There's Dx Blame ST , class A, under construction.
here:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/soli...-st-operating-18-24-volts-unloaded-class.html
Thank you by your presence guys....hit counter showing more than 70K hits.
regards,
Carlos
here:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/soli...-st-operating-18-24-volts-unloaded-class.html
Thank you by your presence guys....hit counter showing more than 70K hits.
regards,
Carlos
Attachments
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Thanks for letting us know about this mistake, meanman1964. This is fixed/updated now to layout v1.5 rev d. It was just the ref. des. numbers transposed. The schematic and PCB layouts are fine at v1.5 rev c.
..Todd
I am very sad, Carlos, that you would best like to abandon this thread and follow the BlameST thread only.
I remember: the BlameES - your home-made version - exploded several times. Reason: defect transformer?
The BlameES cannot withstand the argues of the technocrats like EVA and Pavel, you admitted to have made errors
calculating the values of capacitors and resistances, using them at all ...
This has all been talked over many times, admitted by you, and I hope there will be no further discussion on this anymore.
"The BlameES is a technical idiotism - for sure - but it sounds like a divine!"
This is why I will not give it up.
And I know several people who think the same as I do.
On the contrary: I even like to push this (BlameES, not BlameST) thread.
I would like to offer to the DIYers a design, a DX Corp. INTL EMEA (Europe, MiddleEast, Australia) design, that provides for
both the 1.3 / 1.4 and 1.5 revision of the BlameUS (the "Blame Universal" design).
PCB - Revisions 1.3 / 1.4 and 1.5 only differ in 2 aspects:
Revision 1.5 lacks the "funny" C11 capacitor (18pF) that is suspected to insert some high-frequency oscillation on the positive
half-swings and resistor R32 (10 Ohm) connected to the 2nd VAS emitter being introduced in Rev. 1.5
I want to provide a PCB-design that supports Revisions 1.3 - 1.5.
Choose the values of resistors and capacitors according to the revision you want to implement, short R32, if you do not use
revision 1.5 and do not insert C11 unless you are using rev 1.3/1.4.
The PCB design shall look like this:
An officially released BlameUS design (following Todd's design with some minor modifications - f.e.: there is no need to have such a "big"
output trace in the middle of Todd's design; this space can better be used to connect the right and left Ground traces - my opinion).
On the right and left-hand side of the PCB I want insert Greg Erskine's universal PSU circuit.
I am sure some of the BlameES owners like Volker, IAN, OMAR, LUKA, ... will assist me implementing this design.
Maybe somebody else (not having appeared int this thread yet) will tell me: "Rudi, do not place this component here, put it there, ..."
The design I have in mind - shown above - will support both kinds of DIYers:
The ones who do their 1.st DIY - project, not yet very much experienced, being a little anxious about exploding, oscillating, ...:
get the 1.5 BoM, leave C11 unpopulated and listen to the BlameST.
The ones who want to listen to some magic sound, sound with incredible emotion, as you (Carlos) always told: the best sonics ever listened:
get the 1.3 BoM, insert C11 and short R32.
Bearing in mind: this is not a stable version, will explode one day ... cheerioo!
I am still waiting for Volker's Rev. 1.3 BlameES to explode - waiting since 4 month.
I will try and make the design as compact as possible resulting in something like 100 x 190 mm.
Maybe I will even be able to offer this design some time - PCB only, no technical support, no kit, no building instructions -
this is DIY and has nothing to do with commercial business - to the community - if it wants to have it.
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
I remember: the BlameES - your home-made version - exploded several times. Reason: defect transformer?
The BlameES cannot withstand the argues of the technocrats like EVA and Pavel, you admitted to have made errors
calculating the values of capacitors and resistances, using them at all ...
This has all been talked over many times, admitted by you, and I hope there will be no further discussion on this anymore.
"The BlameES is a technical idiotism - for sure - but it sounds like a divine!"
This is why I will not give it up.
And I know several people who think the same as I do.
On the contrary: I even like to push this (BlameES, not BlameST) thread.
I would like to offer to the DIYers a design, a DX Corp. INTL EMEA (Europe, MiddleEast, Australia) design, that provides for
both the 1.3 / 1.4 and 1.5 revision of the BlameUS (the "Blame Universal" design).
PCB - Revisions 1.3 / 1.4 and 1.5 only differ in 2 aspects:
Revision 1.5 lacks the "funny" C11 capacitor (18pF) that is suspected to insert some high-frequency oscillation on the positive
half-swings and resistor R32 (10 Ohm) connected to the 2nd VAS emitter being introduced in Rev. 1.5
I want to provide a PCB-design that supports Revisions 1.3 - 1.5.
Choose the values of resistors and capacitors according to the revision you want to implement, short R32, if you do not use
revision 1.5 and do not insert C11 unless you are using rev 1.3/1.4.
