Hi,
I recently bought some of these and upon initial listening I ws pleasantly surprised at the quality of sound coming from these things.
Ok, no bass, but still....
After more extended listening, I find I notice the HF peak noticable, slightly over crisp.
So I knocked together a very rough RLC notch with almost no maths, and I think it is an improvement.
Edit: reviewing the datasheet again, I have centred about 13k not 8k, assuming I did anything right.
0.33mH, 0.47uF and 3R3 by the way.
I'mlooking for alternate experience with these drivers from others.
Did you employ a notch filter? What values did you use? (I might be way off...)
I'm thinking that these may form the mid HF for a FAST/WAW, low XO 2 way, design.
So really anything could be useful to me!
TIA
I recently bought some of these and upon initial listening I ws pleasantly surprised at the quality of sound coming from these things.
Ok, no bass, but still....
After more extended listening, I find I notice the HF peak noticable, slightly over crisp.
So I knocked together a very rough RLC notch with almost no maths, and I think it is an improvement.
Edit: reviewing the datasheet again, I have centred about 13k not 8k, assuming I did anything right.
0.33mH, 0.47uF and 3R3 by the way.
I'mlooking for alternate experience with these drivers from others.
Did you employ a notch filter? What values did you use? (I might be way off...)
I'm thinking that these may form the mid HF for a FAST/WAW, low XO 2 way, design.
So really anything could be useful to me!
TIA
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Hi, the peak that the factory response curve shows around 8k, is real as can be.....shows up in my measurements no matter the box design.. from single driver in baffle, to multiple use designs.
Kill it, but gently 🙂
I use dsp and its easy.
No clue at all, how to do it with passive.
Good luck !
Kill it, but gently 🙂
I use dsp and its easy.
No clue at all, how to do it with passive.
Good luck !
I have the 4FE32, the neo version. I find the sound very pleasant to listen to. The peak is there but it is not shouty and I could live with it. Beautiful vocals. And unlike normal speakers, this speaker plays well soft and excellent for late night listening. In the end I fixed it in a back loaded horn. Specifically this one, which is rather cheap considering the work required to build a BLH.
https://www.amazon.com/FOSTEX-speaker-box-P1000-BH-1unit/dp/B0143XNUKQ
The bass is limited because it has a slightly rising response and I didn't put in a baffle step filter.
Maybe after you add in a baffle step filter, it would balance out the frequency response a bit more and you won't need a notch filter. I was listening with the speaker facing the front, so it was off axis. That probably tamed it a bit.
If going for WAW, I would suggest the little brother 3fe22 or 3fe25. Better clarity and treble.
With the very high sensitivity, it will work nicely with a nice SET...
Oon
https://www.amazon.com/FOSTEX-speaker-box-P1000-BH-1unit/dp/B0143XNUKQ
The bass is limited because it has a slightly rising response and I didn't put in a baffle step filter.
Maybe after you add in a baffle step filter, it would balance out the frequency response a bit more and you won't need a notch filter. I was listening with the speaker facing the front, so it was off axis. That probably tamed it a bit.
If going for WAW, I would suggest the little brother 3fe22 or 3fe25. Better clarity and treble.
With the very high sensitivity, it will work nicely with a nice SET...
Oon
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I did use the neo (4FE32) long ago for a mono mobile garage system (on a trolly) for a friend, 2 of them in a line with a woofer. The woofer was a Monacor 10" paper woofer (don't remember the model) and it sounds very good when used with a sub. Don't know the cabinet specs anymore (it's like +5 years ago). Crossover was active (Behringer dsp) and the amp is an old Realistic stereo amp, one channel for top (4FE32 x2), one for the monacor woofer. It was not ment very hifi (it's used in a car workshop of a car tuner) but it sounded way better than expected.
Nope. I bought the 4FE35 as they were only £10, less than a 1/2 their normal price and I needed something suitable to fill my Blanda Bowl project, that never got anywhere in 5 years
I have 4 of them.
I made one pair in 7 ro 8 lit box with no filter they are very good but need more bass. Need large enclosure but still the low frequencies are poor.
So I am looking for a mid-low or a low woofer (10 inch) to to put them together and make a 2 way simple system.
Thanks! Nice to hear other experiences.
I am using them in about 2 litres closed box, and clearly there is no bass, with Fs of 100Hz and such Qts, they are warm, and make lovely midrange. The treble isnt awful either.
