DIY shielded signal cables

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#21
andynor said:
terminating the braides shields.
Click to expand...

My technique goes like that:

Start on the opposite side of where you will need the twisted shield, and with a needle (an eel?) unbraid it by steps of not too many millimeters. In the end, you should have a more or less straight, more or less even halved string of shield-wires. Pull them around the cable and twist.

If this does not work out, cut along the wire, although you loose copper [emoji41]
 
#26
myleftear said:
My technique goes like that:

Start on the opposite side of where you will need the twisted shield, and with a needle (an eel?) unbraid it by steps of not too many millimeters. In the end, you should have a more or less straight, more or less even halved string of shield-wires. Pull them around the cable and twist.

If this does not work out, cut along the wire, although you loose copper [emoji41]
Click to expand...

Nice! I don’t think I would have thought of that... thanks!
 
#28
hi guys has anyone tried these plugs ??
AudioQuest RCA-800 Premium RCA Plugs - Pack of 4 | Future Shop

i emailed the company asking for a datasheet, but was refused. the guy emailed me back stating
" Dear Gaz,
They're made from beryllium copper. The plating is applied directly over the copper, hence "direct gold" or "direct silver" plated. None of our connectors use an intermediate layer of nickel."

let me know what you think
gaz
 
#32
A year of consideration is over and I pulled the plug on Mogami 2964. First off is internal signal wiring for the Aleph J, replacing twisted pair Cat 6. Ordered a few REAN’s too, iot try them as signal cables. Maybe I’ll rewire my Wayne linestage too 🙂

Thanks for all good advice helping me to this preliminary conclusion. Hope it turns out nice.

btw, found it at audiophonix in France by the meter.

regards,
Andy
 
#33
Highest sonic performance you will get only with solid core wires (both inner conductor and screen).
Examples are this one:
http://www.rfcell.com/air-dielectric
and those from images No 1 and 2
A very big disadvantage is the lack of flexibility and the laborious process of attaching the connectors (rca plugs) using only additional short wires.

A bit more easy is the MICRO-COAX Cinch-RCA 2x 25cm (Semi-Rigid) - Typ UT-141 - go to
http://www.semi-rigid.com/uploads/cables/images/20110809214439_drawing_UT-141A-TP.pdf
and
https://m.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-a...hnl-isoda-cardas-nf-verb-/1416622896-172-4440
and images No 3-5

The cables that are easy to manage and come closest to those previously mentioned in terms of sound quality are flat line resp. flex versions like the follow:
Ephemera Interconnect Cable
https://en.sternklang.xyz/products/ephemera/index.html
Nordost Red Dawn Flat
http://www.soundstagenetwork.com/todd09.htm
https://www.adverts.ie/cables/nordost-flat-line-gold-mkii-interconnects/2623840
Bastanis Heartbeat I/C- cables
https://www.bastanis.com/audio/cables/interlink-heartbeat
check out also the images No 6-9
I am looking for suppliers, which offer such cables for sold by the meter - thanks for advices.

From the flexible coax versions the best sounded I know is the Mogami Absolute Pure 2803 - for sold by the meter go to
https://www.cma.audio/detail/index/sArticle/1811
and review
http://www.highfidelity.pl/@main-586&lang=en
and image No 13 (last image)

An inexpensive universal coax RCA interconnect cable (e. g. between CD-Player and amplifier or between pre- and power-amplifier) is the Hirschmann Koka 799 - usually used as a connection between satellite receiver and dish (parabolic) antenna (LNC) - go to
https://www.hirschmann-multimedia.com/media/files/298799102 KOKA 799 Eca 100 m black productsheet v17.1.pdf
and Image No 10
Better than the most commercial available high quality RCA interconnect parts in a soft and flexible design - as mostly to find.

If low capacitance character is important, twisted versions are a good solution like the Kimber versions from Image No 11+12
 

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#34
tiefbassuebertr said:
Highest sonic performance you will get only with solid core wires (both inner conductor and screen).
Click to expand...
Its absolutely fine to use multi-strand wiring for audio signals, this isn't microwaves... The idea of using heliax for 20kHz is complete over-engineering! Hard and semi-hard coaxs are what you might find in quality RF test equipment to prevent RF leakage affecting performance at 100's of MHz and up. Not needed for audio, unless, perhaps, you are routing past an industrial welding machine for some reason, or perhaps through a working microwave oven? Then it would be needed.

What is "sonic performance" anyway? We're talking analog signal propagation at audio bandwidths. This is electronics, nothing "sonic" is involved between the microphone and the speaker. Performance is measured by such parameters as gain-flatness, distortion, noise, etc, general issues with analog signals whatever they represent. Every time I see "sonic" used in this context I get a quaesy feeling about snake oil and marketing.
 