The PCB design shall look like this:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An officially released BlameUS design (following Todd's design with some minor modifications - f.e.: there is no need to have such a "big"
output trace in the middle of Todd's design; this space can better be used to connect the right and left Ground traces - my opinion).
On the right and left-hand side of the PCB I want insert Greg Erskine's universal PSU circuit.
I am sure some of the BlameES owners like Volker, IAN, OMAR, LUKA, ... will assist me implementing this design.
Maybe somebody else (not having appeared int this thread yet) will tell me: "Rudi, do not place this component here, put it there, ..."
The design I have in mind - shown above - will support both kinds of DIYers:
The ones who do their 1.st DIY - project, not yet very much experienced, being a little anxious about exploding, oscillating, ...:
get the 1.5 BoM, leave C11 unpopulated and listen to the BlameST.
The ones who want to listen to some magic sound, sound with incredible emotion, as you (Carlos) always told: the best sonics ever listened:
get the 1.3 BoM, insert C11 and short R32.
Bearing in mind: this is not a stable version, will explode one day ... cheerioo!
I am still waiting for Volker's Rev. 1.3 BlameES to explode - waiting since 4 month.
I will try and make the design as compact as possible resulting in something like 100 x 190 mm.
Maybe I will even be able to offer this design some time - PCB only, no technical support, no kit, no building instructions -
this is DIY and has nothing to do with commercial business - to the community - if it wants to have it.
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
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This is what I am bearing in mind for the EMEA edition of the BlameES/ST:
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
P.S.: This board has of course nothing to do with the BlameES/ST. It simply inspired me!
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
P.S.: This board has of course nothing to do with the BlameES/ST. It simply inspired me!
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I have not that power dear Rudi....it is only a strategic movement... i had the hope
you have understood me about that.
People bombing because technically not perfect...now technically much better, then they leave us in peace..so...worked!
Also i have said, several times, and clear and loud, that the Dx Blame ES, the old one, sounds better...so.... our forum folks have brain, and engaged brains... knowing that,... what they will build?.... the Dx Blame ES!
I have not the power to order no one to build this or that..i can stay my whole life screaming to them to build the ST and they will build the ES because they knew the details....maybe someone that land here, without read the thread my build the ST...to be in the most safe side...
My obligation is to point folks the best way to follow, the more safe amplifier, the most stable one...so i have to point the ST...praying to God that they will not obbey me.
ST sound is good....but lost something...some magic.... lost life!... excelent, so good as the best ones..but not the better one!
Folks that built the Dx Blame ES took to themselves the risk..they said...several said..no one said different.. "will take the risk because sounds very good"
Follow up, help, debugging, adjustment, check up.....is the same...so.... if Dx Blame ST or Dx Blame ES they will have the same help.... differences are few parts, some modified, some removed, and one included (10 ohms resistance)...this does not change too much electrically,but change sonically...how and why?... i do not know...was try and error...i was lucky, i found the best values listening and watching the scope.
Worked to my targets...first to deviate people from the bad moments we had in the thread..failures, problems, unstabilities, i give up, i have offered an orfan, no one wanted a sick orphan.... i took my baby back once again.... they came to criticise, to ask for modifications, to say there are errors, wrong judgment, flaws, mistakes, bad design...stubborn designer, not a designer and so on....now they are not bothering anymore..the ST... sterile made for them, are there for them.... proved to the ones built both, that technically correct circuit does not means better sonics than a something "less perfectly designed"... against prove there's no argument.
Now we have peace..they are happy and gone... we will go marching in, and producing amplifiers.... growing the quantity of people interested...you can build for people, or sell (avoid business talk here...do it outside the forum, please....this is not allowed in our forum) if you want..you are Dx Germany...you help, i will help...they just come and say:
- My Dx Blame is this way..happening this and that..not even need to say ST or ES..and we will help..so...anything was lost..the opposite..this mess created more interest..some came to see the figth..some to support uncle..others to support the engineers..some because curious, some undecided the one they will build...but resulted fine.... increasing the quantity of folks building..everything is gonna be all rigth, and going to be all rigth..the tecnocrats stays with the ST...others will stay with the ES..i will keep both and will go ahead reseaching the monster, the Troyan...the more than killowatt each channel.....it is all fine!
Do not complain...take it easy.... you do not agree...so remain in the Dx Blame ES thread and continue to talk good things about the ES.... no problems to me....will be good to me.
Politically correct decision, strategy man...just that.
regards,
Carlos
you have understood me about that.
People bombing because technically not perfect...now technically much better, then they leave us in peace..so...worked!
Also i have said, several times, and clear and loud, that the Dx Blame ES, the old one, sounds better...so.... our forum folks have brain, and engaged brains... knowing that,... what they will build?.... the Dx Blame ES!
I have not the power to order no one to build this or that..i can stay my whole life screaming to them to build the ST and they will build the ES because they knew the details....maybe someone that land here, without read the thread my build the ST...to be in the most safe side...
