I don't think you're paying attention.
See the following full range drivers.
https://www.parts-express.com/Tang-Band-W8-2314-8-Coaxial-Full-Range-Woofer-264-9004?quantity=50
https://www.parts-express.com/Tang-Band-W4-1879-4-Full-Range-Driver-264-903?quantity=1
https://www.parts-express.com/Tang-Band-W6-2313-6-1-2-Coaxial-Full-Range-Woofer-264-9002?quantity=1
Now while I believe you wanted to keep the price of the drivers around $100.00
These blow that away...
I just wanted to point out that you can get a full range that goes up and beyond 40K.
The small issue... Parts Express has full range and co-ax in the same group. Full range no crossover. Co-Ax would require a XO.
The 8" is listed as a Co-ax but the 4" is full range. 55-20K If memory serves...
So why limit yourself?
I mean you may not need to look at 20kHz but could find something that hits 17kHz
See the following full range drivers.
https://www.parts-express.com/Tang-Band-W8-2314-8-Coaxial-Full-Range-Woofer-264-9004?quantity=50
https://www.parts-express.com/Tang-Band-W4-1879-4-Full-Range-Driver-264-903?quantity=1
https://www.parts-express.com/Tang-Band-W6-2313-6-1-2-Coaxial-Full-Range-Woofer-264-9002?quantity=1
Now while I believe you wanted to keep the price of the drivers around $100.00
These blow that away...
I just wanted to point out that you can get a full range that goes up and beyond 40K.
The small issue... Parts Express has full range and co-ax in the same group. Full range no crossover. Co-Ax would require a XO.
The 8" is listed as a Co-ax but the 4" is full range. 55-20K If memory serves...
So why limit yourself?
I mean you may not need to look at 20kHz but could find something that hits 17kHz
Just to add.
If money is no object... here's a full range that would work...
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...as-exotic-x1-04-f8-4-ohm-8-full-range-driver/
Per the site 30-20K hz range.
Or within your budget
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...iscovery-5f/8422t-01-2-paper-cone-full-range/
However beyond the single driver, you're going to need a subwoofer.
There's also MarkAudio .... here's one for ~$150 that will get up to 20kHz and they say 42Hz on the bottom end.
Again, my point was that even w a loss of hearing and while you may not hear it.. you could feel or sense sound above 4kHz or if you're listening w someone else... they may also appreciate the sound.
If money is no object... here's a full range that would work...
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...as-exotic-x1-04-f8-4-ohm-8-full-range-driver/
Per the site 30-20K hz range.
Or within your budget
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...iscovery-5f/8422t-01-2-paper-cone-full-range/
However beyond the single driver, you're going to need a subwoofer.
There's also MarkAudio .... here's one for ~$150 that will get up to 20kHz and they say 42Hz on the bottom end.
Again, my point was that even w a loss of hearing and while you may not hear it.. you could feel or sense sound above 4kHz or if you're listening w someone else... they may also appreciate the sound.
Oh, I'm playing plenty of attention, but you seem confused.
Two of the speakers you suggest are not truly considered to be full range drivers despite Parts Express rather confusing nomenclature calling coax woofers to be full range. Those are 2-Way drivers lacking a crossover that the user has to supply separately.
The third, W4-1879, has a price of $275 each.
Let us know when you have something serious to suggest, and not waste your time or anyone else's with links to drivers that cost almost $1,000 each. If you want to show off, please find some other place to do it.
I think you need to read what I wrote.
The point was that you can get full range speakers that can go up and beyond 20kHz.
I don't know all of the options or the price points... just that you don't need to limit yourself because you may not hear above 4kHz.
The point was that you can get full range speakers that can go up and beyond 20kHz.
I don't know all of the options or the price points... just that you don't need to limit yourself because you may not hear above 4kHz.
Perhaps you should pay attention to what is being said.
I don't know every speaker out there.
Just that you can get a FR that goes beyond 20kHz which would still sound decent for others listening with you.
