5532 or 5534 by far. Both SSL and non-discrete Neve. TL072 are used for less expensive consoles, especially at EQ circuit.
Consumer / Prosumer consoles, such as Mackie, I don't know.
I have heard 5534 is designed by Rupert Neve, and it was the game changer.
Funny thing is the most recent SSL probably do not use 5532/34 any more, but majority of the mixing engineer still prefer the sound of old G or E series SSL that uses 5534/32. Easier to mix.
Last edited:
Also the most popular microphone gain stage for classical recording last 20 years is Millennia Media, which is basically nothing but a balanced opamp gain stage without transformer. The opamp used is secret, the number is scratched out.
The NE5532 is a dual NE5534 which hails from the TDA1034 designed by Philips in the 80-ies, then (when Philips acquired Signetics) morphed into the Signetics NE5534.
I have still a few TDA1034's, as well as Signetics and Philips marked NE5534's and even some RC5534's build by Raytheon and used in their mil projects. I've even seen them in anti-aircraft missiles, imagine, an RC5534 pulling 12 gees! Howzzat for slew rate ;-)
Jan
I have still a few TDA1034's, as well as Signetics and Philips marked NE5534's and even some RC5534's build by Raytheon and used in their mil projects. I've even seen them in anti-aircraft missiles, imagine, an RC5534 pulling 12 gees! Howzzat for slew rate ;-)
Jan
So it's not that clear 😉
It is interesting. In the previous test, the parts preferences were arranged almost exactly according to parameters of the parts.
In this new test, with higher resolution files (as I was requested) and much higher voltage level, there is no logic. Absolutely no logic in preferences 😀
Last edited:
That limits the choices a lot. If one really cared decapping is not that hard but I doubt the result is very interesting.
Last edited:
Ah, I forgot to mention infamous API opamp used for API consoles, which has nice distinctive colorlation. It might be interesting for home audio use.
The poll has been closed and it's time to reveal the parts used:
rr – LM4562 (1 vote)
ss – OPA2134 first take (2 votes)
tt – MA1458 (2 votes)
uu – TL072 (9 votes – big winner 🙂)
vv – OPA2134 second take (1 vote)
So, according to the poll, the winner is TL072 😀. I have also received preferences via PM and I tried to create a chart from them.
This shows a different view, very contradictory and there are not many mutual preferences among the voters.
Moreover, none of the votes was supported by a valid ABX result, so I would leave to a reader to make his conclusion himself. However, there is one very interesting result, “Voter 2” preferred the parts just according their parameters with one exception, two takes of OPA2134. Great job, Mark! 🙂
I have prepared some more information, together with measurements, and placed it to my web:
Op amps listening test with hires files
Thanks to everyone who participated in this test!
rr – LM4562 (1 vote)
ss – OPA2134 first take (2 votes)
tt – MA1458 (2 votes)
uu – TL072 (9 votes – big winner 🙂)
vv – OPA2134 second take (1 vote)
So, according to the poll, the winner is TL072 😀. I have also received preferences via PM and I tried to create a chart from them.
This shows a different view, very contradictory and there are not many mutual preferences among the voters.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Moreover, none of the votes was supported by a valid ABX result, so I would leave to a reader to make his conclusion himself. However, there is one very interesting result, “Voter 2” preferred the parts just according their parameters with one exception, two takes of OPA2134. Great job, Mark! 🙂
I have prepared some more information, together with measurements, and placed it to my web:
Op amps listening test with hires files
Thanks to everyone who participated in this test!
As we agreed yesterday, the new file, if added during the valid poll time, could spoil the results. So I am adding the new file today, after the poll has been closed. If anyone is interested, please try it and tell your opinion, in a comparison with the older files.
http://pmacura.cz/ww.zip
Very interesting Pavel, and congratulations on running the test and collating the results.
I think the 1458 must be a fake and is probably a rebadged 2604 or something 😉
Seriously though, I've always championed the TL072 despite all the negative attitudes in recent years.
I am somewhat surprised the 2134 was the one that I ultimately picked as worst (both examples) although that said, it is a device I couldn't get along with when I used it in my own builds.
