fullrange vs 2way desktop build

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

gentelmen,, i have been looking around for months on this site and others, i am trying to decide on a full range desktop set (like the alpair 6 for size) or if i should build a small two way. Having never heard a good fullrange i am have no comparisons or thoughts other than what i read...I have above average/proffesional woodworking skills. I do not enjoy designing crossovers or figuring out box volumes so much as the cabinet work and sound enjoyment. I have built a few sets of two ways,mtms, subwoofers, etc.. I have specific goals in looks and sound so i thought you all might be able to tell me honestly if i should consider fullrange or build a small two way..

my goals are;
near field listening, I mac with eqalizing capabilities..

cabinet width of about 4-6" max

cabinet height of about 16-18"

cabinet depth of about 4-7max

slot port on the face of the cabinet,, i like the look and always wanted to try one.

powered by a small t amp 20 watts or so

i appreciate high end crispness always using metal/aluminum dome tweeters in my past speaker builds,,,silk tweeters do not have the same crispness that i like

good low base extension, I dont mind eqalizing..

music selections are rock, pop, light dance..


I am cosidering using these two ways designs but perhaps altering them slightly to fit the above demensions,

Piccolata Mini Monitor


Or perhaps waiting for the release of the new alpair 6..


your thoughts??

 

[Cal Weldon]

Try an FR on it's own and add the tweeter later if required. You can do it as simply as a 1mfd cap for the XO. Works for a lot of people.

 

[rjbond3rd]

Speaking strictly as a newb, if you (a) don't like crossover design, (b) like metal drivers (c) enjoy rock/pop/dance and (d) don't need really high efficiency, any of these drivers are fine choices: Alpair 7, Alpair 10, CHR-70 and Jordan JX92S. I too enjoy the beautiful "shimmer" I've heard from metal cones.

Box geometry definitely affects your final response (along with boundaries, diffraction etc.) The normal design process would be to start with some rough dims and spend time iterating to get something really optimal for your situation.

But since you are not looking to get into that stuff (I can't blame you), if it were me locked into that geometry / dims, personally I'd try sealed, maybe aperiodic, keep the volume reasonable. Ported has more factors and you have to avoid driving them below the box's tuning frequency lest the driver exceed its mechanical limits.

So I would say, personally, that I wouldn't hesitate to stick those drivers into a sealed, maybe periodic, but if you're not going to use a box calculator, you'll be optimizing your build either through trial and error, or not at all. Eventually, software becomes a great time-saver but it's also good to learn stuff hands-on.

 

[picowallspeaker]

I never heard Mark Audio speakers ,but they have good reputation.
The Piccolata (maybe the author mean "Piccoletto",which is "small size )
looks good either ...even if with bigger woofers for me the tweeter has more
sense . I wouldn't mind changing the position of the port(s)from rear to front panel (maybe on the bottom)since it gathers all the dusty bass information which may interfere with the clean emission of the driver .
BTW I love Imac sound as itself .

 

[vinylkid58]

Or perhaps waiting for the release of the new alpair 6..

Why wait? The original Alpair 6's are pretty good.

jeff

 

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

what are the sound quality differeces between the two?

sealed vs full?

where will i notice the difference?

 

[vinylkid58]

what are the sound quality differeces between the two?

Don't know, haven't heard the Mk II's.

sealed vs full?

http://homepage.mac.com/tlinespeakers/FAL/downloads/mMar-Ken6-1v0-map-231009.pdf

jeff

 

[Scottmoose]

I have. I had one of the first pairs of paper cone pre-production prototypes through here a few months back; they're now with Dave. Even without the Matsubara-san VC & spider which the production drivers will have, the new model is a big step forward from the original (which remains a v. good unit for its type).

 

[planet10]

I figure the best of the 1st gen metal cone drivers, i fully expect, based on hearing the same set of paper protos Scott had, and the production protos of the A10.2 vrs the old A10, that the new A6 will be better.

dave

 

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

dave, how does the alpair 6 compair to the FR125? I have always appreciated the looks of the fr125, but figured i might be best to use newest technology....

kinda wish i could hear several speakers before i decide..


i see that CSS is now offering the fr125 with a tweeter,,,can i assume on its own it lacks upper detail?