And if you want to listen alone... skip the speakers and just get a pair of headphones.
If there's a Mark Audio or other brand AlMg-cone that fits (cabs and budget) just apply planet10's gloss-coat (how-to picture in Alpair11ms tweak thread). Uncanny realism up to frequency response limit which is less of an issue in this case.
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...ther-metal-cone-markaudio.409632/post-7695276
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...ther-metal-cone-markaudio.409632/post-7695276
Thanks for the suggestion, but I'm not really a fan of metal cones speakers. Whatever I do is much more likely to be paper based.
The bigger issue here is 2-Way versus full range, particularly below 4 KHz. And then finding a driver that's a good fit for my existing cabinets. I don't plan on building new cabinets to replace the current ones.
The bigger issue here is 2-Way versus full range, particularly below 4 KHz. And then finding a driver that's a good fit for my existing cabinets. I don't plan on building new cabinets to replace the current ones.
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Too bad you don't have access to the dozens of fullrange drivers available here at the source -- but surely amazon/alibaba/ebay have some. Isred/Hifi-bird/Fuji/whatever (saw one on Amazon but NLA). Since HF flatness isn't needed they should all work well -- the standard of construction is quite high for the price.
(Coated the AlMg does not sound metallic.)
(Coated the AlMg does not sound metallic.)
Again, thanks for the suggestions. However, the only sources I use for speakers are Madisound and Parts Express. I don't buy these things from Internet based companies.
I'm late to the party, so please forgive any repetition.
I have similar hearing deficits, plus tinnitus (which is not constant).
Like you, @classicalfan, I still derive considerable satisfaction from recorded music.
I'm a big believer in wideband drivers, like the Eminence Deltalite 2512 - which is beyond your set budget. I would suggest an alternative approach: a clean set of JBL 308p powered monitors.
These have serious capability in the regions we identify containing most orchestral energy, play surprisingly deep, and have excellent control over directivity.
The last aspect I think is often overlooked in our quest for clean presentation.
****
If your hearing was damaged by exposure to high SPL, adding more HF energy might set off inner ear spasm, which is a "crawling" sensation as the ear tries to protect itself. It's the weirdest thing, and mine can start up without any ambient noise.
My doc says most of my hearing complaints were caused by an excess of birthdays.
https://treblehealth.com/tensor-tympani-syndrome/
I have similar hearing deficits, plus tinnitus (which is not constant).
Like you, @classicalfan, I still derive considerable satisfaction from recorded music.
I'm a big believer in wideband drivers, like the Eminence Deltalite 2512 - which is beyond your set budget. I would suggest an alternative approach: a clean set of JBL 308p powered monitors.
These have serious capability in the regions we identify containing most orchestral energy, play surprisingly deep, and have excellent control over directivity.
The last aspect I think is often overlooked in our quest for clean presentation.
****
If your hearing was damaged by exposure to high SPL, adding more HF energy might set off inner ear spasm, which is a "crawling" sensation as the ear tries to protect itself. It's the weirdest thing, and mine can start up without any ambient noise.
My doc says most of my hearing complaints were caused by an excess of birthdays.
https://treblehealth.com/tensor-tympani-syndrome/
Dude!
Go to Parts Express.
Go look at any full range Dayton Audio drivers and you'll find a bunch that can go up to 17kHz or higher that are within your budget.
That's just one brand. There are others. So why did you limit yourself to top side frequency?
And I used Madisound also.
Now while the speakers I pointed out were outside your price range they were just examples of what was out there.
Since you're familiar w both sites... you can select full range speakers, then filter based on price and even if you wanted to look at size of the driver too.