These are my notes that I submitted to Pavel for those interested.
Notes.
Saturday 17th June.
rr Consistently worst. I suspect this is the 1458.
ss ???? not sure on this one.
tt Ditto above
uu Seems smoothest and with best imaging.
vv Again, not sure.
Foobar results sort of inconclusive although the first time I tried rr vs any of the others and I got a reasonable result.
More listening needed.
Sunday 18th June AM.
No Foobar today or not yet anyway. I just keep picking tracks and listening in Media Player. Still something about rr I do not like. Can not reliably differentiate the others.
Monday 19th June. Haven't listened to any 🙁
Tuesday 20th June AM. Trying something different 🙂
uu still seems smoothest. It struck me the most again today. I was comparing against tt and the fact I think I hear a difference suggests that tt could be a 1458.
Another go. uu again seems smoothest. Is that a sign of less hf or perhaps of less distortion. Hmmm ?
I think tt and rr are the worst or roughest sounding.
I haven't voted yet and so not a final result.
Two listening sessions today using the MP3 version of your files.
This is what I wrote in my notes:
Wednesday 21st June. Limitations of laptop replay I think are the limiting factor. Trouble is I can not play the files through anything else in their native form. I've converted them to MP3/320kbs and popped them into my Marantz Pearl Lite.
Yes, this sounds noticeably different... I think ss and vv are the worst by some margin. The opening vocals have a roughness and 'shouty midrange' quality to them, the hallmarks I would attribute to a 741, none of the other files have this peculiar quality. Sorting the others is more difficult although uu seems smooth and inoffensive. I like that and would suspect that could be a TL072 type device. The OPA2134 is a device I have dabbled with in the past. Not a fan at the time although I couldn't really say why. Lets just say it didn't have long term listening satisfaction. I think that could be tt.
I would also add that ss and vv sound as though you are listening in a smaller and 'harder' acoustic setting, with harder in this sense meaning the effect you hear in a room with little soft furnishings and reflective walls.
I'm voting for uu based on sonic appeal.
I'll have a listen to your new file later, either today or tomorrow.
I think the 1458 must be a fake and is probably a rebadged 2604 or something 😉
Seriously though, I've always championed the TL072 despite all the negative attitudes in recent years.
I am somewhat surprised the 2134 was the one that I ultimately picked as worst (both examples) although that said, it is a device I couldn't get along with when I used it in my own builds.
These are my notes that I submitted to Pavel for those interested.
Notes.
Saturday 17th June.
rr Consistently worst. I suspect this is the 1458.
ss ???? not sure on this one.
tt Ditto above
uu Seems smoothest and with best imaging.
vv Again, not sure.
Foobar results sort of inconclusive although the first time I tried rr vs any of the others and I got a reasonable result.
More listening needed.
Sunday 18th June AM.
No Foobar today or not yet anyway. I just keep picking tracks and listening in Media Player. Still something about rr I do not like. Can not reliably differentiate the others.
Monday 19th June. Haven't listened to any 🙁
Tuesday 20th June AM. Trying something different 🙂
uu still seems smoothest. It struck me the most again today. I was comparing against tt and the fact I think I hear a difference suggests that tt could be a 1458.
Another go. uu again seems smoothest. Is that a sign of less hf or perhaps of less distortion. Hmmm ?
I think tt and rr are the worst or roughest sounding.
I haven't voted yet and so not a final result.
Two listening sessions today using the MP3 version of your files.
This is what I wrote in my notes:
Wednesday 21st June. Limitations of laptop replay I think are the limiting factor. Trouble is I can not play the files through anything else in their native form. I've converted them to MP3/320kbs and popped them into my Marantz Pearl Lite.
Yes, this sounds noticeably different... I think ss and vv are the worst by some margin. The opening vocals have a roughness and 'shouty midrange' quality to them, the hallmarks I would attribute to a 741, none of the other files have this peculiar quality. Sorting the others is more difficult although uu seems smooth and inoffensive. I like that and would suspect that could be a TL072 type device. The OPA2134 is a device I have dabbled with in the past. Not a fan at the time although I couldn't really say why. Lets just say it didn't have long term listening satisfaction. I think that could be tt.
