@limino how strange that possibly the only extinction known on the planet that has got jack poo to to do with human interference is the one you have chose to mock, the Cetacea Genus will be a good place to catapult yourself forward 66 million years.
I'll take a wild punt and have a guess that you have done well financially from activities that are progressive in how they tear the planet apart and pollute the Waterways and eventually the seas.
One thing that should be known by all humans, is that SCIENCE today, is strongly suggesting the Oxygen required for every second breath of a living animal that is not anaerobic, is using Oxygen produced in the Oceans. Even more interesting/concerning is the strong suggestion that the areas within the Ocean where this crucial gas is produced is a little as 1%.
I know there will be a time when the human activities waste (pollution) will be killing these organisms that are critical to sustaining life on the planet.
Which animal species are the Human Race going to start culling in their millions to ensure there is plenty of Oxygen remaining for themselves, certainly won't be the horses in the earliest days, they will be too much of a good money producer.
I'll take a wild punt and have a guess that you have done well financially from activities that are progressive in how they tear the planet apart and pollute the Waterways and eventually the seas.
One thing that should be known by all humans, is that SCIENCE today, is strongly suggesting the Oxygen required for every second breath of a living animal that is not anaerobic, is using Oxygen produced in the Oceans. Even more interesting/concerning is the strong suggestion that the areas within the Ocean where this crucial gas is produced is a little as 1%.
I know there will be a time when the human activities waste (pollution) will be killing these organisms that are critical to sustaining life on the planet.
Which animal species are the Human Race going to start culling in their millions to ensure there is plenty of Oxygen remaining for themselves, certainly won't be the horses in the earliest days, they will be too much of a good money producer.
Nope , I'm flat broke most of my life and have $20 in my bank account to survive until I will get some next hustle and earn a little bit of cash . My car is 20 years old and last 3 I drive without insurance because I think it's a tax on poor in Michigan even if I could afford it which I can't.
All that green agenda of saving the planef is a noble enterprise but from a practical point of view a total nonsense. However nonsense it is it will lead to some positive outcome for the environment after an inevitable compromise. This, if rich countries will have their way and keep the developing world in the servitude for remaining of the century. If not , which is increasingly likely to happen , western quality of life will take a sharp dive and politicians and plebs will have other things on their mind than saving the planet. They already opening mines in Germany while green coalition is in power and that out to tell you what the future will look like .
All that green agenda of saving the planef is a noble enterprise but from a practical point of view a total nonsense. However nonsense it is it will lead to some positive outcome for the environment after an inevitable compromise. This, if rich countries will have their way and keep the developing world in the servitude for remaining of the century. If not , which is increasingly likely to happen , western quality of life will take a sharp dive and politicians and plebs will have other things on their mind than saving the planet. They already opening mines in Germany while green coalition is in power and that out to tell you what the future will look like .
I enjoyed watching the Flat "Guineas" Racing from Newmarket last weekend and AFAIK, no horses suffered.
And, yes, my betting tip was spot on!
But the Kentucky Derby meet was a shocking mess, with 7 horses dead. This shouldn't be happening, particularly in Flat racing.
https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/...by-horse-deaths-grand-national-racing-cruelty
A lot of very bad practises in US Racing it would seem. Drugs, Electric Buzzers. Injured or exhausted horses running, I would guess.
It takes a lot of work to find out what happened, but something has to change. Whole thing wreaks of cover-up by the authorities. These UK statistics.
https://www.horsedeathwatch.com/
Our own UK 4.2 mile Grand National Chase with huge 5'2" fences is due some reform. 4'6" fences won't spoil the spectacle. A smaller field might help too. And why is it a handicap at all? I always think the best horse should win, aside weight allowances for Fillies and maybe age.
When Irish horse Anthony Van Dyck broke a leg in the Flat Melbourne Cup, he was carrying top weight, which must have unbalanced him. There was a question whether he had a stress fracture beforehand, but I never heard the outcome. It is questionable whether it is for a horse's welfare to be flown to Australia too.
I think Horse Racing should sort its house out pronto. It is just a question of having the will to do it. Otherwise it probably and deservedly should be banned. The pressure is increasingly on.
And, yes, my betting tip was spot on!
But the Kentucky Derby meet was a shocking mess, with 7 horses dead. This shouldn't be happening, particularly in Flat racing.
https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/...by-horse-deaths-grand-national-racing-cruelty
A lot of very bad practises in US Racing it would seem. Drugs, Electric Buzzers. Injured or exhausted horses running, I would guess.
