About moving decks:
https://www.thomann.de/gb/thon_plattenspieler_case_1210.htm
Mine were constantly into this when i moved them often. Never had an issue. The most fragile part is the arm. There should be a stand with lock on serious decks. Secure it with twisted metal string, put off the weigth and you should be good to go.
About moving discs:
https://www.musicstore.com/fr_FR/EUR/Zomo-Technics-DJ-Bag-schwarz/art-DJE0006842-000
IME Vinyl are less fragile than cd. They fear heat and light and don't like to be stored horizontally for long periods ( they warps). They don't like to be scratched too but it is obvious...
I've used this kind of bag for 30years. Never had any issues with maxi ( 45rpm, grooves are deeper than 33) even naked into plastic sleeve( no paper inner sleeve, no external sleeve... as long as you have some cardboard protecting on both side...). If into sleeve you risk nothing. Beware It weight a lot once full though...
Nice! You must get a Revox linear tracker then...except from actually handling a record, they are childproof.
What is ironic , too, is the following:
1974 AES Paper... The paper that the ELP Laser Turntable creators don't want you to see...
The authors wanted to demonstrate how their "lencoclean" wet play fluid extended record life.
However, with the Shure M91...
... a cartridge that was not top of the line and whose technical parameters have been largely surpassed today...
... and a record of good quality (an RCA, LSC-3153) of complex operatic/choral music...
... The conclusion was that even with dry playback the record could easily withstand 1200 plays with no degradation.
Ironically, their own research demonstrated that wet play was not really necessary for you, your children, and great-great-grandchildren to keep playing your records.
"Played with a modern-high quality pickup the record groove seems to be nearly indestructible"
So all this ideas about "contactless playback" are perhaps trying to solve a problem that doesn't happen for practical purposes.
More experimental proof? How about this by the BAS Speaker (great publication regarding audio) -- they reported this as a side effect on trying the same test record many times, and they cite yet another study... 6000 plays (!)
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Fun fact...
At the beginning, the Philips group involved, on what was called the ALP ("Audio Long Play") project, an offshoot of the VLP ( Video Long Play) video disc, they tried contactless analog playback using lasers and FM modulation. This was about 1976 or so (the exact year, i had annotated elsewhere but lost the info).
Their conclusion was that dirt was a real problem that created horrible sonic artifacts on playback.
Thus they identified the need to use a digital encoding of audio for the specific purpose of overcoming playback errors/noises caused by dirt and optical artifacts.
Yet the people who made the ELP Laser Turntable in japan in the 80s seemingly didn't take the time to ask Philips...
The "Laservision" Philips (later Pioneer) videodisc also used analog audio. The signal-to-noise ratio is appaling so they had to add companding noise reduction (CBS CX) and later they shifted to digital audio.
Yet the people who made the ELP Laser Turntable in japan in the 80s seemingly didn't take the time to look at Pioneer laser discs replaying analog audio.
And such audio was FM encoded, which in theory gives it even more resilience than baseband audio, which is what a LP record has.
It is a bit obvious, we're measuring mechanical modulations whose precision is in the sub-micrometer range. And we want to avoid the effect of dirt/etc. For me it is obvious that mechanical (contact) sampling is the way to go.
The original carton is not likely to be available for an old unit.
Add up the investment, after deciding your budget, and then proceed.
You will end up spending far more on records than on the system.
Figure $5,000 and up.
If you can afford to buy and store things, fine.
If not, drop the idea.
You also have to shift from country to country.
Think of arguing with a Customs officer over the valuation, he will say $10,000, and 40% duty...then what? You will call it junk, little duty.
The posts you have made make me feel you are confused, and have not decided your goals.
First is speakers, and a good amplifier. Then a good source.
And believe me, YouTube and WhatsApp posts must be taken with a pinch of salt.
Like an Australian discussing Tandoor, a hit and miss affair, he may not be experienced enough to know what is going on.
Or an Irishman discussing Inca cooking.
And you trust them, and things do not work out as planned.
Then you can only blame yourself by being gullible.
Best get a decent computer, you can use different programs to play digital files, using a sound card or the built in sound converter.
Decide what music you like, and enjoy.
But if you like physical things like records...your choice.
Right now you seem to be licking your finger and trying to decide which way the wind blows.
Add up the investment, after deciding your budget, and then proceed.
You will end up spending far more on records than on the system.
Figure $5,000 and up.
If you can afford to buy and store things, fine.
If not, drop the idea.
You also have to shift from country to country.
Think of arguing with a Customs officer over the valuation, he will say $10,000, and 40% duty...then what? You will call it junk, little duty.
The posts you have made make me feel you are confused, and have not decided your goals.
First is speakers, and a good amplifier. Then a good source.
And believe me, YouTube and WhatsApp posts must be taken with a pinch of salt.
Like an Australian discussing Tandoor, a hit and miss affair, he may not be experienced enough to know what is going on.
Or an Irishman discussing Inca cooking.
And you trust them, and things do not work out as planned.
Then you can only blame yourself by being gullible.
Best get a decent computer, you can use different programs to play digital files, using a sound card or the built in sound converter.
Decide what music you like, and enjoy.
But if you like physical things like records...your choice.
Right now you seem to be licking your finger and trying to decide which way the wind blows.