My obligation is to point folks the best way to follow, the more safe amplifier, the most stable one...so i have to point the ST...praying to God that they will not obbey me.
ST sound is good....but lost something...some magic.... lost life!... excelent, so good as the best ones..but not the better one!
Folks that built the Dx Blame ES took to themselves the risk..they said...several said..no one said different.. "will take the risk because sounds very good"
Follow up, help, debugging, adjustment, check up.....is the same...so.... if Dx Blame ST or Dx Blame ES they will have the same help.... differences are few parts, some modified, some removed, and one included (10 ohms resistance)...this does not change too much electrically,but change sonically...how and why?... i do not know...was try and error...i was lucky, i found the best values listening and watching the scope.
Worked to my targets...first to deviate people from the bad moments we had in the thread..failures, problems, unstabilities, i give up, i have offered an orfan, no one wanted a sick orphan.... i took my baby back once again.... they came to criticise, to ask for modifications, to say there are errors, wrong judgment, flaws, mistakes, bad design...stubborn designer, not a designer and so on....now they are not bothering anymore..the ST... sterile made for them, are there for them.... proved to the ones built both, that technically correct circuit does not means better sonics than a something "less perfectly designed"... against prove there's no argument.
Now we have peace..they are happy and gone... we will go marching in, and producing amplifiers.... growing the quantity of people interested...you can build for people, or sell (avoid business talk here...do it outside the forum, please....this is not allowed in our forum) if you want..you are Dx Germany...you help, i will help...they just come and say:
- My Dx Blame is this way..happening this and that..not even need to say ST or ES..and we will help..so...anything was lost..the opposite..this mess created more interest..some came to see the figth..some to support uncle..others to support the engineers..some because curious, some undecided the one they will build...but resulted fine.... increasing the quantity of folks building..everything is gonna be all rigth, and going to be all rigth..the tecnocrats stays with the ST...others will stay with the ES..i will keep both and will go ahead reseaching the monster, the Troyan...the more than killowatt each channel.....it is all fine!
Do not complain...take it easy.... you do not agree...so remain in the Dx Blame ES thread and continue to talk good things about the ES.... no problems to me....will be good to me.
Politically correct decision, strategy man...just that.
regards,
Carlos
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Lovely mutiny aboard, the way i was dreaming...could not be better
People is really asking that...also Todd is not happy too.
So...you (Rudi) will be the keeper of the Dx Blame ES...i will do the politically correct job to keep the ST thread going.
I wish you a very good job.... and that you attract much more folks in that thread than me in my ST thread.
There are much more things in this world, than the things human's imagination can understand.
regards,
Carlos
People is really asking that...also Todd is not happy too.
So...you (Rudi) will be the keeper of the Dx Blame ES...i will do the politically correct job to keep the ST thread going.
I wish you a very good job.... and that you attract much more folks in that thread than me in my ST thread.
There are much more things in this world, than the things human's imagination can understand.
regards,
Carlos
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Rudi’s BlameUS will be the ultimate design from the Dx Corporation
I am with Rudi, not against Rudi...we are cooperating, not competing..we are friends, we appreciate and respect one each other...his movement has my knowledge, support and blessings.
regards,
Carlos
I am with Rudi, not against Rudi...we are cooperating, not competing..we are friends, we appreciate and respect one each other...his movement has my knowledge, support and blessings.
regards,
Carlos
Very big burden upon my weak shoulders! But I will accept this challenge.
I will / can not carry this alone - since I do not have much experience in building AMPs at all! Never forget this - please.
But I am a manager - from profession.
I work for a big German IT-company providing IT-services to companies all over the world.
Several weeks a year I have to fullfill my "Manager on Duty" - shift, reacting on any "Critical Delivery Situation" that shows up
without even having detailled knowledge about the kernel business of the customer affected.
It is then my job to get all the experts around a table (Call-/Video conference, Netmeeting) to clear the situation.
The current "Critical Delivery Situation" and project's title is:
"Setup of a universal DX Corp. Blame AMP" PCB, tested and approved by DX XCorp. Intl. EMEA division, in a way like shown below:
being even able one day to offer a PCB (nothing more) to the DIY community.
I have to set up a team to do this right now.
CARLOS - being the technical "backstage" director of this team
IAN - being the expert on STAR-ground design, ELIMINATOR / TERMINATOR of power-supply noises and signal feedback
OMAR - being the chief layout artist - the one who has to do most of the stuff
VOLKER - being chief mechanical and provision manager
This is the team - I hope so, at least.
Anyone else to join in?
Having some special knowledge, experience and wanting to contribute his knowledge to this team, to this project?
Some of you know me.
These ones know my attitude: DIY is FUN.
If you want to have an error-proved design with life-long guarantee: go to the next wall-market and buy you an AMP.
I like to help others but in this case I need help of others as well.
