Bob Cordell in the past and just now has made one of the most significant criticisms of complementary design that I have seen contributed here.
I am not an average guy, Chris, and I expect people to use factory matched devices, either bipolar or fet. I also EXPECT matching of the betas or the Idss of the complementary devices. IF NOT, make something easier to build. Use IC's, I do. Right now I have designed into future products: AD797, OPA132, and A825 (thanks Scott). More will follow.
john curl said:Especially when people do not have the prerequisites to understand what is being discussed.
You have the arrogance to refuse to discuss a topic because you pre-judge your audience to be too stupid to understand you. Oh boy.
Well, no point applying for that TA job...you don't seem to have the prerequisites to be a teacher.

Hi John,
You are one of the few that seems to understand what is important when using this configuration, present company excepted of course. The average mass produced amplifier will not lend itself to this unless they go to a single package solution. THAT may have something, if they can match both polarities. Otherwise, this circuit is more of a liability.
-Chris
Well, yes. That was my entire point.I am not an average guy, Chris, and I expect people to use factory matched devices, either bipolar or fet.
You are one of the few that seems to understand what is important when using this configuration, present company excepted of course. The average mass produced amplifier will not lend itself to this unless they go to a single package solution. THAT may have something, if they can match both polarities. Otherwise, this circuit is more of a liability.
-Chris
john curl said:Bob Cordell in the past and just now has made one of the most significant criticisms of complementary design that I have seen contributed here.
Really? Bob just stated the bleeding obvious! (no disrespect intended, Bob). Blimey.
ostripper said:
Mr. Cordell , would that "vas fighting effect" also hold true
with unipolar/comp. "hybrids" like the APT or symasym ??
OS
No, definitely not. The APT1 is a good example.
Cheers,
Bob
scott wurcer said:
Funny. 🙂
Technically, I think they may be Americans er Irish er same thing. Plenty of gobshites in the UK too, though.
Did you notice what sign your cursor becomes when you try to select something at the site?

traderbam said:
Funny. 🙂
Technically, I think they may be Americans er Irish er same thing. Plenty of gobshites in the UK too, though.
Did you notice what sign your cursor becomes when you try to select something at the site?![]()
They are from Boston.
john curl said:PMA is a GREAT TA! The position has been filled, thank you very much.
**** I was sure that it would be Joshua.
😀
John (or anyone who will condescend to reply - I'm not fussy), on the subject of brute force NFB, I think we can declare Halcro to incorporate gobs of it. Have you compared the sound of the top JC amplifier (is it the JC1?) with the top Halcro? I wish I had the opportunity to do this myself.
One high end amp I have auditioned, albeit in a small hotel room, is the Lamm M1.2, and I thought it was really quite good. The Lamm is a little eccentric; using a valve stage and mosfet outputs, and no global NFB.
One high end amp I have auditioned, albeit in a small hotel room, is the Lamm M1.2, and I thought it was really quite good. The Lamm is a little eccentric; using a valve stage and mosfet outputs, and no global NFB.
traderbam said:John (or anyone who will condescend to reply - I'm not fussy), on the subject of brute force NFB, I think we can declare Halcro to incorporate gobs of it. Have you compared the sound of the top JC amplifier (is it the JC1?) with the top Halcro? I wish I had the opportunity to do this myself.
One high end amp I have auditioned, albeit in a small hotel room, is the Lamm M1.2, and I thought it was really quite good. The Lamm is a little eccentric; using a valve stage and mosfet outputs, and no global NFB.
Isn’t the thing with Halcro that Candy is using a lot of EC together with GNFB?
john curl said:OK, here goes:
I was given a SPECIAL project that had to be VERY LOW DISTORTION, but the signal passing through was only a single sine wave between 10 and 100,000Hz.
This was for an audio THD oscillator driver, NOT audio in general. Global negative feedback can work wonders in this application.
SINCE, I had to work to 100,000Hz with less than .001% distortion or so, I chose to use 2 stage (12dB/octave) compensation.
It was easier to use essentially the SAME fet pair that Bob Cordell uses to minimize the non-linear input capacitance and reduce its effect at 100,000Hz, because P channel devices have MORE non-linear input capacitance than N channel devices.
SO, it was easier to make, (and compensate) a more conventional topology, that I have used since 1973, than to use the more difficult to adjust complementary differential fet input topology that I have used for even longer.
Is the circuit something that can be published? I'm interested in the techniques you used as are others here. I'm sure the high feedback would have an effect on the sound etc. but the other aspects of ultra low distortion are always enlightening. Is that the output buffer in the ST1710?
stinius said:Isn’t the thing with Halcro that Candy is using a lot of EC together with GNFB?
Yes. The patent I've seen uses local OS NFB and a global NFB loop that encompasses it. A more recent patent involves 4 stages of nested NFB but I'm not sure whether this scheme was used.
I am compelled at this point to play my well-worn 78: EC is equivalent to NFB. Same thing.
Bob Cordell said:BTW, I'll be up at FSI in Montreal tomorrow through Sunday. Anybody else going to be there?
Hey, that's my home town. I wish I could be there. Have fun.

I personally have not compared the Halcro with the JC-1 power amp. I do deliver about twice the power and 5 times the transient peak current, at 1/2 the price, but the Halcro on its own, sounds OK to me. I would never be the judge of components that I am involved with. The LAMM $130,000 tube amp is a favorite of mine.
traderbam said:John (or anyone who will condescend to reply - I'm not fussy), on the subject of brute force NFB, I think we can declare Halcro to incorporate gobs of it. Have you compared the sound of the top JC amplifier (is it the JC1?) with the top Halcro? I wish I had the opportunity to do this myself.
One high end amp I have auditioned, albeit in a small hotel room, is the Lamm M1.2, and I thought it was really quite good. The Lamm is a little eccentric; using a valve stage and mosfet outputs, and no global NFB.
Lamm M1.2 uses small amount (6 -7dB) of feedback taken from the VAS output. Output stage works in open loop.
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