I don't think that's the same effect as I was referring to. How would one even know if a signal were related if it happened much later?
So does any simple R/C low pass filter. Put a step into it and there is something after the step stops, wow profound. Happens in any record chain with equalizers, it has to, no other possibility. I never changed my opinion at all when I demonstrated how ordinary and unimportant it was you and your posse lost interest in what I had to say.
Right, that sounds like a filter so I think we can rule it out as the whole story. We obviously do need more input from John and whoever else has experienced the same thing he has. There are some possibilities that occur to me depending on what the perceptual description might be, and of course, there is always the role of perception and perceptual experience intertwined with effects of reproduction system characteristics. As usual, once fully understood whatever is going on is no doubt going to be found consistent with known physics.
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I read this argument as basically being if 1/T = F with T being microseconds to seconds at what period and level is it perceptable. The assumption of perceptible bandwidth limits at 20 ish hertz may not apply as there might be intermodulation effects with higher frequencies. There also may be issues with tympanic membrane relaxation.
But I think it might be more productive to play with a cat or actually listen to some recordings of music than argue vague terminology and perceived experiences.
(Relaxing a bit as work has stretch my technical comfort zone. Quoting on a lot of 288 plus spares of a very special tv display. Alibaba quotes them at $2,500.00 each. Sources I trust $3,500.00 to $4,100.00. What amount of competition vs risk is acceptable?)
But I think it might be more productive to play with a cat or actually listen to some recordings of music than argue vague terminology and perceived experiences.
(Relaxing a bit as work has stretch my technical comfort zone. Quoting on a lot of 288 plus spares of a very special tv display. Alibaba quotes them at $2,500.00 each. Sources I trust $3,500.00 to $4,100.00. What amount of competition vs risk is acceptable?)
What are known or knowable, but unstated factors in the equation? What is your personal risk tolerance and still be able to sleep? How much can you afford to lose with it being catastrophic? How much less do you trust Alibaba than your trusted sources? You want to optimize for what? You know there are whole books written on this stuff, and you can still get very unlucky, right?
Supplier Selection: An MCDA-Based Approach (Studies in Systems, Decision and Control): Krishnendu Mukherjee: 9788132236986: Amazon.com: Books
Okay, but people are allowed to change their minds right, especially after more thought or in the light of more information ?
You still haven't said what it sounds like to you, and how you can recognize a sound effect caused by something that happened fairly distant in time? My guess is you could probably tell me if you wanted to, and since no one else has stepped forward to say they hear the same effect the same way as you, I can only assume it's something unique to you and you don't want to say more about it. Or, maybe there is something else?
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Seems to me that Scott's referring to a linear effect is exactly what he said here and now. He never said there is no effect on AC - he just said so, when referring to RC networks.
OTOH, it seems implied that at the time you two agreed, so it seems YOU changed your mind and drifted over to voodoo land.
Always read what someone throws up!
Jan
🙂 😎
yes, what is the answer, then? always a dismissal based upon a simplified film model. Note too the model is not for a polar cap and there somewhat leaky diode(s) in there somewhere .... right? Like I said the measurement didn't show the filling in between transients/impulses when film caps where used.
Kinda moot these days as I decided to go direct coupled to rid us all of coupling caps. The best caps (lowest DA) cost a lot, are large in size. We've all gone direct coupled in ss circuits. But, this DA thing still lingers on long after a solution was proposed and accepted -- DC Servo. The DC servo concept quickly went viral and now you cant find a modern amp design without it. But remember why it was created in the first place..... to rid us of coupling caps... leaving us with balanced circuits with some dc output drift which is handled with a dc servo.
BTW -- as for how it sounds depends --- some will say compressed, others will notice inter-transient silent is less, others still will notice the thickening of the sound (2H). A lot of the DA magnitude of affect depends on the waveforms and circuit z's as well.
THx-RNMarsh
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The way I read it the note said the measured data showed the effect to be nearly linear, not perfectly so. That might allow for some measurement errors, or, possibly for some secondary or higher order effects to behave nonlinearly. I don't know if that's what Scott was thinking or not, since we don't know the context of the note and any other communications the two of them may have had on the matter.
However, it doesn't matter IMHO. Posting the note appeared to be an attempt by John to sidestep attention away from himself and his claims.
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Are you saying the effect only occurs in power amps, not preamps? I think I've seen more preamp circuits with electrolytics than with DC servos.
No mention of what kind of amp.... I started with preamp though. Took the 2 transistor circuit and comlimented it in push-pull arrangment for a direct coupled design. DC servo for control of residual offset and drift. That line stage was the precursor to the 'modern' CFA. I still use it... latest in my headphone amp. The added bonus feature was reduced distortion as well, esp 2H and 3H.
The preamps generally had an input cap (RIAA, NAB etc) and an output cap. then the same with line amp. Then cap on input of PA and in feedback input to grnd . All but gone ever since in high-end designs with direct-coupled topologies and servo.
THx-RNMarsh
The preamps generally had an input cap (RIAA, NAB etc) and an output cap. then the same with line amp. Then cap on input of PA and in feedback input to grnd . All but gone ever since in high-end designs with direct-coupled topologies and servo.
THx-RNMarsh
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ESA Science & Technology: ESA creates quietest place in space
Now THAT is silence between the signals.
Now THAT is silence between the signals.
Oh, sure. It can be done and is done in some hi-end systems.
However, many preamps in recording consoles and other equipment used to make recorded music still use a few electrolytic coupling capacitors, op-amps, line balancing transformers, etc. Most people don't listen on high-end designs at home either (the cost of high-end equipment being one not insignificant factor). For the above and similar reasons, it's not clear to me that taking out a few electrolytic coupling caps in a few hi-end reproduction system amps is likely accomplishing a whole lot in the big picture.
Proprioception is learned, we all take practice to learn how to walk and to put food into our mouths and not our ears....I take it you are witnessing this servo positioning learning/calibration process close up.
Dan.
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