I have no reputation to loose, have nothing to fight out.
But I like to promote the BlameES and keep it alive even after Carlos cannot - for political reasons only - track to it any more.
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
I will / can not carry this alone - since I do not have much experience in building AMPs at all! Never forget this - please.
But I am a manager - from profession.
I work for a big German IT-company providing IT-services to companies all over the world.
Several weeks a year I have to fullfill my "Manager on Duty" - shift, reacting on any "Critical Delivery Situation" that shows up
without even having detailled knowledge about the kernel business of the customer affected.
It is then my job to get all the experts around a table (Call-/Video conference, Netmeeting) to clear the situation.
The current "Critical Delivery Situation" and project's title is:
"Setup of a universal DX Corp. Blame AMP" PCB, tested and approved by DX XCorp. Intl. EMEA division, in a way like shown below:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
being even able one day to offer a PCB (nothing more) to the DIY community.
I have to set up a team to do this right now.
CARLOS - being the technical "backstage" director of this team
IAN - being the expert on STAR-ground design, ELIMINATOR / TERMINATOR of power-supply noises and signal feedback
OMAR - being the chief layout artist - the one who has to do most of the stuff
VOLKER - being chief mechanical and provision manager
This is the team - I hope so, at least.
Anyone else to join in?
Having some special knowledge, experience and wanting to contribute his knowledge to this team, to this project?
Some of you know me.
These ones know my attitude: DIY is FUN.
If you want to have an error-proved design with life-long guarantee: go to the next wall-market and buy you an AMP.
I like to help others but in this case I need help of others as well.
I have no reputation to loose, have nothing to fight out.
But I like to promote the BlameES and keep it alive even after Carlos cannot - for political reasons only - track to it any more.
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Hi to Director X, members
I like the general idea. It's not DX OK, but can we see copper tracks on the example board if you have time, Rudi. I get edgy about tracks, even if just an example.
Many designs are poor only because tracks are just left as the software makes neatest. It doesn't know what best or critical layout is for the design.
Oh, time to make tracks haha! bye!
I like the general idea. It's not DX OK, but can we see copper tracks on the example board if you have time, Rudi. I get edgy about tracks, even if just an example.
Many designs are poor only because tracks are just left as the software makes neatest. It doesn't know what best or critical layout is for the design.
Oh, time to make tracks haha! bye!
Approved by the counsil dear Rudi...the board has accepted, you got all votes!
And it is by appointment....next video you will understand this "by appointment"
ahahahaha!
be happy!...i am!... and a lot!
Carlos🙂🙂🙂
...........................................
Hello "een", my dear
best regards mate!
Carlos
And it is by appointment....next video you will understand this "by appointment"
ahahahaha!
be happy!...i am!... and a lot!
Carlos🙂🙂🙂
...........................................
Hello "een", my dear
best regards mate!
Carlos
Do for the time you want...the resign if needed....i will help you about technicall
things...but of course, i am not very good in theories..if the problem is practical..connected to my design spatial things, parts positioning..them i will be helping..if people decide to discuss graphics, or specifications..them i will be out, or will give them the Multisim file..them they can do by themselves and find answers for their more detailed questions i am unable to answer.
regards,
Carlos
things...but of course, i am not very good in theories..if the problem is practical..connected to my design spatial things, parts positioning..them i will be helping..if people decide to discuss graphics, or specifications..them i will be out, or will give them the Multisim file..them they can do by themselves and find answers for their more detailed questions i am unable to answer.
regards,
Carlos
I just talked to Todd (exchanged EMails).
Todd has not been using layout-software like EAGLE, SPRINT, ... to do his layouts and illustrations.
If we want to do a complete re-design of the layout we have to begin from the scratch.
The question is if a complete re-design is necessary.
There are dozens of BlameES and BlameST proving that Todd's design is working error-free.
What I like to do is:
1) Provide for C11 (18pF oscillation capacitor) in the new design. Use it or leave it unpopulated.
2) I would like to emphasize / improve the ground-plane
3) Provide for Greg's DX PSU at the left and right border of the PCB.
I have already been told that including the PSU on the PCB makes not sense.
The look of the PCB I have in mind may lead to the assumption that you do need 2 transformers to drive the 2 channels of the DX Blame
and may therefore discourage "new" DIYer's.
You need not.
The PCB layout will include spades (connectors) for external power-supplies for sure.
But the sonics of the DX Blame will of course profit from using 2 transformers, the right channel's power consumption not affecting
the left channel - and: you do not have different "ground points" like you have when you run the power wires from an external power supply to the PCB.
These are my thoughts.
Maybe somebody will correct me.
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
Todd has not been using layout-software like EAGLE, SPRINT, ... to do his layouts and illustrations.
If we want to do a complete re-design of the layout we have to begin from the scratch.
The question is if a complete re-design is necessary.
There are dozens of BlameES and BlameST proving that Todd's design is working error-free.