I would also add that ss and vv sound as though you are listening in a smaller and 'harder' acoustic setting, with harder in this sense meaning the effect you hear in a room with little soft furnishings and reflective walls.
I'm voting for uu based on sonic appeal.
I'll have a listen to your new file later, either today or tomorrow.
It (the MA1458) was a part produced by Tesla, former Czechoslovakia. The part was famous for its unequal production quality, especially regarding noise. Maybe it just happened that I got some better one 😉. But the intrinsic low slew rate had been always preserved 😉.
hahaha, I thought uu is 5534, but no surprise.
There is a good reason that 5534/2 and TL072 have been used by the console companies extensively; easy to mix. We call it "glue" effect, which glues each instrument in the ensemble together, makes the music sounds more like music than just bunch of instruments are playing at the same time. 072 is a bit more smeared, and 5534 is punchier, but they both can help for this magic. API opamp does this very well. We can clearly hear this effect from uu.
There is a good reason that 5534/2 and TL072 have been used by the console companies extensively; easy to mix. We call it "glue" effect, which glues each instrument in the ensemble together, makes the music sounds more like music than just bunch of instruments are playing at the same time. 072 is a bit more smeared, and 5534 is punchier, but they both can help for this magic. API opamp does this very well. We can clearly hear this effect from uu.
For the record I will post my PM to Pavel:
Hi Pavel,
I have listened a bit to the hi-res files. I seem to rank them in approximately the following order:
rr
ss
uu
tt
vv
with the ones lower down in the list sounding increasingly forward. However, vv while sounding perhaps the most forward, also seems somehow gritty.
I have no preference for any of them one way or the other.
Don't know if I could ABX them, as its pretty hard to hear any difference much of the time, but when I am very fresh, there seems to be a little difference.
Maybe I will give a try to ABX-ing one near the top of my list to one near the bottom. That's probably my best bet to test well.
Best,
Mark
Hi Pavel,
I have listened a bit to the hi-res files. I seem to rank them in approximately the following order:
rr
ss
uu
tt
vv
with the ones lower down in the list sounding increasingly forward. However, vv while sounding perhaps the most forward, also seems somehow gritty.
I have no preference for any of them one way or the other.
Don't know if I could ABX them, as its pretty hard to hear any difference much of the time, but when I am very fresh, there seems to be a little difference.
Maybe I will give a try to ABX-ing one near the top of my list to one near the bottom. That's probably my best bet to test well.
Best,
Mark
Once again big thanks to all who have participated. A great test and a lot of fun. Should be this way.
I sent these messages to Pavel.
...But now, with 24/96 and 2 Vrms the worst is not as bad when 16/44 and 20 mVrms.
ODAC + AV Marantz SR4500 + KEF Q100 speakers
Easy again... when the singer sings.
The best: uu 10/10
ss: 9/10
vv: 8/10
tt: 7/10
rr: 6/10
-
ODAC + iFi iCAN + Takstar ts-670 (tweaked and recabled)
The best: uu 10/10
ss: 9/10
vv: 8/10
tt: 7/10
rr: 6/10
-
ODAC + AV Marantz SR4500 + Takstar ts671 with HPF at 180 Hz and Q=0.7 to adjust the impedance (120 Ohms vs 330 Ohms from Marantz)
Old picture, with HPF at 172 Hz: http://maty.galeon.com/WP-imagenes/s...172hz-q-07.png
Easy again... when the singer sings.
The best: uu 10/10
ss: 9/10
vv: 8/10
tt: 7/10
rr: 6/10
Again, the rr is worst. It is more easy now than before with iFi iCAN (class A and SNR 117 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ) Why? I do not know.
I love my cheap tweaked AV Marantz SR4500.
-> http://maty.galeon.com/WP-imagenes/h...cker-x4-ME.jpg
I presume the original file would not sound like uu, and probably closer to rr, but does it matter? 🙂
- Status
- Not open for further replies.