Err, kinda like it's pictured?getafix said:
I'm not sure I understand, but it's probably just the lighting. This was just a draft idea to see if a transparent open design case would have any appeal (but the lack of comments makes me think I'm the only one that likes itpurplepeople said:
) It may require one flat side to mount everything, but I would like to avoid that if possible...
Well, if you are the only one that likes it, build it anyway I quite like it but don't think the curves do it any favours.
An idea I have been thinking about may interest you: some people like to fill their cases with resin to try and isolate all their components from external vibrations. How about if you were to make a box, put your amp components in, fill it with resin and then take away the box? You would just have a block of resin with an amp inside and you could also cast those big spike feet into the corners.
Unless you build everything into a (preferably metal) box to show on this forum all you get are funny looks anyway
I quite like it but don't think the curves do it any favours. An idea I have been thinking about may interest you: some people like to fill their cases with resin to try and isolate all their components from external vibrations. How about if you were to make a box, put your amp components in, fill it with resin and then take away the box? You would just have a block of resin with an amp inside and you could also cast those big spike feet into the corners.
Unless you build everything into a (preferably metal) box to show on this forum all you get are funny looks anyway
That would make tweaking a bit difficult wouldn't it Ropie?
Vikash, I like your design and if you have the materials I would say go ahead and build it (and then a matching CD player/transport).
I have often wondered if these plastic type materials attract static but my GC monoblocks don't seem to have a problem and Pedja built that nice circular GC case out of acrylic and didn't report any problems either.
??????
I have to disagree. The goal for a guitar & an amp (or speaker) are very different. The box for a guitar needs to resonate & this motion will color the sound and give the instrument its own sound. Once the sound of the guitar has been recorded, you really don't want to change it--just amplify it. (Unless you like tube amps ) The goal is to accurately reproduce the recorded signal not to change the signal.
I don't know why your lead amp failed, but it was not because the box would not vibrate!
Cheers,
Bret Morrow
Nuuk said:
Would you make a guitar or violin out of lead? Think of a piece of hi-fi like a musical instrument and you won't go far wrong.
I once used large amounts of lead to dampen an amp case and every bit of 'life' went from the music. It was awful.
I have to disagree. The goal for a guitar & an amp (or speaker) are very different. The box for a guitar needs to resonate & this motion will color the sound and give the instrument its own sound. Once the sound of the guitar has been recorded, you really don't want to change it--just amplify it. (Unless you like tube amps
) The goal is to accurately reproduce the recorded signal not to change the signal.I don't know why your lead amp failed, but it was not because the box would not vibrate!
Cheers,
Bret Morrow
Vikash said:I'm not sure I understand, but it's probably just the lighting. This was just a draft idea to see if a transparent open design case would have any appeal (but the lack of comments makes me think I'm the only one that likes it
I like the shape. From the drawing it seems that there are no sides, just a top and bottom. Or... will you put at least a front panel so that the controls can be mounted to something? If you do, will the curve pose a problem for mounting switches or pots?
ensen.
Huh?Ropie said:BTW, we are still at the current address for a couple more weeks so post away!
Those amps look really nice. I quite like the idea of an upright amp too, but I'll start simpleJamh said:
Expressed tactfully as usual Bill.Bill Fitzpatrick said:
Yes, there is only a top and bottom. I was initially thinking about mounting terminals etc. on the top, but we'll see. I'm waiting for the pcb's and then I'll come up with a more serious design once I've got a working amp on mdf. I think I need to find a tidy layout that's ok to show through transparent material first...purplepeople said:
Nothing in audio is simple. Certainly not if you posess even minimal hearing.
What is simple is that large amounts of lead will increase the mass and lower the resonant frequency making it much more difficult to control vibrations.
Less obvious is that the increased damping of lead is often robbing music of all life. There are different (admittedly not very convincing) theories why excessive damping is bad for sound but my (and others) listening experience points it is. Whether it is applied to room acoustics or equipment construction/support there is a certain maximum damping which should not be exceeded.
Nuuk said:
Would you make a guitar or violin out of lead? Think of a piece of hi-fi like a musical instrument and you won't go far wrong.
I once used large amounts of lead to dampen an amp case and every bit of 'life' went from the music. It was awful.
