I've been using the chemical tin plating for a while now with great results, but the solution does not store made up for very long. I have successfully managed to reactivate it by reheating to approx 40 degrees again.
However, this tin paste method looks attractive. Can you tell me what brand of paste you use?
However, this tin paste method looks attractive. Can you tell me what brand of paste you use?
richie00boy said:
Yep, it doesn't store very well, besides it tends to leak if you don't put it in an appopriate bottle.
Ouch, I'd be careful with heating the solution (although 40°C seems ok). The vapors are pretty nasty. (Another reason why I don't want to use this anymore.)
I was using the chemical plating before and was half-satisfied with it. The tin paste has made a world of difference. It may for you as well! (Although I'm not giving any guarantee ;-) )
The company which makes this is a french company called "Application des Gaz" (that's written on the bottle), but I'm pretty sure you can find something similar over there...
richie00boy said:
I always bought it pre-made. So I wouldn't know about that. And I would use it in a lukewarm "bain-marie", never heating it directly, and probably never above 30°C.
It contains lots of nasty chemicals such as sulfuric acid (I think). Quite frankly, I was never comfortable using this.
richie00boy said:
I've found these guys, but I can't find any plumbing stuff. May be different construction codes in force so it's not approved over here.
I use a chemical tin plating agent made by Bungard, Germany, called Sur Tin.
It is delivered as 3 separate parts,- to be mixed-
1 small bottle of Sulphuric acid, 1 small plastic bag of tin crystals ( tin Stannat) and a 3rd unknown component- a sort of cathalyst probably.
Can be stored for a very long time. Ready made mix stored dark, in closed full bottles - otherwise it decomposes in a few months.
Mixing is done at appx 40-50 deg C, so reheating should pose no problems, although I haven't tried it...
pinkmouse...
you should find semiliquid tin paste at any plumbing supply store..in small bottles of 100-150ml or larger. Should be pure tin or tin/silver mix, as lead is forbidden in installations for human consumption...
tin/lead mix might be available for other purposes like heating, gas etc.
( I have no experience with gas installations, Norway is almost exclusively electric.....)
It is delivered as 3 separate parts,- to be mixed-
1 small bottle of Sulphuric acid, 1 small plastic bag of tin crystals ( tin Stannat) and a 3rd unknown component- a sort of cathalyst probably.
Can be stored for a very long time. Ready made mix stored dark, in closed full bottles - otherwise it decomposes in a few months.
Mixing is done at appx 40-50 deg C, so reheating should pose no problems, although I haven't tried it...
pinkmouse...
you should find semiliquid tin paste at any plumbing supply store..in small bottles of 100-150ml or larger. Should be pure tin or tin/silver mix, as lead is forbidden in installations for human consumption...
tin/lead mix might be available for other purposes like heating, gas etc.
( I have no experience with gas installations, Norway is almost exclusively electric.....)
AuroraB said:
I believe this is indeed mainly for gas pipes and plumbing installations not destined to water... the company that makes it here is a company specialized in gas products. ;-)
I don't really believe in pure tin for that purpose. Melting temperature is much, much higher than a Sn/Pb mix, and makes it very hard to hand-solder. People using lead-free solder know that pretty well...
Hi,
ordinary solders work very well on a tin coated (hot dipped or plated) surface.
Applying a tinned surface to copper use solder paste is easy.
BUT you seem to be calling up tin coating by a chemical process.
My last enquiry got no confirmation.
Is this tin Sn plating or a tinned surface Sn/Pb (solder)? They are different!!!!
ordinary solders work very well on a tin coated (hot dipped or plated) surface.
Applying a tinned surface to copper use solder paste is easy.
BUT you seem to be calling up tin coating by a chemical process.
My last enquiry got no confirmation.
Is this tin Sn plating or a tinned surface Sn/Pb (solder)? They are different!!!!
Some of us have been referring to chemical tin plating, or more correctly, dip plating.....there are several products on the market for this. My experience with this through more than 20 years is that it works very well. There are hower some problems with shelf life for these products.
Others have been refering to hot plating with tin paste....using various types of solder pastet from products intended for plumbing and others intended for electronic soldering, and hot plates and heat guns to do the job. I am personally slightly wary of this process, as the risk of overheating the boards are quite high, I, think. if you have access to a reflow oven, that is one thing, -- but hot plates..hmmm.....