I'm finishing off a long overdue IKEA Blanda bowl project (only about 10 years late) using the 200mm bamboo bowls as almost spherical enclosure for them.
I'm planning a sub to sit underneath the spheres, and yesterday I bought some Dayton ptmini 6 planar tweeters, just in case I decide I dont like the Faital treble. I'll mount these in front of the faital mids.
I am using them in about 2 litres closed box, and clearly there is no bass, with Fs of 100Hz and such Qts, they are warm, and make lovely midrange. The treble isnt awful either.
I'm finishing off a long overdue IKEA Blanda bowl project (only about 10 years late) using the 200mm bamboo bowls as almost spherical enclosure for them.
I'm planning a sub to sit underneath the spheres, and yesterday I bought some Dayton ptmini 6 planar tweeters, just in case I decide I dont like the Faital treble. I'll mount these in front of the faital mids.
the spherical bowl is beautifull project and combine them with a woofer..yes I always wanted to do. do you have any picture? What do you think about Faital 10PR310 ??
Sure....
I have some photographs of the building process at different stages.
1. Cutting 105mm hole.
2. Cutting baffle insert using 105mm and 115mm hole saw.
3. Clamping baffle while gluing with epoxy putty "Milliput"
4. Reverse of baffle showing putty.
5. Adding woven glass tape and epoxy resin reinforcement.
6. Laying out all the parts, front bowl, middle ring of Birch ply, and back bowl.
7. Glued and assembled, sanding and finishing the joints. This is where I decide I might have to paint at least *some* of the outside (to hide the mistakes I made).
I know little about any other Faital loudspeakers, but I am impressed with the little 4FE35.
I am thinking of maybe Dayton RS225, for bass, but I would need 2 to get sensitivity close.
I have some photographs of the building process at different stages.
1. Cutting 105mm hole.
2. Cutting baffle insert using 105mm and 115mm hole saw.
3. Clamping baffle while gluing with epoxy putty "Milliput"
4. Reverse of baffle showing putty.
5. Adding woven glass tape and epoxy resin reinforcement.
6. Laying out all the parts, front bowl, middle ring of Birch ply, and back bowl.
7. Glued and assembled, sanding and finishing the joints. This is where I decide I might have to paint at least *some* of the outside (to hide the mistakes I made).
I know little about any other Faital loudspeakers, but I am impressed with the little 4FE35.
I am thinking of maybe Dayton RS225, for bass, but I would need 2 to get sensitivity close.
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Thank you for the pctures.
refering to the woofer I dont have much experience but according to discussions I understand that better fit to use a larger and more powerful woofer and a more efficient one with higher sensitivity
You are doing a beautifull job I would wish to keep in touch and see the next step??
1. I was testing in separately 2 in one box and one in one box. and I finaly decided to use one in one boxe see next picture
2 to 3. sealed enclosure
I dont have many tools so I had to cut the round hole for the driver manualy with a wood cuting machine
I still have one pair and want to use them with a woofer. (can also combine 2 of them and a woofer!)
refering to the woofer I dont have much experience but according to discussions I understand that better fit to use a larger and more powerful woofer and a more efficient one with higher sensitivity
You are doing a beautifull job I would wish to keep in touch and see the next step??
1. I was testing in separately 2 in one box and one in one box. and I finaly decided to use one in one boxe see next picture
2 to 3. sealed enclosure
I dont have many tools so I had to cut the round hole for the driver manualy with a wood cuting machine
I still have one pair and want to use them with a woofer. (can also combine 2 of them and a woofer!)
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Thanks VHA, very kind of you.
The Blanda bowls look less perfect than the photograph!
I have a few tools but little space to build - most of the wood work was done in the garden, in between rain (UK weather!)
Mostly I have used a jigsaw/sabre saw to cut driver holes.
This time I was lucky and found an easier way, for those with few tools.
Hole saws. I used 105mm for the driver cutout, then 114mm and 105mm for the baffle insert.
The rest of the work was a lot of epoxy to glue the halves together and seal/fill any small voids in the joint.
And a lot of sanding!
After working with this bamboo ply or laminate, I prefer working with Birch Plywood. It looks nicer too!
The Blanda bowls look less perfect than the photograph!
I have a few tools but little space to build - most of the wood work was done in the garden, in between rain (UK weather!)
Mostly I have used a jigsaw/sabre saw to cut driver holes.
This time I was lucky and found an easier way, for those with few tools.
Hole saws. I used 105mm for the driver cutout, then 114mm and 105mm for the baffle insert.