This is an interesting point. A hifi is a musical instrument, rather than scientific apparatus. I have always found that scientifically precise mics sound a bit funny (B&Ks matched pairs in particular) When recording drums, you have to mess around with the recording to put back 'body' where the recording process has lost some of the sound. You have to compress it, distort it, EQ it, you name it to get it to sound like the impression you got in the room with the drummer whacking the kit. This is not scientific, it's like art dude! A good hifi messes around with the sound but in a good way. A bad hifi (think Sony mini system with triple megabass and plastic/cardboard speaker boxes) messes around with the sound in a bad way. And after all recorded sound is an object not a sound. There is no accurate point of reference. CDs don't sound like anything unless you put em in a player. Ruark Solstice speakers don't have an especially flat frequency response, and they're not that accurate. By Reference Monitor standards they're a bit crap. But they sound huge, fat and detailed. I love it. The sound is absolutely beatiful. They are a superb musical instrument. It's the same with Tannoy Monitor Golds, by modern standards they aren't very accurate. But again they sound absolutely superb. (but both of these speakers compared to the horrid little sonys are super super accurate)
A good analogy is photography. If you look at the real world, you see something, an image limited only by the dynamic/colour range of your eyes. A photograph has much less dynamic range/colour range, so if you pick up all the detail in a scientific manner, the photo looks boring and washed out. Instead, a good photographer will underexpose and overexpose to taste in order to accentuate certain choice details, and the resultant effect is dramatic rather than scientific. A captured scientific representation is always going to be less than the real thing being captured, but art is something else. It is a new thing in its own right. Creative rather than reductive. Or is it distortion? (I love nice distortion, but spare me the comb filter)
In the photography domain the Tannoys and Ruarks are like a Hasselblad or Nikon F1. And the Sony is one of those crap automated compact cameras with plastic lenses.
This is somewhat off the thread though. Have you tried making casings out of Nougat? Nougat is very easy to nibble into shape and it sticks together beautifully if you lick it for a couple of minutes.
I would have thought that the sound is effected far more by the design of the circuits than what box you put the circuits in. It's not an acoustic device y'know. Wood/polystyrene/lead in the acoustic world correspond to Copper/Aluminium Oxide/Plastic to my imagination. And if you use plastic cabling instead of copper cables in your amp it will sound really bad. I'm not so sure that acoustically damping the case down with lead will make that much difference, but I haven't tried it myself. Could it be that the lead was sapping the current out of the cables due to an electromagnetic effect? It wouldn't be anything acoustic, cos the signal is not being transmitted in that domain. It must be an electronic effect. Or is it the fabled euphonics? Has anybody ever tried strapping an amp to a strongly vibrating table and seeing How that changes the sound? I'd love to know.
A hifi is not a musical instrument, nor should it mess around with the sound IMO. Off course they all do, and such is the toll of recording, storing, and reproducing, but it's such colouring that we, well I at least, are trying to reduce.
Err hmm. But we don't take those art forms then manipulate them or add colour to them after the photographer has created his/her piece. Continuing your analogy then, a photographer creating and image for others to enjoy (be it accurate, highlighted, or whatever at the skill and desire of the photographer) is analogous to the musician(s) and others involved in creating their art piece and recording it on some medium. The hifi merely allows us to view this picture, and ideally I would like no colour added please!
Art is art, I ain't arguing. But it's science that's allows us to record and then reproduce this art and the goal should be to ensure it is uncoloured as much as is currently possible.
It will lower the resonant frequency, but why should that make it more difficult to control vibrations? Increased mass will lower the amplitude of forced excitations for all frequencies other than the resonant mode. If you lower the mode to a frequency below the forcing stimuli in the environment, you have effectively controlled the vibrations... exactly the opposite of what you suggest.analog_sa said:
And the thought that damping vibration of a solid state electrical device would somehow "rob" it of musicality... well, that's ridiculous. As ridiculous as thinking the vibrations would affect the sound in the first place.
If it was supercooled to absolute zero then it wouldn't be creating any vibrations it's self.
Most cryogenic labs have trouble getting into the last few degrees of absolute zero.
I imagine that the amount of gas boiling off your Hi-Fi to achieve this effect would be very impressive in it's self, probably more so than the Hi-Fi!
Whether supercooling with liquid helium is a viable option for your home Hi-Fi, I'm not so sure!
There is one advantage to this method and it's that you could also have a superconducting Hi-Fi. Yay!
Most cryogenic labs have trouble getting into the last few degrees of absolute zero.
I imagine that the amount of gas boiling off your Hi-Fi to achieve this effect would be very impressive in it's self, probably more so than the Hi-Fi!
Whether supercooling with liquid helium is a viable option for your home Hi-Fi, I'm not so sure!
There is one advantage to this method and it's that you could also have a superconducting Hi-Fi. Yay!
eeka chu said:If it was supercooled to absolute zero then it wouldn't be creating any vibrations it's self.
Most cryogenic labs have trouble getting into the last few degrees of absolute zero.
I imagine that the amount of gas boiling off your Hi-Fi to achieve this effect would be very impressive in it's self, probably more so than the Hi-Fi!
Whether supercooling with liquid helium is a viable option for your home Hi-Fi, I'm not so sure!
There is one advantage to this method and it's that you could also have a superconducting Hi-Fi. Yay!
...And you could get a away with a REALLY small heatsink...
Nuuk said:
Doesn't this statement assume that the item being damped doesn't have any vibrations of its own which would mean (according to my understanding of physics) that it didn't exist?
Yes, everything has self-vibration on some scale, and everything resonates as well. The amplitude of that resonation is what we are concerned with. If you add mass and lower the first mode to a frequency below the majority of forcing stimuli, then any remaining resonantions will be lower in amplitude than that caused by the rather large forcing functions produced by speakers. That is assuming you can add enough mass to lower the frequency sufficiently, of course.
The question still remains however... why be concerned with the vibration of solid state electronics?
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