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#37
Mark Tillotson said:
Its absolutely fine to use multi-strand wiring for audio signals, this isn't microwaves... The idea of using heliax for 20kHz is complete over-engineering! Hard and semi-hard coaxs are what you might find in quality RF test equipment to prevent RF leakage affecting performance at 100's of MHz and up. Not needed for audio, unless, perhaps, you are routing past an industrial welding machine for some reason, or perhaps through a working microwave oven? Then it would be needed.

What is "sonic performance" anyway? We're talking analog signal propagation at audio bandwidths. This is electronics, nothing "sonic" is involved between the microphone and the speaker. Performance is measured by such parameters as gain-flatness, distortion, noise, etc, general issues with analog signals whatever they represent. Every time I see "sonic" used in this context I get a quaesy feeling about snake oil and marketing.
Click to expand...
That's exactly what most electronic experts say (most of them anyway say that in the audible audio band below 20 KHz the whole cable discussion belongs completely in the esoteric realm).
But after many listening tests over the last tens of years, not only I, but also numerous other people have found the RF GHz cables to be the best in terms of sound performance (with the mentioned ranking of the others flexible alternatives).
I don't know whether this is necessarily due to the fact that those wires are actually suited for RF applications in the GHz area.
Definitely fact is, that stranded wires in the signal path are always worse than solid conductors, that's what listening tests have always shown, without exception.
But I've been wondering for years why and how this can be clearly verify by appropriate measurements.

Better sound performance is an abstract term that no one can relate to.
I mean here that the perceived sound quality of the voice and acoustic instruments is better in all respects and therefore closer to the live character.

But we do agree on one point: Expensive and extremely expensive cables are complete nonsense (snake oil marketing).

It is also very important to mention that the sound improvements through RF air dielectric cable I mentioned are not audible with most chains - from this view you are completely right. Only first-class combined components (which don't necessarily have to be expensive) make the sonic benefits of such cable clearly audible.

P.S.: friends of me recommend this not expensive RF cable for audio:
https://www.mauritz.de/de/koaxialka...MIicKg0qO-9wIVxIXVCh1SNgSTEAQYBCABEgLJL_D_BwE
unfortunately the manufacturer-URL don't goes open due invalid certification date (I have send an email today concerning this):
https://www.ssb.de/de/koax/koaxialkabel/7-mm/aircell-7-frnc/aircell-7-koaxialkabel-frnc
 

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#39
tiefbassuebertr said:
But after many listening tests over the last tens of years, not only I, but also numerous other people have found the RF GHz cables to be the best in terms of sound performance (with the mentioned ranking of the others flexible alternatives).
I don't know whether this is necessarily due to the fact that those wires are actually suited for RF applications in the GHz area.
Definitely fact is, that stranded wires in the signal path are always worse than solid conductors, that's what listening tests have always shown, without exception.
Click to expand...

IMHO its not the RF performance that matters. More likely is since the cables are rigid, their capacitance can't be modulated by the signal due to motor action. See: https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=20755 ...That paper also references an earlier paper that found a similar effect in headphone cables due to signal currents causing a magnetic motor effect. Although the forces are small, the effects are measurable and correlate with what some people describe hearing. https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=20555

Also IMHO the thing about stranded wire is that eddy current effects at audio frequencies force current to flow laterally through surface contamination on strands. Various approaches have been used to minimize or eliminate that effect.

There are some other possible factors too, insulator DA, for one example.

In addition @johnmath has talked about some of the above and more in other cable threads. IME he seems to know what he's talking about.
 
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#40
Markw4 said:
IMHO its not the RF performance that matters. More likely is since the cables are rigid, their capacitance can't be modulated by the signal due to motor action. See: https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=20755 ...That paper also references an earlier paper that found a similar effect in headphone cables due to signal currents causing a magnetic motor effect. Although the forces are small, the effects are measurable and correlate with what some people describe hearing. https://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=20555

Also IMHO the thing about stranded wire is that eddy current effects at audio frequencies force current to flow laterally through surface contamination on strands. Various approaches have been used to minimize or eliminate that effect.

There are some other possible factors too, insulator DA, for one example.

In addition @johnmath has talked about some of the above and more in other cable threads. IME he seems to know what he's talking about.
Click to expand...
good papers - thank you for this information
http://boson.physics.sc.edu/~kunchur/papers/Interconnect-cable-measurements--Kunchur.pdf
https://www.aes.org/images/e-lib/thumbnails/2/0/20755_full.png
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/signal-dependent-cable-capacitance-change.356154/
https://www.iosrjournals.org/iosr-jece/papers/Vol. 16 Issue 6/Ser-1/E1606014053.pdf
http://boson.physics.sc.edu/~kunchur/papers/Audibility-of-cable-pathways--Kunchur.pdf
https://www.audioholics.com/audio-video-cables/cable-distortion-and-dielectric-biasing-debunked
https://earrockers.com/do-headphone-cables-affect-sound-quality/
 

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