 

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

But since you are not looking to get into that stuff (I can't blame you), if it were me locked into that geometry / dims, personally I'd try sealed, maybe aperiodic, keep the volume reasonable. Ported has more factors and you have to avoid driving them below the box's tuning frequency lest the driver exceed its mechanical limits.

So I would say, personally, that I wouldn't hesitate to stick those drivers into a sealed, maybe periodic, but if you're not going to use a box calculator, you'll be optimizing your build either through trial and error, or not at all. Eventually, software becomes a great time-saver but it's also good to learn stuff hands-on.

Thanks,, I think i came across wrong,, i do intend on calculating the best box possible,, just dont enjoy it... I am hoping to find a box design that fits my size and look wants and build that.. I am willing to make bass sacrifices to keep the size i am looking for.. if i must i will add a small sub into the mix...I have been looking at the anarchy or sdx7,, I bieleve t&b has a small sub that i can throw under the desk as well ..

never having heard a good fullrange,, i am not sure if i will need or want a sub at all, I would prefer not...

 

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

http://homepage.mac.com/tlinespeakers/FAL/downloads/folded-halfTower-0v8-map-140610.pdf

this is about as close as i have found to what i am after visually,,, just way to big..any plans similar with a 6" x 7" footprint and about 18 inches high that anyone has seen or built??

 

[planet10]

Some people think the FR125 benifits from a tweeter. Not me.

The FR125 is a 4.5" driver, the A6 is a 3". My guess, based on an extrapolation, the new A6 will be more detailed with greater downward dynamic range, but won't be as bass capable.

dave

 

[planet10]

kinda wish i could hear several speakers before i decide..

Where are you? On average, shouldn't be more than a couple or 3 days drive to come by and visit

dave

 

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

Well,, not sure if anyone is interested but with the help of Dave i have decided on a modified mMar ken6. I wanted the box taller to fit some spalted maple i am going to use on the face, no point wasting it. I also wanted the slot port on top so i am going to invert the box..

I got a smokin deal on the gen1 Alpair 6 from Bob, I gota say these drivers are built well..

I started cutting wood today, I decided to use mdf as i had it laying around and trust it with veneer. Cant stand the dust though..

A few pics of the spalted maple I got off Ebay, it was meant for a guitar
and tiger maple veneer and a small bit of Macassar ebony i will use as an accent..

 

[Bigun]

Gorgeous looking woods - how will you attache the veneer to the MDF ?

 

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

i use wood glue or polyurethane glue depending on my mood I have done full speaker builds with contact cement on raw wood veneer and have yet to see an issue.. most advise against it but i am still not sure its a problem done correctly..

still coughing up MDF dust.....

 

[chrisb]

i use wood glue or polyurethane glue depending on my mood I have done full speaker builds with contact cement on raw wood veneer and have yet to see an issue.. most advise against it but i am still not sure its a problem done correctly..

still coughing up MDF dust.....

I'd suggest that with the precious nature of your selected veneers the iron-on glue method would give you much more flexibility for positioning & grain matching/wrapping than either cold press or contact cement.


.... MDF?

 

[Andrewbee]

I have done full speaker builds with contact cement on raw wood veneer and have yet to see an issue.. most advise against it but i am still not sure its a problem done correctly..

I always use contact cement ... Weldwood brand and after countless applications over the years have yet to have any problems. (Now that I have made the statement something will probably start to blister / bubble

I agree with Chrisb regarding the flexibility of the iron on method 100% however. You have the opportunity to get the positioning "prexactly" before adhesion whereas with the contact cement its juggling dowels / bits of paper and lots of "body English" to position it just so.

 

[JOHNNYFAMOUS]

thanks guys, i will pass on the iron on method.. just dont seem right to me. Wood glue is a non convertable coating. I cant see how heating it up after it has dried would give you a superior bond over solvent based glues.. perhaps outside where you might deal with weather (heavy expansion and contraction) but inside in a controlled environment, i think contact or a cold pressed polyurethane will far surpass "reactivated" wood glue.. Not to say it dont work

only issue with the polyurethane is the foam,, if you can learn to work with it,,its strong!


So curious though,, will a box made of plywood sound better than a box made of mdf?? i think no,, but????