with a cat 1 month after I first got them...which led to me sending back to factory for a good 2 months after I had just waited 3 months to get the freegin things!
I would also recommend that you simulate 1st with the spreadsheet. It's free.
At 14" wide, your baffle is doing so little that even the output out of 4 drivers summed might surprise you in a bad way.
Leadbelly, Thanks for the advise but I wasnt able to figure out how the spreadsheet actually calculates the circuit. It gives me a Fequal that is apparantly the freq were the eq is applied but I have no clue as to what that is suppose to be. I saw nothing that allows for a xo point or graphing of the response. On the T-line site, the circuit for the xo is shown but adding in "eq" boost is not an option/ discussed. Am I missing something. I would use Mr. Linkwitz's formulas if I were far more mathmatically addept.
amt
amt
With a 14 inch wide baffle, your response will start rolling off at 6dB an octave from about 330Hz down. This would mean it is down 24dB at 20 Hz (4 octaves) so you would need EQ, drivers and amps capable of applying 24 dB to avoid this.
Mind you, this is a worst case scenario, as the crossover chosen and the efficiency of the drivers will affect the amplifier needs.
An H-Frame folded baffle 14 wide by 14 deep would approximately half the EQ required.
Steve
Mind you, this is a worst case scenario, as the crossover chosen and the efficiency of the drivers will affect the amplifier needs.
An H-Frame folded baffle 14 wide by 14 deep would approximately half the EQ required.
Steve
Hi Dave,
Will you please elaborate a bit more on the passive Xover feeding the woofers amp ?
The reason for asking is that I am a recent dipole converted, using Supravox fullrangers in open baffle 65X90 cmts, and I have bought four cheap PA 15" locally available for the bass, arriving hopefully this week.
Also, what is the grafic EQ that you use ?
TIA
Miguel
Will you please elaborate a bit more on the passive Xover feeding the woofers amp ?
The reason for asking is that I am a recent dipole converted, using Supravox fullrangers in open baffle 65X90 cmts, and I have bought four cheap PA 15" locally available for the bass, arriving hopefully this week.
Also, what is the grafic EQ that you use ?
TIA
Miguel
No, you certainly understand the the material as such. What I am saying is tweak the reponse of the dipole in the spreadsheet using ONLY the low pass filter. See how nice you can get the sub response, and at what point the LP point works out to to get a smooth response from the sub. If your FE103 can handle that as its HP point, you don't need the EQ, and you'll have less signal loss in the passive circuit.
In the example you posted, the "EQ" is a 1st order PLLXO and the "LP" is a 3rd order PLLXO, each with a different crossover point, and the two are in series.
I know there have been a few people throughout this thread that said they were going to build some type of dipoles becuase of their "sparked-up interest" from me doing mine.
I was just wondering if any of those projects have materialized, and if so, do you have any pictures to share?
I just hink it would be neat to see what others have done and what they have discovered on the way. 🙂
I was just wondering if any of those projects have materialized, and if so, do you have any pictures to share?
I just hink it would be neat to see what others have done and what they have discovered on the way. 🙂
Aye!!
As a result of this thread, I tried my hand at dipoles. The result is found here:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17103&highlight=dipoles
Cheers!
As a result of this thread, I tried my hand at dipoles. The result is found here:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17103&highlight=dipoles
Cheers!
- Status
- Not open for further replies.