It takes a lot of work to find out what happened, but something has to change. Whole thing wreaks of cover-up by the authorities. These UK statistics.
https://www.horsedeathwatch.com/
Our own UK 4.2 mile Grand National Chase with huge 5'2" fences is due some reform. 4'6" fences won't spoil the spectacle. A smaller field might help too. And why is it a handicap at all? I always think the best horse should win, aside weight allowances for Fillies and maybe age.
When Irish horse Anthony Van Dyck broke a leg in the Flat Melbourne Cup, he was carrying top weight, which must have unbalanced him. There was a question whether he had a stress fracture beforehand, but I never heard the outcome. It is questionable whether it is for a horse's welfare to be flown to Australia too.
I think Horse Racing should sort its house out pronto. It is just a question of having the will to do it. Otherwise it probably and deservedly should be banned. The pressure is increasingly on.
I thought that things were better in the UK, but unfortunatley that doesn't seem to be the case. According to the cited article a horse is being killed on the average of about every other day there. 2611 deaths in 5904 days since 2007.
Hopefully the Horseracing Integrity and Safety Authority in the US can do something about it here. But I don't really have a lot of confindence in that happening. It is an organization apparently filled with horse racing industry people rather than outsiders who might be able to take a more independent view point and approach.
The HISA was formed 3 years ago in 2020 and seven horses were killed just last week related to the Kenturky Derby alone. So what have they really accomplished in 3 years? Doesn't appear to be much at all.
Hopefully the Horseracing Integrity and Safety Authority in the US can do something about it here. But I don't really have a lot of confindence in that happening. It is an organization apparently filled with horse racing industry people rather than outsiders who might be able to take a more independent view point and approach.
The HISA was formed 3 years ago in 2020 and seven horses were killed just last week related to the Kenturky Derby alone. So what have they really accomplished in 3 years? Doesn't appear to be much at all.
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The discussion is based on Competition Related Injuries, where euthanasia is the treatment for the injury. Not many Horses are dead prior to the Vet arriving.
This loss rate overlooks the pre-competitive stage where prior to purposeful training commencing Young Horses are euthanised due to not being manageable and not with any foreseen breeding value. These unfortunates are usually not considered for a period of Therapeutic Training to see if they can be entered with an alternative approach, or are they considered for selling on to recreational Horse Owners.
These horses lives even though longer than a Veal Calf will be quite short, probably as long as a Lamb has prior to visiting the abattoir.
Then there is the more sinister side of Breeding where No Foal - No Fee is the arrangement. When a Stud Fee can easily be between £20K - 100K for graded horses, I have once had it explained that when Markets change and money's seemed threatened there is a phenomena that many mares did not foal.
This loss rate overlooks the pre-competitive stage where prior to purposeful training commencing Young Horses are euthanised due to not being manageable and not with any foreseen breeding value. These unfortunates are usually not considered for a period of Therapeutic Training to see if they can be entered with an alternative approach, or are they considered for selling on to recreational Horse Owners.
These horses lives even though longer than a Veal Calf will be quite short, probably as long as a Lamb has prior to visiting the abattoir.
Then there is the more sinister side of Breeding where No Foal - No Fee is the arrangement. When a Stud Fee can easily be between £20K - 100K for graded horses, I have once had it explained that when Markets change and money's seemed threatened there is a phenomena that many mares did not foal.
The moderation team find this an inappropriate subject for our forum, but the thread has been well enough behaved for now. A few political posts have been removed.
I have been examining the most dangerous practices in horse racing with a UK bias..
https://www.horsedeathwatch.com/reports.php
1) Trainers running injured horses.
2) Drugs and Doping.
3) Jumps Racing is three times more dangerous than flat racing.
4) Some tracks have a far worse safety record than others. Jumps track, Cheltenham, UK is 5 times worse than Hexham, UK.
Noticeable factors include Cheltenham using more rigid fences, which injure horses if they misjump, and rarely cancelling a meeting when struggling with bad ground conditions.
5) Races beyond two miles and large fields are statistically far more dangerous for horses. Kinda obvious really.
6) Use of the whip is known to be bad practice, but is hard to restrict. Jockeys may get suspended, but do not default the win or prizemoney.
7) Cross Country Chases (with mixed obstacles) at the racetrack have a fatality every 10 races. A lot oif trainers won't go near them. Novice Chases (Inexperienced Jumpers with 4'6" fences) are also particularly dangerous.
Inside opinion is that the Kentucky Derby is not likely to get banned. The following article reports Owners indifference to horses welfare, feeling cheated when the course vet at Kentucky scratches their horse because it is carrying an injury.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...-at-the-kentucky-derby-but-dont-expect-change
All quite horrible really.
https://www.horsedeathwatch.com/reports.php
1) Trainers running injured horses.
2) Drugs and Doping.
3) Jumps Racing is three times more dangerous than flat racing.