Others have been refering to hot plating with tin paste....using various types of solder pastet from products intended for plumbing and others intended for electronic soldering, and hot plates and heat guns to do the job. I am personally slightly wary of this process, as the risk of overheating the boards are quite high, I, think. if you have access to a reflow oven, that is one thing, -- but hot plates..hmmm.....
I have a PCB fabrication website with picture illustration,
and interesting references.
Hope you will Enjoy.
http://sg.wrs.yahoo.com/_ylt=A9FJqh...com/projects/2005-09-07_home_pcb_fabrication/
See U.
and interesting references.
Hope you will Enjoy.
http://sg.wrs.yahoo.com/_ylt=A9FJqh...com/projects/2005-09-07_home_pcb_fabrication/
See U.
AuroraB said:
Using a hot air gun, I've never had any problems with this. Granted, I usually use high quality epoxy boards. Since I also use toner transfer, I only need raw copper boards, so I can afford to buy high quality ones instead of so-so presensitized boards...
Actually, for amateur work and amateur tools, I'd be more wary of using a doubtful reflow oven to do the job, as it would heat the whole board to a high temperature for long enough for the whole tinning paste to reflow - whereas with a hot air gun, you come and go over the copper, letting areas not directly under the gun to cool down a bit while you're moving the gun.
That's just my experience, though.
To add a little information to an old thread, Brother printers are absolutely terrible for use in the toner transfer method. I tried a bunch of different photo papers and could never get the results everyone had been showing until I tried my ancient HP printer. I FINALLY got some good results!! Just for the record, I love my Brother printer for text, but for PCB's it is not what you want.
David
David
Hi,
Did you try another types of paper ? I have had success with magazine pages.The printer , Xerox phaser 3121 , is very good for this - it can print thick layer of paint.
Heating is also important - you need to go through all the surface with edge of iron slowly , set at high temp.
Note : it is always worth to check if magazine pages don't have heat-melting surface coating(that could destroy the printer).
Did you try another types of paper ? I have had success with magazine pages.The printer , Xerox phaser 3121 , is very good for this - it can print thick layer of paint.
Heating is also important - you need to go through all the surface with edge of iron slowly , set at high temp.
Note : it is always worth to check if magazine pages don't have heat-melting surface coating(that could destroy the printer).
Since they changed the printers at work from older Brother to Lexmark and I changed my home printer from HP LJIII to newer
Brother I have not been able to produce good transfers. I have always used glossy inkjet paper but the transfer just is not as complete as it used to be when I first started. The only other change I have noted is I have stopped doing a final clean of the copper with acetone immediately before transfer so next time I'll do that as well as cranking up the print intensity.
David L
Brother I have not been able to produce good transfers. I have always used glossy inkjet paper but the transfer just is not as complete as it used to be when I first started. The only other change I have noted is I have stopped doing a final clean of the copper with acetone immediately before transfer so next time I'll do that as well as cranking up the print intensity.
David L
I use Press'n'Peel Blue, which is expressly designed for making pcbs from laser prints.
The other parts of the process do have to be right , though. PCB copper must be absolutely clean (I use 0000 grade grease-free steel wool, and isopropyl alcohol). Getting the temperature just right is also essential - it will be different for different toners.
Time and pressure also must be right.
To this end I built a temperature controlled hotplate, with a vacuum port. pcb goes on the plate, then a piece of cloth as a vacuum spreader, then a sheet of silicone on a frame. With vacuum applied the silicone sheet sucks down and gives me a nice even 14 lbs/sq inch pressure over the whole board. I use a thermocouple on top of the silicone, to tell me when the whole thing is hot enough.
Still get it wrong sometimes ...
The other parts of the process do have to be right , though. PCB copper must be absolutely clean (I use 0000 grade grease-free steel wool, and isopropyl alcohol). Getting the temperature just right is also essential - it will be different for different toners.
Time and pressure also must be right.
To this end I built a temperature controlled hotplate, with a vacuum port. pcb goes on the plate, then a piece of cloth as a vacuum spreader, then a sheet of silicone on a frame. With vacuum applied the silicone sheet sucks down and gives me a nice even 14 lbs/sq inch pressure over the whole board. I use a thermocouple on top of the silicone, to tell me when the whole thing is hot enough.
Still get it wrong sometimes ...
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.