I usually (every day) use CAD (not primarily LTSpice), but I agree with Walter on this one.
Design is much faster with it, but -as I wrote earlier- the product just so perfect as the models.
Modelling/simulating is restricted, without real testing (or exactly knowing the operation of components and layout), may bring unexpected results.
So, returning to the original question, to choose based on ONLY simulated results (not knowing the actual structure/schematic), which depend significantly on approximate mathematical models, IMO no different to shot in the dark.
Design is much faster with it, but -as I wrote earlier- the product just so perfect as the models.
Modelling/simulating is restricted, without real testing (or exactly knowing the operation of components and layout), may bring unexpected results.
So, returning to the original question, to choose based on ONLY simulated results (not knowing the actual structure/schematic), which depend significantly on approximate mathematical models, IMO no different to shot in the dark.
Seems like the herd still don’t get it. It is still about harmonic pattern/profile, for which an example was presented, NOT about simulations!
Waltube, Zintalo and others must have really crappy loudspeakers. Why waste time designinh amps if they think amplifier distortion will be buried in their speakers distortion 🤣.
My system has documented speaker distortion levels in the ballpark of 0.1% and lower at normal listening levels.
Maybe you have invested in to expensive OPT’s at the expence of descent drivers😉.
My system has documented speaker distortion levels in the ballpark of 0.1% and lower at normal listening levels.
Maybe you have invested in to expensive OPT’s at the expence of descent drivers😉.
Have checked the correct box and you are now welcome to message me. You can also try lars(at)soderquist.se .
MfG
Lars
please let us know you speaker system.
From my point of view I know exactly what I am writing.
Because I test the stuff I made on desk and in field.
And it is a limitation to say that the distortion of the speaker is great to cover the one from amp.
The goal is to get from the amp the lower thd possible in a wide band of frequency at every level.
And with s.e. is not so simply, mainly in bas region.
This is why I say that the thd vs frequency at different power is important to have a real idea.
At the end I prefer to set a different system for my friends ( many are ex-customer)
One example:
This a system full tube; phono,line, crossover, DAC 4 monos with 4x KT150 each made by me ( one for bass, the other for mid-high)
As you see the speaker are a little bit good, B&W 800D2
Unfortunately I miss ( I don't remember where are!) the photo of the other system, always with tube crossover, 300B stereo p-p, s.e. 2A3, phono, line and dac.
And the VOT with original Altec speaker
Walter
Ciao Waltube,
Always ready to go into defense of your own excellence, are you?
About your low effiency speakers, they will probably reveal your amps distortion at almost clipping.
I have choosen a completely opposite selection of high sensitivity drivers using horns from 350Hz and up.
Search JBL 244* and Altec drivers and you will understand. As I am not as eager as you to show my gear, I can message you more images, if you are the suspicious kind. And no fuzz about the midbass, the 414’s are cut at 60Hz.
Always ready to go into defense of your own excellence, are you?
About your low effiency speakers, they will probably reveal your amps distortion at almost clipping.
I have choosen a completely opposite selection of high sensitivity drivers using horns from 350Hz and up.
Search JBL 244* and Altec drivers and you will understand. As I am not as eager as you to show my gear, I can message you more images, if you are the suspicious kind. And no fuzz about the midbass, the 414’s are cut at 60Hz.
Last edited:
(Sigh) Do you actually expect to get good answers to a question like this here? Do you expect that someone here has done some solid research on this very narrow question? I mean, I'm sure you are going to get several who are going to throw an anecdotal opinion or two at you, but this is the sort of question that would take a very well-designed experiment to get to the bottom of.
My opinion is that these profiles would be very difficult to differentiate between, especially in a blind test. But again, that's based on just some of my own experiences and not a conclusion that I hold 100% confidence in.
I mean, I get it. I get frustrated with the responses in this forum where I ask a direct question and everyone goes off on tangents, but there isn't a lot to go on to give this question a conclusive answer. It is very narrow and extremely specific to some things that are likely to be very difficult to perceive. That may have something to do with the fact that not many people are engaging directly with your thought experiment.
You're asking the "herd" to walk you through the tonal differences between 5 near-identical dog whistles, and you're getting frustrated about other people's stupidity???
I have explained my point of view; the start point is wrong for different reason if we consider the entire system.
Looking at one parameter is not a right way
Walter
You wrote that the speaker we use are poor! So I sent just an example
The system as I sent ( 90 dB ) is more efficent in terms of sonic performances respect to High efficent speaker.
If you cut all signal below 60 Hz you loose a lot of information mainly if you play classic music well registred.
But it is a normal approach around high efficency ( as VOT) otherwise you will get lot of distortion when the level goes up. Also for mid-high freq.
Then your assumption that amps goes in clipping is out of the reality because you don't know the technical aspect arount that system.
Step back; as mentioned more than one time the most important test is THD vs frequency at different level, specially for s.e. where the power is limited and, in some cases, the quality of OT make difference. Of course in parallel with a wide freq. response.
And the THD vs Level, this help to understand what happen when the amp reach the saturation; normally for a good s.e. the curve has a soft increment.