What I like to do is:
1) Provide for C11 (18pF oscillation capacitor) in the new design. Use it or leave it unpopulated.
2) I would like to emphasize / improve the ground-plane
3) Provide for Greg's DX PSU at the left and right border of the PCB.
I have already been told that including the PSU on the PCB makes not sense.
The look of the PCB I have in mind may lead to the assumption that you do need 2 transformers to drive the 2 channels of the DX Blame
and may therefore discourage "new" DIYer's.
You need not.
The PCB layout will include spades (connectors) for external power-supplies for sure.
But the sonics of the DX Blame will of course profit from using 2 transformers, the right channel's power consumption not affecting
the left channel - and: you do not have different "ground points" like you have when you run the power wires from an external power supply to the PCB.
These are my thoughts.
Maybe somebody will correct me.
Best regards - Rudi_Ratlos
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Hi, Director US?
I don't want to cut across ideas and plans here but it's better to discuss now than half way through a lot of effort. We all have ideals about designs but they alll need a pragmatic push to get things moving best.
A) The point about the PSUs being offboard is right. You don't need a big sawtooth generator like the electro and rectifier combo. firing either side of the amp. Its not certain, but likely to invite trouble. It also puts electros close to Heatsink. Shorter life if worked hard. On your Heatsink, Rudi, I don't think it will ever matter hehe!
B) You can build both PSUs on the one board. It makes no difference if they are wired as one or two seperate units to suit simpler builds. You still have individual relays too.
C) It means 3 boards; 2 amps + 1 PSU. Or you can still make simple arrangements for
PSU - just dont Blame Corporation for Ka-phutt!
D)It is certainly less inventory to do the board layout as you propose but we have,
as you say, a proven layout and amp. boards already. I think we need to make sure that the Schematic, PCB pattern, overlay and BOM + any necessary instructions are correct and posted in one place. Only one person authorises changes and moves files to newer locations as required. I think this part is important or we get lost and confused again.
I don't want to cut across ideas and plans here but it's better to discuss now than half way through a lot of effort. We all have ideals about designs but they alll need a pragmatic push to get things moving best.
A) The point about the PSUs being offboard is right. You don't need a big sawtooth generator like the electro and rectifier combo. firing either side of the amp. Its not certain, but likely to invite trouble. It also puts electros close to Heatsink. Shorter life if worked hard. On your Heatsink, Rudi, I don't think it will ever matter hehe!
B) You can build both PSUs on the one board. It makes no difference if they are wired as one or two seperate units to suit simpler builds. You still have individual relays too.
C) It means 3 boards; 2 amps + 1 PSU. Or you can still make simple arrangements for
PSU - just dont Blame Corporation for Ka-phutt!
D)It is certainly less inventory to do the board layout as you propose but we have,
as you say, a proven layout and amp. boards already. I think we need to make sure that the Schematic, PCB pattern, overlay and BOM + any necessary instructions are correct and posted in one place. Only one person authorises changes and moves files to newer locations as required. I think this part is important or we get lost and confused again.
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Please, do your board, be happy and have fun.....try not to re-design the amplifier
It is guaranteed the way it is...the way ES is and the way ST is....the ES had the guarantee void...it is "under the builder risk"...i do not accept complain..i can even help,but do not accept complain about the one i have pointed as electronically not perfect.
One capacitor here or there, the options...these things, are good and fair..but try not to change too much, because tested this way.... 90 degrees in the copper tracks is against the rules to board construction... too much close lines too.... long lines are not good...they turn inductors.... small distance between lines represents capacitor poles.... the fact your board have not created any problem does not prove 90 angles are good..this is known, a long time as not good.
You are Dx Germany..you can do whatever you want....cannot change the amplifier name without previous agreement... and we did that...cannot change design, values, or make board layout too much different keeping the same brand name...so...try to imagine...others change and i will be responsable..this does not make any sense to me.
People should that the whole job if they want a personnal amplifier...should design, or modify deeply and give it his personnal name.
Todd have worked a lot...the circuit is ready..we must respect his job...do your special board with supply as you like it...but try not to change, too much, Todd Board design...just the needed things to incorporate, to include, the options....
Ian may want to make a different board...or the other guy, the Arabian (Omar).... they can do..but they should test..assemble to be sure everything is all rigth....do other....and keep the Todd board, as official reference, not too much changed.
Zharmo did...he made, he tested..worked fine..he published to others if they want.... this is the good way to do.
Amplifier were delivered, at least the ES...many monthes ago.... was during Christmas the amplifier was first time suggested...as a Christmas gift...the design phase, the design moment, has already passed..... the ST is new...this one is also closed to modifications.
In other words...to be clear, not to have confusion...you can do whatever you want...you are free to do what you want...but, please, keep the original design the most you can... this to avoid more problems...i had more than enougth.