The rest of the work was a lot of epoxy to glue the halves together and seal/fill any small voids in the joint.
And a lot of sanding!
After working with this bamboo ply or laminate, I prefer working with Birch Plywood. It looks nicer too!
I used the 4FE35 as a mid-range in a 18”passive 4way open baffle, built in 2016---it is still there. I originally had a Fostex FE126e as the mid, but have since decided that I don't like the thin cone of the Fostex in an open baffle (it was crossed to the tweeter around 3500hz to avoid the 6khz breakup).
The 4FE35 works well as a mid, but is a little too “crisp” sounding to blend perfectly with the vintage Bozak B199A Alnico woofer. Part of the problem though, is the rear-mounted+(ill-advised) wave-guide loading, that I routed into the2” thick baffle. This makes a 3dB peak around 2khz, which only further emphasizes the crisp sound of this sensitive driver.
The 4FE35 would be hard to accurately recess into a baffle if it were front mounted, due to the mounting tabs that stick out from the frame.
I am contemplating replacing the 4FE35in this build with a front mounted 4.5” ScanSpeak mid that has an almost 5” round frame that will cover the routed wave-guide---and lend a mellow+articulate sound.
I also have Faital 5FE120 (5”) and10FE200 (10”) which have amazing vocal reproduction abilities in budget friendly packages.
Few budget 10” PA speakers come close to the 10FE200 for smooth, sensitive (95dB?) mid-range reproduction. Really nice in an open baffle---with low end support and proper amount of taming of the open baffle rising response---system sensitivity could be around 89dB.
In a 3-way, the 5” 5FE120 could cover 120hz-3500hz (maybe 5khz?)—but best to check if off axis dispersion at higher frequencies is sufficient. The shallow cone should help in this regard. I tried this driver in a 10 liter box with a passive radiator, but it did not make strong enough bass to be a stand-alone speaker.
The 4FE35 works well as a mid, but is a little too “crisp” sounding to blend perfectly with the vintage Bozak B199A Alnico woofer. Part of the problem though, is the rear-mounted+(ill-advised) wave-guide loading, that I routed into the2” thick baffle. This makes a 3dB peak around 2khz, which only further emphasizes the crisp sound of this sensitive driver.
The 4FE35 would be hard to accurately recess into a baffle if it were front mounted, due to the mounting tabs that stick out from the frame.
I am contemplating replacing the 4FE35in this build with a front mounted 4.5” ScanSpeak mid that has an almost 5” round frame that will cover the routed wave-guide---and lend a mellow+articulate sound.
I also have Faital 5FE120 (5”) and10FE200 (10”) which have amazing vocal reproduction abilities in budget friendly packages.
Few budget 10” PA speakers come close to the 10FE200 for smooth, sensitive (95dB?) mid-range reproduction. Really nice in an open baffle---with low end support and proper amount of taming of the open baffle rising response---system sensitivity could be around 89dB.
In a 3-way, the 5” 5FE120 could cover 120hz-3500hz (maybe 5khz?)—but best to check if off axis dispersion at higher frequencies is sufficient. The shallow cone should help in this regard. I tried this driver in a 10 liter box with a passive radiator, but it did not make strong enough bass to be a stand-alone speaker.
I have some 4FE35 drivers (that were also bought used, at about half price). I really like them, especially for live and/or dynamic recordings. I agree with the observations you made in the OP. I too reduced the HF peak (just via DSP, based on the manufacturer's FR chart) as otherwise it could become slightly intrusive or wearing over time, then I was very happy.
The xmax is a bit limited, which might restrict the 4FE's wide/full range use in some situations, especially wrt bass as you mention. But otherwise it sounded noticeably more dynamic and real to me than any others I was comparing. Those included the similarly sized (in terms of sd) MarkAudio 7MS, which presumably makes different compromises, due to being purpose-intended as a full-range. Personally I concluded that I prefer the WAW/two-way approach in order that the midrange and upwards could be less compromised, so Xmax/bass was less of a problem, and the 4FE would have been my preference (though I later became seduced by compression drivers instead). If you want lower/louder bass from such a size then there may be better alternatives, or maybe a sub could be close enough to be crossed higher. I have also since tested the 4fe as a midrange/upper-mid in a MEH, and am still a fan; a very versatile driver.