OP argument is that he's not missing any music -- musical content at least all fundamental notes are below 4khz, and he has limited hearing above 4khz but nonetheless has enjoyed his music like before. He has Piccolo speakers, I believe 7L, with enough bass for him in his room, even on orchestral music. He doesn't think music reproduction beyond those limits can be worth more than $100/driver to himself, and I have to say he's probably right. Like I have said, at least dozens of fullrange drivers/finished-speakers are made and sold here, at all conceivable price points, because people listen near/mid-field in tiny apartments with thin walls and quick-to-complain neighbors. (I made up a term for it: Closer To You -- CTY.) Small fullrange-driver speakers fit this application better than multi-way, and OP wonders if hearing limitations reduce their effectiveness. I think it is a legitimate question: At what point does early HF roll-off render stereo imaging impractical or not worth the bother?
My experiments with acoustic-center-alignment and up-firing semi-omni (particularly LX configuration both stereo and mono) so-far suggests the common front-baffle-mounted multi-way rectangular-box bass-reflex is... pretty bad design except for its originally-intended application as Disco Party speaker.
My experiments with acoustic-center-alignment and up-firing semi-omni (particularly LX configuration both stereo and mono) so-far suggests the common front-baffle-mounted multi-way rectangular-box bass-reflex is... pretty bad design except for its originally-intended application as Disco Party speaker.
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Thanks, but I have no interest in the JBL powered monitors.
My goal is to possibly improve the sound quality of what I have, which is already excellent, by eliminating the crossover and the imperfections that it introduces. Going to the powered 2-way monitors would be going entirely in the opposite and wrong direction.
I appreciate that you are trying to help, but it's not really anything I would consider.
Quick note: Consider a 5" wide-band to 6-8khz mid-woofer, like the Mission soft-cone-PP driver I run straight-through (following Mission practice at the time) as midrange in my otherwise-ceramic 3-way "lumin77". Such drivers ought to still be made. It is possible the Piccolo midwoofer is already like that.
A more out-of-the-box idea is LX: bypass the XO LPF and run midwoofer straight-through, but lay the cab on its back firing up or nearly so; unmount the tweeter still connected to XO HPF but hold/place the dome exactly over the midwoofer center, cover the hole and listen. (Or experiment by turning the other speaker upside-down, tweeter dome directly over the first speaker's midwoofer, play only those drivers and listen-test some music mono.) No cost.
A more out-of-the-box idea is LX: bypass the XO LPF and run midwoofer straight-through, but lay the cab on its back firing up or nearly so; unmount the tweeter still connected to XO HPF but hold/place the dome exactly over the midwoofer center, cover the hole and listen. (Or experiment by turning the other speaker upside-down, tweeter dome directly over the first speaker's midwoofer, play only those drivers and listen-test some music mono.) No cost.
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I was skeptical, too.
Years of Direct Heated triodes and high sensitivity wideband drivers had me doubtful as well. For $150 - I tested the premise.
The point I'm stressing is that inexpensive solutions exist, and offer an alternative to the necessary compromises modifications require.
FWIW - I built a set of MoFi sourcepoint clones, using MiniDSP products. Now I can measure response, make adjustments on the fly and tune the various inputs quickly.
This approach trades hearing aids for a laptop.
Years of Direct Heated triodes and high sensitivity wideband drivers had me doubtful as well. For $150 - I tested the premise.
The point I'm stressing is that inexpensive solutions exist, and offer an alternative to the necessary compromises modifications require.
FWIW - I built a set of MoFi sourcepoint clones, using MiniDSP products. Now I can measure response, make adjustments on the fly and tune the various inputs quickly.
This approach trades hearing aids for a laptop.
My interest as expressed in the first post is to find a full range driver to replace the 2-Way speakers that I current use. The purpose being to eliminate any distortions or other compromises that come with crossovers.
And since I have limited high end hearing it makes sense to consider single full range drivers.
I seriously doubt that any of the suggestions here for various 2-Ways would be superior to the outstanding Piccolos that I already have.
And since I have limited high end hearing it makes sense to consider single full range drivers.
I seriously doubt that any of the suggestions here for various 2-Ways would be superior to the outstanding Piccolos that I already have.
We already knew that. Did you mention that you wanted just the same basket hole for testing the speaker? I think so.