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I was quite unaware of the durability of the system when I started this thread. I suspected that records were far more durable when Steve Gutenberg said that he plays records that are 50 years old, because he took care of them.
I was wondering about this: to produce a 20 kHz tone, how close should the record grooves be, in the innermost track?
33 1/3 rpm / 60 x 2 x 3.14 x 0.05 m/s = 20,0000 x wavelength ?
This gives 0.000001389 metres? 0.001389 mm? A human hair is 0.07 mm?
One of my favorite songs right now.
I am simply enjoying the journey without asking 'are we there yet' every five minutes.
As technology progresses, some sort of micro-sonar system could be used to create a map of the vinyl surface:
"The wreck of the U.S. Navy tugboat USS Conestoga is seen on sonar in at a depth of 185 feet in the waters." by Official U.S. Navy Imagery is licensed under CC BY 2.0.
"The wreck of the U.S. Navy tugboat USS Conestoga is seen on sonar in at a depth of 185 feet in the waters." by Official U.S. Navy Imagery is licensed under CC BY 2.0.
Here is another idea, of course someone has already patented it. Given the state of current technology, it may be workable.
A jet of air is forced through the stylus, and the stylus rides on a cushion of air.
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/COMMS/hydraupu/hydraupu.htm
A jet of air is forced through the stylus, and the stylus rides on a cushion of air.
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/COMMS/hydraupu/hydraupu.htm
You would think that nowadays with the pinnacle of DSP capabilities we have, there would be some photo analysis way of detecting the actual music in record grooves. That being said, I can't fault a decent playback setup with good microline stylus tracking at 1.5 to 1.7 grams.
My AT 150MLX is what I use for records purchased used and has about 800 hrs on it. I can't see any appreciable wear on the stylus. It still sounds the same as it ever did. If the used record passes the playback test on the 150MLX, it can be deemed safe to play on the MC AT OC9II which has the same stylus profile as the MM cartridge.
I clean my stylus with strips of cut melamine foam that has a drop of isopropyl added to it for solvency. I pull the foam in record play direction across the stylus 3 times and do this with every side of record play. The foam does a great job pulling off any stubborn gunk and won't touch the stylus polish whatsoever, at least not based on visual inspection and playback testing. I also tried a small chunk of melamine foam on the tip of my vibrational stylus cleaner. Seems to work well but may be overkill.
In between plays, I use deionized water to rinse records after cleaning them with a solution of distilled water, a few tablespoons of isopropyl and a few drops of discwasher cleaning solution.
I gave up on the cheap ultrasonic cleaners. They just don't work well. I just use a soft haired paint brush and apply the cleaning solution by hand in the direction of grooves. This cleans even the most stubborn dirt and has revived some really cheap thrift store records that were unplayable as purchased.
I have records which were probably played well over 50 times without any detectable wear or losses in fidelity. I believe that good quality virgin vinyl is very durable and can last a lifetime if cared for properly. If a diamond stylus can last over 1000 hrs and not show any visual wear, I can't see how the technology can be improved upon further. If it works, why mess with it or worry about it?
My AT 150MLX is what I use for records purchased used and has about 800 hrs on it. I can't see any appreciable wear on the stylus. It still sounds the same as it ever did. If the used record passes the playback test on the 150MLX, it can be deemed safe to play on the MC AT OC9II which has the same stylus profile as the MM cartridge.
I clean my stylus with strips of cut melamine foam that has a drop of isopropyl added to it for solvency. I pull the foam in record play direction across the stylus 3 times and do this with every side of record play. The foam does a great job pulling off any stubborn gunk and won't touch the stylus polish whatsoever, at least not based on visual inspection and playback testing. I also tried a small chunk of melamine foam on the tip of my vibrational stylus cleaner. Seems to work well but may be overkill.
In between plays, I use deionized water to rinse records after cleaning them with a solution of distilled water, a few tablespoons of isopropyl and a few drops of discwasher cleaning solution.
I gave up on the cheap ultrasonic cleaners. They just don't work well. I just use a soft haired paint brush and apply the cleaning solution by hand in the direction of grooves. This cleans even the most stubborn dirt and has revived some really cheap thrift store records that were unplayable as purchased.
I have records which were probably played well over 50 times without any detectable wear or losses in fidelity. I believe that good quality virgin vinyl is very durable and can last a lifetime if cared for properly. If a diamond stylus can last over 1000 hrs and not show any visual wear, I can't see how the technology can be improved upon further. If it works, why mess with it or worry about it?
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Of course you have a point there. I initially thought that records wear out significantly after 100 plays, but since then I have a lot of evidence to the contrary. Experts like Steve Gutenberg say the are still playing their vinyl after 50 years, and that he 'took care of his records' .
With digital technology the sound of vinyl can be transferred to digital formats, preserving the same sound, experts agree that it sounds the same or almost the same. The wear on records becomes irrelevant if you can play the record once and make a digital recording.
The idea of playing a record without wearing it out is still appealing to me, but given the cost, it does not make economic sense to me.
As for cleaning, I am cleaning the stylus with a small paint brush (dry) after playing each side, for the first time in my life, and using distilled water for cleaning the record before each play. I don't notice any wear, even with the heavy forces involved.