Measurements: When, What, How, Why

[micorona]

Snell RCS 1000

I did see it and corresponded with him on it. It falls into the class of DSP EQ that equalizes the steady state response to a target room curve.

This is a totally unreliable approach. If his listeners liked the end results it means, in my oppinion, that he got lucky on the d.i. curve of the sytem being equalized. All the papers that I have read on the subject strongly suggest that you'll want to EQ the early sound to flat and let the late sound fall where it may. Equalizing to a room curve can't guarantee that. I have considerable first hand experience with this with the Snell RCS 1000 (predecessor to the Tact), and the Audesey. You find that the technicians doing it are constantly changing the room target curve to get a good result.

Along similar lines are the cinema X curve which has changed over time and now has a different target for rooms of every size (clearly a moving target).

Finally, the room response being equalized isn't the system power response but some blend between the direct response, power response, and room absorption curve. His results show that, of 4 systems tried with 2 clearly performing poorly, the Harman unit was prefered. I don't think this proves that equalizing power response is correct..

David

Hello, I see your message in this forum. I'm new here.
Can you help me to solve some doubts?

Can I know what do you think today about the "old" Snell RCS 1000 ?
What is the value today?
It's a valid dsp processor today or it's too old?
What are the real performance?
It's better in quality sound, the RCS 1000 or the Marantz Audyssey?

Can I know what Windows software can be used today with RCS 1000?
Where I can find this software? It's available today?
I have 4 Snell D (2 fronts and 2 surrounds), 1 Snell CC1 (center), a lot of Snell M pairs (for other possible surrounds) and a 2 Snell EIII (great little speakers).
I have also a SNELL RCS 1000 never used and a Marantz SR6007 dsp amplifier.

Thank you in advance for your help.

 

[speaker dave]

Hi micorona,

The RCS1000 was designed for us by Radimir Bosovitch, who went on to design all the Tact products. It was well implemented using the best Motorola DSP chips of that time. I worked with "Boz" to develop the programing interface. If you have a unit you will need to find the software somewhere otherwise it is just an expensive paper weight. Unfortunately I don't have a copy of it and don't really know where to find one (try the Snell websites or even David Logvin ex of Snell).

The unit was as good as any other but still relies on steady state curves, which I think is not the best approach. I installed many of the units (I'm sure we sold well under 100) and it wasn't as automatic as advertised. You always needed to do some listening and final curve bending by ear.

Today you can do as well with mini DSP units or Berringer unit. I have played with Audesey units and was not impressed with the early units or their AV receiver implementation. They also have made fraudulent claims such as their unit reduces response variation from seat to seat, which it clearly can't.

David S

 

[micorona]

Thank you very much for your help David.
Anyway I see that construction quality is fantastic.
Snell RCS 1000 is assembled like a tank, and it have a full metal remote control too!
It's old but it has a certain charm.. It will be (or it is now?) a beautiful vintage piece.

I would to test it really but I need the right software.
I had contact with David Logvin in the past, but now Snell Acoustics is closed.
If you can help me to find this software I will be grateful!
Can you tell me the name of this software? So I will try to search it.

I never tested RCS 1000 but I think that it was a very special highend dsp.
Today technology is better, sure, but I think that the passion of projects is not always better, you know (Audyssey).
So, my target is to use RCS 1000 with my 4 Snell D speakers and a CC1 (center) and in future, one Snell subwoofer. I know that this dsp is made by the passion so the result will be special anyway, I know.

Please help me to go back in time and revisit the sound image that it's able to recreate.
Congratulations, you have created a piece of history of hifi, sure.

Thanks,
Michele

 

[markus76]

Hi micorona,

The RCS1000 was designed for us by Radimir Bosovitch, who went on to design all the Tact products. It was well implemented using the best Motorola DSP chips of that time. I worked with "Boz" to develop the programing interface. If you have a unit you will need to find the software somewhere otherwise it is just an expensive paper weight. Unfortunately I don't have a copy of it and don't really know where to find one (try the Snell websites or even David Logvin ex of Snell).

I've heard Boz is now in the lighting business

The unit was as good as any other but still relies on steady state curves, which I think is not the best approach. I installed many of the units (I'm sure we sold well under 100) and it wasn't as automatic as advertised. You always needed to do some listening and final curve bending by ear.

So what is your take on doing it?

Today you can do as well with mini DSP units or Berringer unit. I have played with Audesey units and was not impressed with the early units or their AV receiver implementation. They also have made fraudulent claims such as their unit reduces response variation from seat to seat, which it clearly can't.

David S

I think Audyssey never actually claimed that they can reduce seat to seat differences. That was probably just what consumers made of their marketing material and Audyssey didn't try to correct for that (so to speak). They claimed that MultEQ could reduce variance from a specific target curve which is correct.

 

[speaker dave]

I've heard Boz is now in the lighting business

I haven't talked to him in a couple of years. I think he was levereged out of Tact by Peter Lyngdorf, but I thought he started another room correction company.

I think Audyssey never actually claimed that they can reduce seat to seat differences. That was probably just what consumers made of their marketing material and Audyssey didn't try to correct for that (so to speak). They claimed that MultEQ could reduce variance from a specific target curve which is correct.

No, they were very specific about that claim. I debated it with the technical director and he was adamant. EQ applied to a channel will effect that speaker throughout the room but he claimed they could reduce seat to seat variations. I showed them curves of a well equalized system. You can have a nicely flat response averaged across an area but the individual variation remains exactly the same.

A triumph of marketing over science.

 

[markus76]

^
That's what I've found too. Seat to seat differences are the same before/after running Audyssey XT32:
Minimizing seat-to-seat variance with two subwoofers

 

[micorona]

Dear Markus76, can you help me to find the SNELL RCS 1000 DSP Pc Software?
I would to test this dsp... to know the real audio performances.
Please let me know some good news!

Mic