You are not doing this..just giving me some clues...to avoid future misunderstanding i am already informing what i personally appreciate, some kind of respect to my job, Todd Job, your job and other folks job...not to trash people work doing diametrally opposed things...how Todd will feel?
There's an option if you decide, in the future, to make yours....or to change a lot....open a thread...call it Dx Blame by Rudi, or other name... say thanks to me, to Douglas Self and others, and redesign the way you may feel good...just do not call Dx, and do not be waiting me to be responsable...i can even give some help..but i cannot be responsable.
To make a very different board, i would suggest people to open a new thread, give a new name, and go ahead....if you ask help..of course i would say to obbey the schematic, was the best i could make..so.... modifications should not be something i would suggest.
regards,
Carlos
It is guaranteed the way it is...the way ES is and the way ST is....the ES had the guarantee void...it is "under the builder risk"...i do not accept complain..i can even help,but do not accept complain about the one i have pointed as electronically not perfect.
One capacitor here or there, the options...these things, are good and fair..but try not to change too much, because tested this way.... 90 degrees in the copper tracks is against the rules to board construction... too much close lines too.... long lines are not good...they turn inductors.... small distance between lines represents capacitor poles.... the fact your board have not created any problem does not prove 90 angles are good..this is known, a long time as not good.
You are Dx Germany..you can do whatever you want....cannot change the amplifier name without previous agreement... and we did that...cannot change design, values, or make board layout too much different keeping the same brand name...so...try to imagine...others change and i will be responsable..this does not make any sense to me.
People should that the whole job if they want a personnal amplifier...should design, or modify deeply and give it his personnal name.
Todd have worked a lot...the circuit is ready..we must respect his job...do your special board with supply as you like it...but try not to change, too much, Todd Board design...just the needed things to incorporate, to include, the options....
Ian may want to make a different board...or the other guy, the Arabian (Omar).... they can do..but they should test..assemble to be sure everything is all rigth....do other....and keep the Todd board, as official reference, not too much changed.
Zharmo did...he made, he tested..worked fine..he published to others if they want.... this is the good way to do.
Amplifier were delivered, at least the ES...many monthes ago.... was during Christmas the amplifier was first time suggested...as a Christmas gift...the design phase, the design moment, has already passed..... the ST is new...this one is also closed to modifications.
In other words...to be clear, not to have confusion...you can do whatever you want...you are free to do what you want...but, please, keep the original design the most you can... this to avoid more problems...i had more than enougth.
You are not doing this..just giving me some clues...to avoid future misunderstanding i am already informing what i personally appreciate, some kind of respect to my job, Todd Job, your job and other folks job...not to trash people work doing diametrally opposed things...how Todd will feel?
There's an option if you decide, in the future, to make yours....or to change a lot....open a thread...call it Dx Blame by Rudi, or other name... say thanks to me, to Douglas Self and others, and redesign the way you may feel good...just do not call Dx, and do not be waiting me to be responsable...i can even give some help..but i cannot be responsable.
To make a very different board, i would suggest people to open a new thread, give a new name, and go ahead....if you ask help..of course i would say to obbey the schematic, was the best i could make..so.... modifications should not be something i would suggest.
regards,
Carlos
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I would like to explain how i do these things.
I take an amplifier and i keep it as original..the other one i use to modify.
Them i substitute the CCS in the differencial by another different one...also i try combinations with CCS or voltage regulator (with zener).
I use to try different differential.... different mirror adjustment..different current sinks.
I use to try different bootstrap and VAS...i use to include CCS to the boostrapp, feeding it...i use to try options and listen.
I use to change currents, VAS style to darlington, to single transistor, to use complementary ones.to use cascode..i use to change resistance values, capacitor values and go listening...
I also do several combinations in the output...driver current, emitter resistances, types of transistors, bias current..i use to try almost all i can imagine and combinations...them i select the best one.
This was made.. resulted in the Dx Blame ES, released in December....around last Christmas
Because this is my style, it is very possible, people will not make anything i have not tried...maybe to use Fets...maybe things alike that...so..it is very possible that i would not approve modifications as they were tested.
Michael Bittner made Symassym..i have the second model here... the one i like...then he made the third...i tried and i dislike it...others started to make symassym XXX style.... symassym YYY style..... Bittner have tried...people made to make the design belong to themselves...to me, looks alike piracy... i have build one of the last ones 10 days ago.... awfull performance compared to the original.... not even good performance in the simulator... loose when comparing, using 2SK170 in the input.
Bittner left the forum...the work he done, was destroyed.....i use to protect mine..not to happens the same thing.
Would be better if those ones made modifications, if the had opened their own thread and design the amplifier form the first part, in the place to paint a mustache in the Symassym...the result...the original was lost..the thread has a lot of Symassym style A and B...the original is not build anymore...people started to make business with it...to produce boards..so...things became easier to builders they runned to the more new symassym models.