It is said that some dedicated full/wide ranges have clever cone break-up that reduces beaming at higher frequencies. Though, oddly for such a selling point, actual specs/measurements for this off-axis performance are rare to find. I personally found their sparkle nice initially, but with longer listening it began to sound a bit false and splashy in the HF. So for myself I wouldn't discount the 4FE on those grounds, either.
The xmax is a bit limited, which might restrict the 4FE's wide/full range use in some situations, especially wrt bass as you mention. But otherwise it sounded noticeably more dynamic and real to me than any others I was comparing. Those included the similarly sized (in terms of sd) MarkAudio 7MS, which presumably makes different compromises, due to being purpose-intended as a full-range. Personally I concluded that I prefer the WAW/two-way approach in order that the midrange and upwards could be less compromised, so Xmax/bass was less of a problem, and the 4FE would have been my preference (though I later became seduced by compression drivers instead). If you want lower/louder bass from such a size then there may be better alternatives, or maybe a sub could be close enough to be crossed higher. I have also since tested the 4fe as a midrange/upper-mid in a MEH, and am still a fan; a very versatile driver.
It is said that some dedicated full/wide ranges have clever cone break-up that reduces beaming at higher frequencies. Though, oddly for such a selling point, actual specs/measurements for this off-axis performance are rare to find. I personally found their sparkle nice initially, but with longer listening it began to sound a bit false and splashy in the HF. So for myself I wouldn't discount the 4FE on those grounds, either.
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One thing to try when using a wide-range and a woofer together, is to space the drivers far enough apart that the wide range driver retains an essentially single-driver-type presentation. I know that this seems unlikely, but I did a working mock-up that convinced me. I only auditioned/tested it in mono---as a single speaker. The two woofers were open baffle, H-frame loaded.
The center to center distance that worked for me was 28”. When closer, the outputs of the woofer and full-range “tried” to combine together as one source, so-to-speak (if they are farther apart, then they will probably be heard as being separate sources). I do not know the physics and psycho-acoustics behind this, and this might not seem right to those who do know, but it worked in my mock-up. The woofer had a very gentle roll-off with increasing frequency---which worked as a kind of baffle-step compensation.
I am planning to build this design. It will have early 2000's vintage Fostex FE127eN with full Planet10 mods on the front, and Planet10 Fostex FE167eN, with full mods, on the back of a shallow, sealed bi-pole enclosure.
At 28” OC below the FE127e, I will use the Faital Pro10/FE200 woofer in a U-frame open baffle. Below that will be a 12” woofer with a low FS, also in a U-fame OB. Baffle shape will curve inward at the top, like a short surfboard. The wide-range drivers will be passively high-passed at about 120hz. The rear driver will be switched to allow the speaker to function either as a di-pole, or a bi-pole, above 120hz.
There may be some compromise to the pure small-single driver aesthetic and sound-stage, but the power and fullness in the lower mid-range and bass should more-than compensate. The over-all sound-stage should be like a open-baffle system, but hopefully with more concise/coherent imaging; and definitely better mid-range detail than large woofer+tweeter OB systems.
This could also work with the Faital Pro 4FE35 as the wide range front driver with a notch as described above.
The center to center distance that worked for me was 28”. When closer, the outputs of the woofer and full-range “tried” to combine together as one source, so-to-speak (if they are farther apart, then they will probably be heard as being separate sources). I do not know the physics and psycho-acoustics behind this, and this might not seem right to those who do know, but it worked in my mock-up. The woofer had a very gentle roll-off with increasing frequency---which worked as a kind of baffle-step compensation.
I am planning to build this design. It will have early 2000's vintage Fostex FE127eN with full Planet10 mods on the front, and Planet10 Fostex FE167eN, with full mods, on the back of a shallow, sealed bi-pole enclosure.
At 28” OC below the FE127e, I will use the Faital Pro10/FE200 woofer in a U-frame open baffle. Below that will be a 12” woofer with a low FS, also in a U-fame OB. Baffle shape will curve inward at the top, like a short surfboard. The wide-range drivers will be passively high-passed at about 120hz. The rear driver will be switched to allow the speaker to function either as a di-pole, or a bi-pole, above 120hz.
There may be some compromise to the pure small-single driver aesthetic and sound-stage, but the power and fullness in the lower mid-range and bass should more-than compensate. The over-all sound-stage should be like a open-baffle system, but hopefully with more concise/coherent imaging; and definitely better mid-range detail than large woofer+tweeter OB systems.
This could also work with the Faital Pro 4FE35 as the wide range front driver with a notch as described above.