Me thinks you better do some more research on the timeline history of Linkwitz dipole subs. 🙂
Dave.
I don’t know who flamed you over other subjects, but it was not me. There is already plenty here for that purpose.
It’s apparent that you’re not really serious about building the LXmini +2. If you were a mere $55 for the incremental +2 plans would not stop you. It’s a drop in the bucket relative to the $2,000 total cost of the project.
So claiming that the small extra fee has stopped you and then starting a whole thread to talk about it is disingenuous. If you wanted to talk about performance that would be one thing. But to grip about 55 bucks reveals that you really aren’t serious about this project at all.
Fair enough. It is now apparent that it is indeed more serious than I originally considered. And to be fair, I wasn’t planning to buy everything at once. As I said, I am planning to move and step one should’ve been to find a way to listen. I obviously failed in that regard. Step two (had I liked them) would’ve been to get the plans. Step three would be to figure out how to boost the WAF a bit.
It seems I’ve triggered something, more to some than others. Hopefully any future posts will be less irritating.
I hope I can be forgiven one day.
It seems I’ve triggered something, more to some than others. Hopefully any future posts will be less irritating.
I hope I can be forgiven one day.
Worry not. They say it takes all sorts to make a world, and we have all of those sorts here. Add in the fact that Audio discussions bring out the strangest in people with the internet age problem of keyboard warriors and it's easy for misunderstanding to occur. And many type first, engage brain later.
But in the grand scheme its all good 🙂
But in the grand scheme its all good 🙂
Well it might go down as a contender for “worst first post” but if I set the bar low enough, hopefully I can show improvement next time.
Z
PS: which lamp cord is the best speaker wire 🙂 I kid....
Z
PS: which lamp cord is the best speaker wire 🙂 I kid....
Interestingly there is a another parallel here for me with this thread.
The first time I contacted SL in early 2000 was soon after I heard the Heresys.
They had the gut-punching character and "speed" that I craved along with being efficient. Everything else however was horribly wrong with particularly an upper mid. and treble that was absolutely ear-piercing and no bass to speak of.
I asked SL at the time if he'd consider doing and efficient version of the Phoenix, but it didn't interest him. 😱
So in the interest of truly trying to help you, and particularly before you commit to large sums of money, the first question from the top is do you want open baffle speakers? LXminis being OB will sound significantly different from box speakers.
And if it's open baffle that you are after, there are some other DIY alternatives that come in at a much lower price and simpler build complexity. You might want to try some of those first. If so, I'll be glad to offer a few suggestions.
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He does not want to part with his hard-earned money really, or just tight with his money. If he says this in the first part everyone would understand.
If it is his first build he should definitely build something less stratospheric price wise… remember, like a cookie (hard to just have one), a diyer rarely builds just one set of speakers.
And that first build will inform you as to the direction you want to go, as you will learn much.
dave
And that first build will inform you as to the direction you want to go, as you will learn much.
dave
Without any inference intended on the work in question, purely as a matter of historical fact, dipole subwoofers existed for decades prior to Backman's paper (Celestion's System 6000 being but one example) and as far as I know, he never claimed novelty in that regard. Linkwitz presented dipole subs on his website in the late 1990s as part of his Phoenix project, which was itself an extension of his prior commercial designs for Audio Artistry.
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Well, once again I’ll apologize for misjudging this. I didn’t really think I was being that tight. The only immediate expense was the plans. Not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things but again it piqued my interest as far as what was typical. I thought it might be worth posting (which honestly was me seeking a quick answer instead of spending time researching other plan costs - poor form I realize). But honestly if it delivered the overwhelming sound most claim, it seems a steal. I’m not quite sure where the $2k came from ($105+$55+$805 less inert materials), but because of (1) my pending relo and (2) the potential for creativity to embellish the looks it seemed to be a long term project. Honestly I’ve got my hands full with the house right now anyway and couldn’t get to honestly building it for a while. In the mean time I could be thinking about the “inert” parts...I have some leftover quartz from a bath remodel I did that could be good for the base for example. I’d try to tackle the PVC thing when I learned more about what degrees of freedom are available there. But $1k less amps seems cheap to me (PS, the idea was to get the +2 later pending how it sounded) My egregious misstep was to assume it was ok to question the only immediate expense (plans) as it related to other popular designs. I’ll wear my Scarlet letter for penance.
Anyway, classicalfan I have not heard OB designs so yet another fault of mine. I got excited about the reviews and thought (given the value and creative options) that it would be a good first effort. Hell, the worst (or so I thought) is that if I didn’t like them I could sell them later. I saw a pair sold on HiFishark for $600. So a loss of $400 (approximating and ignoring the +2 for now) for the experience didn’t seem that bad.
I will focus on more basic, 101-level stuff first I think and not get wound up until I can execute more promptly. The kit was likely to go into storage for a while until I find the next dream home. I’ll work on educating myself in the meantime.
Thanks all,
Z
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I have built both the LXmini and SL's Orion and I found the cost of the plans to be very reasonable for the value obtained. To me the distinction here is between DIY and BIY...if you want the often frustrating and difficult task of developing a speaker then you don't want to pay for someone else's IP. OTOH if you want to build a well engineered speaker to obtain the proven results without becoming a speaker engineer yourself then it's a no-brainer. I have enjoyed my Orions for well over a decade and LXminis for maybe 5 or 6 years. Compared to other ways I spend money to get enjoyment these two are a fantastic bargain.
And actually, SL was "converted" to a dipole woofer advocate fully ten years before that. 🙂
Electro-acoustic models
Dave.
He was indeed, I was referring primarily to either projects or products, but yes, SL was a long-term advocate; as I recall it was this that partly instigated the AA range. I've always rather liked the Vivaldi in particular -while the most compromised, it was also the most practical of the AA line of speakers in terms of its dimensions (albeit requiring a goodly amount of power) and plug & play characteristic.
More or less a household name for anyone keeping an eye for AES articles on speakers.
I have found his work good and interesting, but all too often leaving me want more.
Every system is a compromise, Juha points out the adavatages of an OB bass, but that doe snot mean they do not have a similarily large set of compromises. Been there, done that, abandoned the approach.
dave
As i have said, something about OBs that just doesn’t sit right sonically. Across at least a dozen examples.
dave
dave
Perhaps you haven't heard good ones set up correctly. Were you disappointed with the low frequency response?