Result..confusion..several Symassym styles.... several boards...the original lost its personality, sound is now different..will not tell you wich one..but the one i tried was a scandall!
Maybe mine construction..it is very possible....maybe these new symassym can beat the Blame..it is very possible, despite i do not believe..the best one i have here..the original Symassym..and i have compared.
People may say..and this is an old argument i use to listen...i do not agree with it, absolutelly does not make sense to me... some say the amplifier is not ours.. belong to the forum...so.... doing this way..people changing, can destroy all originals tweeking good amplifiers, in the place to produce more threads, more options, more designs, more point of views... destroy one to construct other, and then destroy other to construct an even other, the third one...all in the same thread...people go to the last one and assemble...all others have lost their work.
regards,
Carlos
I take an amplifier and i keep it as original..the other one i use to modify.
Them i substitute the CCS in the differencial by another different one...also i try combinations with CCS or voltage regulator (with zener).
I use to try different differential.... different mirror adjustment..different current sinks.
I use to try different bootstrap and VAS...i use to include CCS to the boostrapp, feeding it...i use to try options and listen.
I use to change currents, VAS style to darlington, to single transistor, to use complementary ones.to use cascode..i use to change resistance values, capacitor values and go listening...
I also do several combinations in the output...driver current, emitter resistances, types of transistors, bias current..i use to try almost all i can imagine and combinations...them i select the best one.
This was made.. resulted in the Dx Blame ES, released in December....around last Christmas
Because this is my style, it is very possible, people will not make anything i have not tried...maybe to use Fets...maybe things alike that...so..it is very possible that i would not approve modifications as they were tested.
Michael Bittner made Symassym..i have the second model here... the one i like...then he made the third...i tried and i dislike it...others started to make symassym XXX style.... symassym YYY style..... Bittner have tried...people made to make the design belong to themselves...to me, looks alike piracy... i have build one of the last ones 10 days ago.... awfull performance compared to the original.... not even good performance in the simulator... loose when comparing, using 2SK170 in the input.
Bittner left the forum...the work he done, was destroyed.....i use to protect mine..not to happens the same thing.
Would be better if those ones made modifications, if the had opened their own thread and design the amplifier form the first part, in the place to paint a mustache in the Symassym...the result...the original was lost..the thread has a lot of Symassym style A and B...the original is not build anymore...people started to make business with it...to produce boards..so...things became easier to builders they runned to the more new symassym models.
Result..confusion..several Symassym styles.... several boards...the original lost its personality, sound is now different..will not tell you wich one..but the one i tried was a scandall!
Maybe mine construction..it is very possible....maybe these new symassym can beat the Blame..it is very possible, despite i do not believe..the best one i have here..the original Symassym..and i have compared.
People may say..and this is an old argument i use to listen...i do not agree with it, absolutelly does not make sense to me... some say the amplifier is not ours.. belong to the forum...so.... doing this way..people changing, can destroy all originals tweeking good amplifiers, in the place to produce more threads, more options, more designs, more point of views... destroy one to construct other, and then destroy other to construct an even other, the third one...all in the same thread...people go to the last one and assemble...all others have lost their work.
regards,
Carlos
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Hi again,
I should clarify that I don't suggest changes to the amp. PCB here, just the PSU boards. These are Rudis arrangements of Greg Erskine's design, I believe.
Any opinion expressed is of the IMHO type. I am happy to butt out if others wish it, but there are other details to go through yet.
I should clarify that I don't suggest changes to the amp. PCB here, just the PSU boards. These are Rudis arrangements of Greg Erskine's design, I believe.
Any opinion expressed is of the IMHO type. I am happy to butt out if others wish it, but there are other details to go through yet.
Oh!.... dear Greg is back again producing boards?
This is very good...he is the one use to test things he does...he is a guarantee.
He told me anything about that.... a surprise.
regards,
Carlos
This is very good...he is the one use to test things he does...he is a guarantee.
He told me anything about that.... a surprise.
regards,
Carlos
I have not been following this tread post by post, but from what Carlos said, seems there has been plenty of Blames upon Carlos? I don't understand what they are blaming you for?
In the DIY world, it is always the responsibility of the builder, because it is DIY. It is natural that when Rudi offers a PCB, to include schematics, instructions and top silk screen to other DIYers, this is just natural. Rudi meant that no tech support will take place for those who might not like the sound, those who fail to make an already working amplifier work.
This is how all started:
Few months ago, I contacted Carlos to tell me why my amplifier sounds not the way I was dreaming of. Recently I saw that he calls this configuration I asked about (The Plague). The plague is the symmetrical schematic that I always saw in car amplifiers. I bought the PCBs and built it from an Indonesian friend here on the forum, and I did not like the way it sounded, seriously I decided to stop building amplifiers and stick to my STK4191V amplifier as it sounded better than this Plague amplifier. Now I call it Plague, it is Plague. Carlos replied with an audio file telling me why. This person is just different with everything he does, even his replies to other DIYer on the forum, he did impress me indeed. I remember Carlos decided to leave the forum for a couple of times, not sure how many times he decided that, but sure not everyone here understands this person, or understands what he really wants from amplifiers.