4) Some tracks have a far worse safety record than others. Jumps track, Cheltenham, UK is 5 times worse than Hexham, UK.
Noticeable factors include Cheltenham using more rigid fences, which injure horses if they misjump, and rarely cancelling a meeting when struggling with bad ground conditions.
5) Races beyond two miles and large fields are statistically far more dangerous for horses. Kinda obvious really.
6) Use of the whip is known to be bad practice, but is hard to restrict. Jockeys may get suspended, but do not default the win or prizemoney.
7) Cross Country Chases (with mixed obstacles) at the racetrack have a fatality every 10 races. A lot oif trainers won't go near them. Novice Chases (Inexperienced Jumpers with 4'6" fences) are also particularly dangerous.
Inside opinion is that the Kentucky Derby is not likely to get banned. The following article reports Owners indifference to horses welfare, feeling cheated when the course vet at Kentucky scratches their horse because it is carrying an injury.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...-at-the-kentucky-derby-but-dont-expect-change
All quite horrible really.
If you want to see just how much of an insider group the HISA is just go to their website and see the bios of the all the key people in the organization.
https://hisaus.org/about-us?cat=hisa-team#our-team
Virtually every person is already associated with the current horse racing industry. Does anyone really thing that this group is going to make major changes to it?
Simply put, horses are just disposable parts of a very big business.
Nothing has really changed in the 3 years since the HISA was formed and I doubt anything will change now even with seven horses being killed during the week of the Kentucky Derby.
https://hisaus.org/about-us?cat=hisa-team#our-team
Virtually every person is already associated with the current horse racing industry. Does anyone really thing that this group is going to make major changes to it?
Simply put, horses are just disposable parts of a very big business.
Nothing has really changed in the 3 years since the HISA was formed and I doubt anything will change now even with seven horses being killed during the week of the Kentucky Derby.
Hmm, a lady on the HISA introduced as "Mandy Minger" would get a giggle here in the UK...
I think the expression you are seeking is to say "these people all have their snouts in the same trough."
Anywhoo, more grim statistics.
The massive junket of the 24-runner 2 mile Melbourne Cup seems to kill a horse nearly every year. Always the UK, Irish, French and Japanese ones, it seems.
https://www.codesports.com.au/horse...n/news-story/8beab7293737ccab4943657f43e6aa60
Horses often get injured in horse-boxes, and maybe they are not used to the heat and ground.
Even Taylor Swift dropped out of the pre-race entertainment in 2019 under pressure:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09...ut-of-2019-melbourne-cup-performance/11535952
The British Grand National saw unedifying scenes of protest this year, 100 arrested:
4 horses died at the meeting in 2022 and 2023:
2023
2022
I think the expression you are seeking is to say "these people all have their snouts in the same trough."
Anywhoo, more grim statistics.
The massive junket of the 24-runner 2 mile Melbourne Cup seems to kill a horse nearly every year. Always the UK, Irish, French and Japanese ones, it seems.
https://www.codesports.com.au/horse...n/news-story/8beab7293737ccab4943657f43e6aa60
Horses often get injured in horse-boxes, and maybe they are not used to the heat and ground.
Even Taylor Swift dropped out of the pre-race entertainment in 2019 under pressure:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09...ut-of-2019-melbourne-cup-performance/11535952
The British Grand National saw unedifying scenes of protest this year, 100 arrested:
4 horses died at the meeting in 2022 and 2023:
Deaths
2023
- Envoye Special (FR) – GNC – aged 9 – Fell Running Loose – Injured – Destroyed
- Hullnback – Novice Hurdle – aged 6 – Died From Infection Caused By Racing Injury
- Dark Raven (IRE) – Novice Hurdle – aged 6 – Fell – Broke Hind Legs – Destroyed
- Hill Sixteen – GN – aged 8 – Fell – Broke Neck – Dead
2022
- Eclair Surf (FR) – GN – aged 8 – Fell – Died From Head Injuries
- Discorama (FR) – GN – aged 9 – Pulled Up – Injured Pelvis – Destroyed
- Elle Est Belle – Novice Hurdle – aged 6 – Collapsed During Race – Dead
- Solwara One (IRE) – Hurdle – aged 8 – Pulled Up – Injured – Destroyed
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I hate to spell it to you but you are a romantic dreamer. You are talking about a society that puts millions of wild animals in captivity for entertainment and kills million of chickens and other cattle for food. I fail to see the majority of other members of your society would care about your concern. Sysyphean work ahead should you follow through.
I don't think so.
There is, in fact, a growing movement worldwide to do something about the cruel treatment and wanton deaths of race horses.
