And what about the "dynamically stable distortion profile" league?
Low compression + stable (and low) distortion = great!
Low compression + stable (and low) distortion = great!
Hi,
Because they don't suit Transistors/Fets, whilst they
made valve designs a little easier in their time.
rgds, sreten.
Wacko thread hah 😀
I'm not in. There are drawbacks on both sides of the 'fence' of specialisation on way or the other.
My main system are small inefficient midbasses, very flat response but only ~83dB/W/m. They soak up power,but at 2-3m at most (small apartment) they are plenty loud enough.
More efficient speakers would go louder cleaner for sure. But then, even just a larger pair of speakers instead would also go louder and cleaner.
My main issue is above about 89dB/W/m there's only one midrange I really like. And that particular midrange requires a more traditional midrange crossover, as opposed to the <400hz trend with some recent 3 ways, and FAST.
I'm not in. There are drawbacks on both sides of the 'fence' of specialisation on way or the other.
My main system are small inefficient midbasses, very flat response but only ~83dB/W/m. They soak up power,but at 2-3m at most (small apartment) they are plenty loud enough.
More efficient speakers would go louder cleaner for sure. But then, even just a larger pair of speakers instead would also go louder and cleaner.
My main issue is above about 89dB/W/m there's only one midrange I really like. And that particular midrange requires a more traditional midrange crossover, as opposed to the <400hz trend with some recent 3 ways, and FAST.
I am starting a new league.
It's a "League Against the League Against Low Efficiency Loudspeakers".
The most quoted loudspeaker in the world is the BBS LS3/5 A.
Sensitivity about 83 dB SPL at 1m for 2.83 Vrms.
It's a "League Against the League Against Low Efficiency Loudspeakers".
The most quoted loudspeaker in the world is the BBS LS3/5 A.
Sensitivity about 83 dB SPL at 1m for 2.83 Vrms.
I will happily join any league that is against the LS3/5A - a speaker that could only have been made popular in the heyday of the BBC. It is a deeply compromised design and exemplifies all the shortcomings of low efficiency speakers without actually being good!!!
It is however a great example of marketing and mass belief "The BBC says it is good so it must be".
I want a League Against the Hype!!!
It is however a great example of marketing and mass belief "The BBC says it is good so it must be".
I want a League Against the Hype!!!
Seriously, i can't really be a member of your club since i have 4-ways that are very... VERY mixed in terms of efficiency.
tweeter: 111db
mid: 99db
midbass: 93db
subwoofer: 83db
*makes not much sense to judge a sub frequency transducer based on his (nominal) efficiency...
tweeter: 111db
mid: 99db
midbass: 93db
subwoofer: 83db
*makes not much sense to judge a sub frequency transducer based on his (nominal) efficiency...
Oh, speaking of nominal efficiency:
1) most very high efficiency drivers are not efficient at all at lower frequencies
2) i witnessed HUGE differences between claimed efficiency and measured efficiency among manufacturers. It's not industry-controlled as horsepower is for car industry, per exemple...
Bottomline, it's not very reliable.
1) most very high efficiency drivers are not efficient at all at lower frequencies
2) i witnessed HUGE differences between claimed efficiency and measured efficiency among manufacturers. It's not industry-controlled as horsepower is for car industry, per exemple...
Bottomline, it's not very reliable.
Hi,
You have obviously never heard them in action.
They do a great job of resembling bigger speakers.
They don't hold up to modern DIY alternatives.
rgds, sreten.
If I read sreten correctly, the numerous iterations of the LS3/5A excelled in their day for the exact application for which they were designed, and high sensitivity was not on the design brief.
I can remember hearing a pair when I was a reckless youth, and OK, there was some substance abuse involved, but there were a couple of less costly mainstream commercial 2-ways by Advent, EPI, Yamaha, even the BIC Venturis that I found more emotionally involving - but then I wasn't mixing sound on a remote recording site.
And I always thought the JBL Century/ L100 was the most quoted speaker in the world, or was it the Bose 901, or the AR3A, or the Quad ESL57, or ..... ?
I can remember hearing a pair when I was a reckless youth, and OK, there was some substance abuse involved, but there were a couple of less costly mainstream commercial 2-ways by Advent, EPI, Yamaha, even the BIC Venturis that I found more emotionally involving - but then I wasn't mixing sound on a remote recording site.
And I always thought the JBL Century/ L100 was the most quoted speaker in the world, or was it the Bose 901, or the AR3A, or the Quad ESL57, or ..... ?
Friends, we can have all sorts of sidetrack discussions, nothing wrong with that, but what I would like to know/see the proof or data...is that low efficiency loudspeakers, given the same spl and frequency range, simply do not produce the same detailed dynamic sound as highly efficient speakers.
Some time ago mass asembly in china lead to big voice coil gap, which would require less quality control and lower defect rejection. Ultimately we have low efficiency loudspeakers...
Some time ago mass asembly in china lead to big voice coil gap, which would require less quality control and lower defect rejection. Ultimately we have low efficiency loudspeakers...
Hi,
somehow funny that speakers that's efficiency resides within the lower single-digit percentage range are thought 'efficient', ,btw. dB/W/m is not 'efficiency'.
Even horns seldomly achieve more than 10% without seriously reduced bandwidth.
Probabely heating water on an open fire made from the efficient speaker's cabinet reaches higher efficiency
jauu
Calvin
ps: to achieve higher efficiencies one needs to get rid of the dc copper resistance of the voicecoil, or the voicecoil at all.
Speakers featuring superconducting voice coils or ESLs may reach efficiencies of up to 30%!
pps: the idea of the HE-League sounds sooo nerdy .... I'm tempted to join 😀
somehow funny that speakers that's efficiency resides within the lower single-digit percentage range are thought 'efficient', ,btw. dB/W/m is not 'efficiency'.
Even horns seldomly achieve more than 10% without seriously reduced bandwidth.
Probabely heating water on an open fire made from the efficient speaker's cabinet reaches higher efficiency
jauu
Calvin
ps: to achieve higher efficiencies one needs to get rid of the dc copper resistance of the voicecoil, or the voicecoil at all.
Speakers featuring superconducting voice coils or ESLs may reach efficiencies of up to 30%!
pps: the idea of the HE-League sounds sooo nerdy .... I'm tempted to join 😀
Calvin,
Don't stress the last "few percent" of efficiency (even if is the last 90% efficiency) - a fully fledged member of the league against low efficiency speakers will undoubtedly have a huge amplifier connected to their high efficiency speaker!!!
There is noting quite like the dynamics of my three way active system with several kilowatts of amplifier connected to some extremely efficient pro audio drivers🙂 Interestingly at anything less than deafening levels, the distortion is quite low too.
Sreten, this aspect of audio reproduction is exactly where low efficiency speakers, dare I mention LS3/5A, "excel at failing".
Don't stress the last "few percent" of efficiency (even if is the last 90% efficiency) - a fully fledged member of the league against low efficiency speakers will undoubtedly have a huge amplifier connected to their high efficiency speaker!!!
There is noting quite like the dynamics of my three way active system with several kilowatts of amplifier connected to some extremely efficient pro audio drivers🙂 Interestingly at anything less than deafening levels, the distortion is quite low too.
Sreten, this aspect of audio reproduction is exactly where low efficiency speakers, dare I mention LS3/5A, "excel at failing".
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