I met Rudi here on the forum while I was running tests on PGA2311, then moved to PGA2310. He showed me his soft power on, and I was shocked when he told me that he uses paint to draw his PCBs. I said you have too much angles and this is no good, but your layout is better than what I would have done on my own, so I offered him to let me draw his PCB following his paint version. Later on we talked about Blame amplifier, and he told me there are 3 versions, the best sounding one, is the one to be astable?
I asked Rudi which version to build, he said we have 3 versions, why don't we make a PCB that supports the 3 versions depending on Todd's design for the amplifier, we just have to add a place for those extra components. Rudi likes to have the PSU on the same PCB as the amplifier. Some agree, some don't, some argue about the life span of the power caps, etc...
I told Rudi I want a good amplifier with no surprises, and he said, build Blame and I will tell you which version to go with, and he did tell me what version to go with. Rudi has been working with Blame for a while, and he knows what to do to make it work the way he likes. The way he likes and appreciate.
Carlos we are not changing the amplifier name. Blame US is just a PCB and was thought of to be supporting the 3 versions, that's all. That's why Rudi liked to call it US. We all respect you, respect Todd for the work he has already done, we are not changing any thing. On the PCB, we will have the schematic telling the builder which different components are for which versions, what each version does differ from the other versions. I rely on Rudi to enlighten my way for the version to build, people who were reading this thread since its birth know which version to build, not me.
Now all that being said, if you want us to move to another thread to start with the Blame US PCB, you got that, if you want us to stay here and continue you also got that. Where do you want us to go? Do you really like the idea of Blame US?
I attached Rudi's soft power on PDF files, schematic and PCB. I like tracks to be curved rather than angled, and if I have to, I will make pads tear dropped too.
P.S. Who said we will manufacture any PCB to sell to DIYers before running tests?
In the DIY world, it is always the responsibility of the builder, because it is DIY. It is natural that when Rudi offers a PCB, to include schematics, instructions and top silk screen to other DIYers, this is just natural. Rudi meant that no tech support will take place for those who might not like the sound, those who fail to make an already working amplifier work.
This is how all started:
Few months ago, I contacted Carlos to tell me why my amplifier sounds not the way I was dreaming of. Recently I saw that he calls this configuration I asked about (The Plague). The plague is the symmetrical schematic that I always saw in car amplifiers. I bought the PCBs and built it from an Indonesian friend here on the forum, and I did not like the way it sounded, seriously I decided to stop building amplifiers and stick to my STK4191V amplifier as it sounded better than this Plague amplifier. Now I call it Plague, it is Plague. Carlos replied with an audio file telling me why. This person is just different with everything he does, even his replies to other DIYer on the forum, he did impress me indeed. I remember Carlos decided to leave the forum for a couple of times, not sure how many times he decided that, but sure not everyone here understands this person, or understands what he really wants from amplifiers.
I met Rudi here on the forum while I was running tests on PGA2311, then moved to PGA2310. He showed me his soft power on, and I was shocked when he told me that he uses paint to draw his PCBs. I said you have too much angles and this is no good, but your layout is better than what I would have done on my own, so I offered him to let me draw his PCB following his paint version. Later on we talked about Blame amplifier, and he told me there are 3 versions, the best sounding one, is the one to be astable?
I asked Rudi which version to build, he said we have 3 versions, why don't we make a PCB that supports the 3 versions depending on Todd's design for the amplifier, we just have to add a place for those extra components. Rudi likes to have the PSU on the same PCB as the amplifier. Some agree, some don't, some argue about the life span of the power caps, etc...
I told Rudi I want a good amplifier with no surprises, and he said, build Blame and I will tell you which version to go with, and he did tell me what version to go with. Rudi has been working with Blame for a while, and he knows what to do to make it work the way he likes. The way he likes and appreciate.
Carlos we are not changing the amplifier name. Blame US is just a PCB and was thought of to be supporting the 3 versions, that's all. That's why Rudi liked to call it US. We all respect you, respect Todd for the work he has already done, we are not changing any thing. On the PCB, we will have the schematic telling the builder which different components are for which versions, what each version does differ from the other versions. I rely on Rudi to enlighten my way for the version to build, people who were reading this thread since its birth know which version to build, not me.
Now all that being said, if you want us to move to another thread to start with the Blame US PCB, you got that, if you want us to stay here and continue you also got that. Where do you want us to go? Do you really like the idea of Blame US?
I attached Rudi's soft power on PDF files, schematic and PCB. I like tracks to be curved rather than angled, and if I have to, I will make pads tear dropped too.
P.S. Who said we will manufacture any PCB to sell to DIYers before running tests?
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