The racing industry - and that is exactly what it is, an industry - is coming under increased pressure to do something about it. They are resisting as expected, but over time I think changes will be forced on them.
It has to be admitted that Horse Racing is in my Blood:
TBH, both these Horses would scarcely get a flicker of attention from me as Derby Winners!
NO! My current interest is in pure-born thoroughbreds like Adayar:
https://www.skysports.com/racing/form-profiles/horse/1125044/adayar-ire
Excellent Horse, IMO. A Son of Frankel. Continues to Win and Win.
I believe in the Purity of the Turf.
I say this as a person with 4 consecutive winning tickets at the bookies. I know this game.
TBH, both these Horses would scarcely get a flicker of attention from me as Derby Winners!
NO! My current interest is in pure-born thoroughbreds like Adayar:
https://www.skysports.com/racing/form-profiles/horse/1125044/adayar-ire
Excellent Horse, IMO. A Son of Frankel. Continues to Win and Win.
I believe in the Purity of the Turf.
I say this as a person with 4 consecutive winning tickets at the bookies. I know this game.
I still am not able to see how a death toll of seven horses in racing industry will gather more attention compared to the slaughter of millions of cows, cattle and chicken at the same week timeframe in food industry. Whatever makes a horse more valuable than a cow? However probably you are correct anyway, I may misunderstand how you and your fellow citizens think after all.
We are talking about two different things. One is the horse racing industry and the other is the food industry.
Civilization as it has evolved has generally accepted raising and slaughtering animals as a food source for humans. Some people believe that for humans to be healthy they need to consume a certain amount of protein and that is best provided from animal sources. Not everyone agrees with this and there are people who are strickly vegetarians. However, throughout history people have used animals as a food source. In the US certain animals such as dogs and horses are banned from being raised and slaughtered for food. In other countries it may be different.
So arguing that we slaughter cattle, chickens, etc., for food purposes is irrelevant to the subject of horses being abused in the racing industry.
Civilization as it has evolved has generally accepted raising and slaughtering animals as a food source for humans. Some people believe that for humans to be healthy they need to consume a certain amount of protein and that is best provided from animal sources. Not everyone agrees with this and there are people who are strickly vegetarians. However, throughout history people have used animals as a food source. In the US certain animals such as dogs and horses are banned from being raised and slaughtered for food. In other countries it may be different.
So arguing that we slaughter cattle, chickens, etc., for food purposes is irrelevant to the subject of horses being abused in the racing industry.
Tell that to Animal Aid, the organisation behind the Race Horse Death Watch: https://www.horsedeathwatch.com/
Their main objective is to promote Veganism: https://www.animalaid.org.uk/
I did do the Vegetarian diet for two years. I felt much better really. Calmer inside.
Animal Aid is pressuring for a ban on Jumps Racing. I think that is right. It is a Cruel Sport. I'd never really thought about it, TBH.
Maybe Flat Racing is OK for the most part. As far as I have got.
But I shall look at the Epsom Derby differently now. FWIW here, the Winner is another unmistakeable son of Frankel, a most famous horse.
Animal Aid is pressuring for a ban on Jumps Racing. I think that is right. It is a Cruel Sport. I'd never really thought about it, TBH.
Maybe Flat Racing is OK for the most part. As far as I have got.
But I shall look at the Epsom Derby differently now. FWIW here, the Winner is another unmistakeable son of Frankel, a most famous horse.
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WAVG-TV announced Friday that the 3 days including the Kentucky Derby gained the local economy $401000000. Up from $375000000 last year. There is no way Kentucky is going to outlaw that.
I could do without horse racing but I am non-competitive. Rare for a US male. I hope in future regulators do something about breeding horses with inst-shatter legs. The lightest legs win, if the horse doesn't break one. I hope HISA comes up with a minimum bone size/weight rule. There has been zero discussion on the news of what was wrong with the seven horses that were euthanized. Endless news clips of a horse ambulance driving around. I doubt the euthanized horses were even available for autopsy to take some data on what not to do.
Doping wasn't an issue this year, at least going by the news reports. Disqualification of the Derby winner last year for a drug administered in a salve made some trainers pay attention.
I could do without horse racing but I am non-competitive. Rare for a US male. I hope in future regulators do something about breeding horses with inst-shatter legs. The lightest legs win, if the horse doesn't break one. I hope HISA comes up with a minimum bone size/weight rule. There has been zero discussion on the news of what was wrong with the seven horses that were euthanized. Endless news clips of a horse ambulance driving around. I doubt the euthanized horses were even available for autopsy to take some data on what not to do.
Doping wasn't an issue this year, at least going by the news reports. Disqualification of the Derby winner last year for a drug administered in a salve made some trainers pay attention.
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