I am wanting to know hot to put mdf together. I am building a speaker cabinet and I wan to know how to attach piece to another piece. Thanks.
Erm you could dowel and PVA. Glue it first and wait to dry but be very careful with it as it wont be strong and then come along and drill the holes and insert the dowels with more PVA. Makes everything perfectly aligned up instead of drilling holes first. One method. Cheap and easy.
Or you could biscuit joint them, but presuming your asking this I doubt you have one and they are much more expensive than just a simple dowel, which is perfectly strong. My Zigmahornets while building blew over in the wind and just brushed it off.
Just make sure the edges are nicely sanded and then sealed with a mixture of PVA and water(google it). Plus when painting if you do, here is a "How to" link, which you can aspire, with time and patience.
Just make sure the edges are nicely sanded and then sealed with a mixture of PVA and water(google it). Plus when painting if you do, here is a "How to" link, which you can aspire, with time and patience.
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If you can afford it get a dowel jig, I have a few that I use all the time with MDF, it lines up the joints and add extra mechanical strength, even the one below works fine once you get the hang of it and dosn't cost the earth.
wolfcraft - Products: Dowelmaster (4640000)
Biscuits will also work, but I find dowels easier, and more accurate for lining up, also with dowels you can do a dry fit, the dowels will hold it all together.
wolfcraft - Products: Dowelmaster (4640000)
Biscuits will also work, but I find dowels easier, and more accurate for lining up, also with dowels you can do a dry fit, the dowels will hold it all together.
If you drill and screw into the end grain, you risk splitting.
The pilot hole needs to be quite a bit bigger than a pilot in wood.
This big pilot relative to screw diameter significantly reduces the holding power of the screw. Use very long screws to get some of that holding power back.
Glue on to end grain is not strong. I wonder how much of an improvement the pre-treatment is? I have not tried that.
The pilot hole needs to be quite a bit bigger than a pilot in wood.
This big pilot relative to screw diameter significantly reduces the holding power of the screw. Use very long screws to get some of that holding power back.
Glue on to end grain is not strong. I wonder how much of an improvement the pre-treatment is? I have not tried that.
If can get your hand on this product in the US give it a try, just make sure you mechanically hold the joint as it expands.😱
I am a cabinetmaker and use this all the time, great stuff😉
Industrial Adhesives Manufacturing Woodworking Construction | GLUE GURU
I am a cabinetmaker and use this all the time, great stuff😉
Industrial Adhesives Manufacturing Woodworking Construction | GLUE GURU
I think the strongest joint will be obtained with biscuits...there are also screws that are specifically made for joiniing into the edges of MDF. Here in the USA Woodcraft carries them under the brand Highpoint - the Confirmat style for joining MDF comes in two diameters 5mm for 1/2" MDF and 7mm for 3/4". These are available in kits with a special multistepped drill bit and driver bit along with screws.
Either biscuits or dowels will be fine. Keep in , mind that it is the glue (or other adhesive) that provides a stong joint. If the glue fails and you are relying on the biscuit or whatever, then there is a serious problem.
Biscuits are great for keeping things aligned with the glue dries and also to provide more glue surfaces. However, you will still need clamps (or screws) to pull the pieces together and squeeze out a bit of the glue.
Good pilot holes and drywall screws (coarse thread and don't over-torque them) should work fine.
Biscuits are great for keeping things aligned with the glue dries and also to provide more glue surfaces. However, you will still need clamps (or screws) to pull the pieces together and squeeze out a bit of the glue.
Good pilot holes and drywall screws (coarse thread and don't over-torque them) should work fine.
I've built many cabinets with screws and glue and in my opinion the joints are just as strong as any doweled or biscuited joint, so if you're only going to a do a couple of cabinets and don't want to invest in a biscuit cutter or dowel jig, screws and glue will work just fine.
Hi, I work (but am not employed) with professionals in a cabinet shop so I fairly know what I'm talking about.
Basically any number of different methods will work just fine. All you really need is for the parts to align well and then glue and clamp till dry. Modern glues are stronger than you'll ever need, but alignment is critical. You can use biscuits or dowels, but careful placement by hand/eye will work just fine too. I personally prefer rabbets and dados which causes parts to self align.
In the shop where I work, two slightly different methods are most frequently used. Butt joints, glued, clamped and pin nailed (shoot a nail which holds the pieces together until it is dry). The other is glue and a screw gun. You have to drill and counter the screw holes before driving the screws, sometimes they are pocket holes.
For my personal projects I usually prefer to use two part epoxy instead of water based wood glues.
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Chris, who builds our boxes, is similarily placed, (althou his shop, from your picks as bigger), and our boxes are invariably butt joints. Brad nails are used if boxes are going to be used. The boxes are still clamped. Dados are only used when it is required to suit the cosmetics of the box (bamboo ply).
We do not use MDF (except for vent spacers, or bases).
Back when i was allowed to build speakers, i was still using HDF (often laminated both sides with plastic laminate) and did all assembly with butt joints, glue and screws in lei of clamps. They were never pretty.
dave
I respectfully disagree...Fine Woodworking did extensive destructive testing of a wide range of joint constructions a good number of years ago (Testing Joints to the Breaking Point by Bruce Grey FWW #148). While their testing was in hardwoods the failure mode results can be extended to MDF. They found that a properly done biscuit joint was equal in strength to a through mortise and tenon and superior to butt, rabbetted or doweled joints. The biscuit has 3 functions...joint alignment aid, swells in the presence of water based glues like PVA providing mechanical joint stregth, increases joint glueline area. These benefits are more important with MDF because the fine short fibers in MDF are relatively weakly bound, do not hold fasteners well, and will fail at a simple butt glueline relatively easily. While I would agree that any of these methods may be strong enough for the joints in a speaker box, biscuit joints have clear strength advantages and are simple and quick to execute.
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The majority of cabinets, drawers, cabinet doors, down at the shop where I am are mostly melamine covered particle board which also gets edge banded.
I choose materials for my projects based upon necessity and for what I'm trying to accomplish. If I need it to look good, I use more expensive hardwoods or veneered plywood.
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I've never had a cabinet or enclosure fall apart on me, regardless of the method I used. My cabinets are so strong that it takes considerable energy/effort just to demolish them.
I also like to mention the fact that I prefer epoxy. Not only does epoxy glue the joint, but it fills all the minor gaps too.
I've never seen particle board at Chris' shop (except when we bring it in to do protos we know we are going to burn, it is sonically better than MDF).
The edge bander you posted a picture of looks the saem (to me) as the one at Chris' shop.
Same here... hence no MDF for serious speaker boxes (almost all of them).
dave
The shop where I sometimes work doesn't make loudspeaker enclosures. They make cabinets for medical/dental practices, offices. They do Corian counter tops too.
How come this website is suddenly not letting me upload pics? Did I exceed my file limit for the day or something?
I second that. I built a set of cabs from MDF...then decided to do the cabs out of ply. After removing the drivers from the MDF...I picked up the cab and SMASHED it onto the concrete outside to do an "impact" test. Those E'fers broke everywhere else first before the butt joints were damaged. I just simply used carpenters glue and had clamped the panels together during construction.
Chris's doesn't so speakers, mostly just Chris and the occasional worker after hours. They do more high end stuff than run of the mill cabinets,
No quotas only files size limits (test attachment). Sometimes image upload gets balky, i just keep stabbing the upload button till it goes.
Don't know...
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