matjans said:
The ones I have compared largely have been car amps. I have compared some home amps but it has been a few years so I wouldn't use that as an example. I have used a few class D amps in car envrionments and have found there is a large difference between a regular one and a great one. I just would like to see some of the people on this site post some comparative analasis of their class D amps when put against what I beleive is generally considered (at least I consider) the highest of the high end amps available. I think that at some point class D amps will compare to these usualy large class A amps but I am not sure that they are there yet. I would like this to happen though because that would mean that the truly super high end would become something much more affordable.
Class D in car audio today:
The truth is they're still using last centuries technology and will likely continue to do so. It's therefore not at all a good basis for making such a comparison.... they're pretty well still only good for sub amps.
The truth is they're still using last centuries technology and will likely continue to do so. It's therefore not at all a good basis for making such a comparison.... they're pretty well still only good for sub amps.
Although many of the lower end companies who use class D amps are using quite old designs I don't belive the higher end companies such as JL are using old designs.
Hi,
I will be the first to admit I'm not fully up to speed on car audio.
However you've volunteered JL as a possibly good brand.... and so I'll use them to make my point.
I took a quick look at their web page.
I've seen in one class .... slash amps I think.. they offered two main types. "Subwoofer" and "full range".
I could look it up for a bit of a laugh:
High-Damping Class D Circuit with discrete control circuitry (U.S. Patent #6,441,685)
But it is already labelled as being for sub woofer use.
Now click on their "full range" amp in the very same "slash" category..... ooops.. they changed it to class A/B???
Don't let them fool ya, they're using the 10 cent circuits of yesteryear, and this is on what they're calling their flagship line.
I've noticed the very same thing with their E class.
Thanks for bringing up JL it was an excellent example to make my point with.
I will be the first to admit I'm not fully up to speed on car audio.
However you've volunteered JL as a possibly good brand.... and so I'll use them to make my point.
I took a quick look at their web page.
I've seen in one class .... slash amps I think.. they offered two main types. "Subwoofer" and "full range".
I could look it up for a bit of a laugh:
High-Damping Class D Circuit with discrete control circuitry (U.S. Patent #6,441,685)
But it is already labelled as being for sub woofer use.
Now click on their "full range" amp in the very same "slash" category..... ooops.. they changed it to class A/B???
Don't let them fool ya, they're using the 10 cent circuits of yesteryear, and this is on what they're calling their flagship line.
I've noticed the very same thing with their E class.
Thanks for bringing up JL it was an excellent example to make my point with.
Speaking of car audio, has anybody tried out panasonic's newer high-end decks? The top three models - CQ-C9901U, 9801,9701 - all use a "digital" amp. They are shown here:
http://www2.panasonic.com/webapp/wc...rogram=11002&cachePartner=7000000000000005702
I wonder which technology they use in these decks, and how they sound?
Edit: Thats interesting, these decks use tripath chips, as told by Crutchfield:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-UHYdaT84w9k/cgi-bin/Prodview.asp?readmore=true&g=300&I=133C9801#Tab
Now to find out which chip they use.......
My guess is the TAA4100(A) chip, a 4x62 watts chip that can operate at 14.4v, and was designed for automotive head units.
http://www2.panasonic.com/webapp/wc...rogram=11002&cachePartner=7000000000000005702
I wonder which technology they use in these decks, and how they sound?
Edit: Thats interesting, these decks use tripath chips, as told by Crutchfield:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-UHYdaT84w9k/cgi-bin/Prodview.asp?readmore=true&g=300&I=133C9801#Tab
Now to find out which chip they use.......
My guess is the TAA4100(A) chip, a 4x62 watts chip that can operate at 14.4v, and was designed for automotive head units.
Probably the Panasonics use TI chips, like their home products. I looked at the TI website, there is a TAS chip with 70W.
High End Class D
In my opinion, having heard something from the new generation of Class D emerging this fall, i would say that Class A and Class A/B is now largely obsolete! Or completely obsolete actually. The last small fallbacks on Class D is now overcome, and a thing of the past. And in any aspect Class D will be better that even the best Class A or A/B amplifiers. Not in years, but in .. months!
Just to make clear, i am not talking about those products that were on sale 1-2 years ago or even now, i am talking about the next generation, coming on sale this winter and on.
In my opinion, having heard something from the new generation of Class D emerging this fall, i would say that Class A and Class A/B is now largely obsolete! Or completely obsolete actually. The last small fallbacks on Class D is now overcome, and a thing of the past. And in any aspect Class D will be better that even the best Class A or A/B amplifiers. Not in years, but in .. months!
Just to make clear, i am not talking about those products that were on sale 1-2 years ago or even now, i am talking about the next generation, coming on sale this winter and on.
ohh, i see. Well i don't believe that an AES event is where you will hear the best new stuff first. I don't think anyone would reveal their best secrets to the industry competition, before releasing it to the market. But that's just my own judgement, it may be wrong.
Did you go there?
Did you go there?
No I didn't, although I think it would have been very interesting. Going to these conventions is quite expensive IMO.
Regards
Charles
Regards
Charles
We have been there, it's was indeed quite interesting. Altough not all papers was at a very high academical level. Anyhow it was very interesting to speak a lot of people behind the Class-D companies.
And it was funny to see that a lot of companies were shocked about the performance of the UcD Class-D feedback technology.....😀
Regards,
Jan-Peter
And it was funny to see that a lot of companies were shocked about the performance of the UcD Class-D feedback technology.....😀
Regards,
Jan-Peter
Charles: So right! And from some of the pre published papers, i would not say that it's all that interesting. Some of the stuff presented seems to be student grade. Which is OK, but is it worth spending a big lump of cash and a good solid weekend on? I think not.
Well they will probably be even more shocked when they will find that it's possible to get even better performance without UcD technology .. he he
Sorry .. I just couldn't resist that one ... (Since i'm now no longer your commercial competitor)
Re: High End Class D
Do you have an idea on where we should be looking for these new amps and what they may cost?
Lars Clausen said:
Do you have an idea on where we should be looking for these new amps and what they may cost?
Can't blame me for trying
*sarcasm*I thought class D already sounded like high end audiophile amps. Are you now telling me that they don't but they might by the time winter comes?
I think that it is very obvious that class D is still in it's baby stages and has a lot more potential to be realized. I don't know how class D could compare to something like the pass labs XA160 in it's current stage but I feel it will get there in the next three to five years (optimisticly).
*sarcasm*I thought class D already sounded like high end audiophile amps. Are you now telling me that they don't but they might by the time winter comes?
I think that it is very obvious that class D is still in it's baby stages and has a lot more potential to be realized. I don't know how class D could compare to something like the pass labs XA160 in it's current stage but I feel it will get there in the next three to five years (optimisticly).
- Status
- Not open for further replies.