Nicely pretty, but counterproductive curves on that TL.
@yves skyhero (https://www.diyaudio.com/community/members/yves-skyhero.531636/) has experience with a bunch of EMS. He likes the EMS. better than the Markaudio he has tried. I don’t think the baby one thou.
dave
Thanks for the correction; rather a lot of designs to try to remember, particularly when they’re not stored in my basement. 🙄
Very different animals other than being paper cone wideband drivers.
The LB5, at least using the data on the Solen link, is basically a 4in with an Sd of approximately 50cm^2 or about 59% of CHP90. The general spec. is completely different too; rated travel is 2mm, and it's heavily over-damped with a Q of about 0.13, putting it firmly in the midrange / horn category as its -3dB mass corner is up at 769.23Hz sans any series R or a high output impedance / impedance matching amplifier.
Other than cone area, CHP90 by contrast has a similar Fs, a Q of just over 0.36, double the Vas, and if we derive an Xmax as a voltage input percentage of Xmech, a 1-way travel of 4.96mm. Within the context of modestly sized fullrange drivers, it's 'bass capable' as you can probably see from some of the designs I've done for it on the MA site.
None of this is to say or imply one or the other is 'better' or 'worse' -they're just different, & as-is, meant for different things. It's possible that Closer are using a different version of the LB5 that hasn't made it onto the EMS site yet -IIRC this happened once or twice with the speakers Dave & I designed for Yves using EMS units.
I have no idea about the EMS LB5 drivers? Yes I have seen and heard of this brand for a while now at Solen.ca. I do like the paper cones. I see another company is selling the same drivers with a wooden phase plug installed and the normal dust cap cut out? They seems to cost a lot more when you go up the driver line. I would like to know why the ex version cost 3 times the price of the regular version? Also these drivers would have to do something very rare and special for me to spend that kind of money on a small raw driver along.
Dave if you weren’t so far from Me I would have rented a uhaul and fetched the free stuff and bargains long ago? So dave what bargains do you have and you can ship to me? Plus am Always interested in the stuff you’re selling Dave. 😁
used the new drivers to suck another person into the wonderful world of diyAudio:
Mission accomplished?
Putting 2+2 together... A field coil version of an MAOP driver would definitely be on my Christmas wish-list.
Sorry -no such suggestions intended from this end, and definitely no such drivers planned to the best of my knowledge. The voltage reference was simply an Xmax derivation from Xmech (Xlim) -in this case I was setting 1-way Xmax as a percentage of 1-way Xmech such as would require a doubling of the input voltage to reach the mechanical limit from that point.
EMS is a legendaric french fullrange brand from one of europe's best designers, Michel Fertin. He started it in 1966, and his daughter Catherine Fertin took over in 2001 when he retired. The brand is very big in France, largely unknown in the rest of the world (except the french speaking parts of Belgium and Switzerland). It's only since recent they got an english language website, and they can communicate in an other language than French i heared. The prices they ask are partly because they can (they could probally still ask more and still sell enough locally), partly because they are handbuild in France (that is expensive), not industrial builds in a low-wage country like China.
I never used them myself, but living in the french speaking part of Belgium, i see them arround quiet a lot and they do sound very good. They remind me a lot of the old Philips drivers, but more modern and wider bandwith. They are surely better than Lowther or Lii or similar drivers in that style. It's one of the small brand on my list to try later (toghetter with Sonido) after i finished my long list of ongoing or waiting projects...
It would add another dimension to the experimental playing field:
-Fine-tuning the bass Q to your box design.
-Fine-tuning the tonal quality to your listening level. A bit like a musical instrument amp with separate (or combined) 'gain' and 'field' knobs. I would imagine there could at least a couple of effects that are potentially competing witj each other: as the poles saturate to a greater degree (running it hot), a higher proportion of field lines start "spilling over" sideways and arcing around the edges of the magnet gap, giving the voice coil a more linear field to move around in. But there might also be different sweet spots for the electrical Q wrt. the 'stiffness' of the cone depending on if it's running in a horn or a small flat baffle etc.
I couldn't find details of the EMS driver (on mobile) but I assumed they were running an electro-magnet.
Field coils are great when done well -as I say, no such designs in the offing from MA however. Not to my knowledge anyway.
An Alpair 12 Field Coil prototype was developed. MA drivers have gotten much beter since then.
dave
I also feel that the Fostes FF85wk is fine and engaging little driver. Is there a small TB thaat pleases in much the same way?
Not in my experience. The best i have heard was a one-off prototype for someone (supposedly JBL)
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/the-tale-of-two-tangbands.8054/
BTW, these are going free with the last FH-Lite flat-pak i have (fully assembled).
The Alpair 5.2/3 is competitive with FF85wk, note that i sent Mark a set of µFonkens with FF85k to encorage MA to do somethign really good, small. The CHN-50 is amaxingly close for coffee shop money.
dave
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/the-tale-of-two-tangbands.8054/
BTW, these are going free with the last FH-Lite flat-pak i have (fully assembled).
The Alpair 5.2/3 is competitive with FF85wk, note that i sent Mark a set of µFonkens with FF85k to encorage MA to do somethign really good, small. The CHN-50 is amaxingly close for coffee shop money.
dave
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If my memory serves me right, I heard this driver many years ago and it impressed me: W3-1231SN. Very clear sound, good power handling, deep and detailed presentation. But I can't remember exactly if it was used entirely on its own, or fast/Waw, or as a midtweet etc. Punching above it's weight, that's what I remember most.