I plan to wire mine up with a pair of 3 pole 3 position rotary switches so I can have all three options.
I currently have Altec 4722 SUT that I use at 1:18 for my Denon 103. Seems to sound better to me than 1:36.
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Oh wow. Would you be able to describe how to do that? I’d love to do the same so I can wire it for 1:10, 1:20 and 1:30. Should be fun.
To start what switches should I get?
Thank Im advance.
Best
AB
To start what switches should I get?
Thank Im advance.
Best
AB
I purchased a pair of these switches from Mouser.
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CK/A30305RNZQK?qs=aIxPIZZxLh9nZkPOqTsjpQ%3D%3D
The attached picture shows how I plan to wire them up. Refer to the Cinemag schematic linked on the first page of the thread.
Hope that helps.
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CK/A30305RNZQK?qs=aIxPIZZxLh9nZkPOqTsjpQ%3D%3D
The attached picture shows how I plan to wire them up. Refer to the Cinemag schematic linked on the first page of the thread.
Hope that helps.
Attachments
Cinemag 1254 SUT Round II -Update
I checked in with Cinemag. We are still 4-5 weeks out before they ship the order. They are still catching up from the Covis shut down and recovering from a major IT issue.
I will keep you posted as I get updates.
Cheers,
Geary
I checked in with Cinemag. We are still 4-5 weeks out before they ship the order. They are still catching up from the Covis shut down and recovering from a major IT issue.
I will keep you posted as I get updates.
Cheers,
Geary
If you are planning to use the 1254 exclusively for a Denon 103 series (40 ohms or 14 ohms for the R) , I believe you do not need the 1:36 or higher taps. It's just a waste of effort IMO.
Excerpt: ".....Consider a cartridge with a 40 ohm coil and a transformer with a 1:30 ratio. The 47k load on the secondary now appears as 52 ohms from the primary side. When driven by a 40 ohm source the voltage divider is formed by 52 ohms and 40 ohms. Therefore the proportion of signal dropped across the cartridge's coil is 40/(40+52) = 0.43, which is very significant – nearly half the voltage produced by the cartridge is lost internally. Whereas only 0.2dB was lost in the previous example, here the signal loss is 5dB, and instead of achieving a signal voltage at the output of the transformer of 30 times the cartridge's output, the output is only 0.43x30 times the cartridge's output, ie a voltage step-up of effectively just 13 times, not 30 times. Clearly, increasing the transformer turns ratio by a factor of X doesn't increase the output voltage by the same factor. As the turns ratio increases, the increase in the output voltage gets less and less as the load on the cartridge becomes more and more significant until a point is reached where increasing the turns ratio further actually causes the output voltage to drop.
The point at which the maximum possible voltage at the transformer's output is achieved occurs when the transformed load is equal to the source impedance. In the case of a 47k secondary load (the usual load impedance of an MM phonostage) and a 40 ohm MC cartridge, the turns ratio would have to be 1:34.28 to get the absolute maximum output voltage. This is because 40x34.28x34.28 = 47000
It’s this that gives rise to the misguided notion that the transformer must “match” the cartridge impedance. Yes, it may be true that matching the impedances gives the maximum possible voltage at the transformer's output, but in a hi-fi system we're not looking for the absolute maximum voltage from the transformer, we're looking for a voltage suitable to be fed into the following MM phonostage and we're looking for maximum fidelity....... "
Link: MC step-up transformers explained
I have tried it with both 3440A and 1254 as I own several 103 and 103R carts. The worst sound is when the SUT is set to 1:36 to me. But hey, if you want to use it just for the sake of knowing that you have it there, go for it.
Excerpt: ".....Consider a cartridge with a 40 ohm coil and a transformer with a 1:30 ratio. The 47k load on the secondary now appears as 52 ohms from the primary side. When driven by a 40 ohm source the voltage divider is formed by 52 ohms and 40 ohms. Therefore the proportion of signal dropped across the cartridge's coil is 40/(40+52) = 0.43, which is very significant – nearly half the voltage produced by the cartridge is lost internally. Whereas only 0.2dB was lost in the previous example, here the signal loss is 5dB, and instead of achieving a signal voltage at the output of the transformer of 30 times the cartridge's output, the output is only 0.43x30 times the cartridge's output, ie a voltage step-up of effectively just 13 times, not 30 times. Clearly, increasing the transformer turns ratio by a factor of X doesn't increase the output voltage by the same factor. As the turns ratio increases, the increase in the output voltage gets less and less as the load on the cartridge becomes more and more significant until a point is reached where increasing the turns ratio further actually causes the output voltage to drop.
The point at which the maximum possible voltage at the transformer's output is achieved occurs when the transformed load is equal to the source impedance. In the case of a 47k secondary load (the usual load impedance of an MM phonostage) and a 40 ohm MC cartridge, the turns ratio would have to be 1:34.28 to get the absolute maximum output voltage. This is because 40x34.28x34.28 = 47000
It’s this that gives rise to the misguided notion that the transformer must “match” the cartridge impedance. Yes, it may be true that matching the impedances gives the maximum possible voltage at the transformer's output, but in a hi-fi system we're not looking for the absolute maximum voltage from the transformer, we're looking for a voltage suitable to be fed into the following MM phonostage and we're looking for maximum fidelity....... "
Link: MC step-up transformers explained
I have tried it with both 3440A and 1254 as I own several 103 and 103R carts. The worst sound is when the SUT is set to 1:36 to me. But hey, if you want to use it just for the sake of knowing that you have it there, go for it.
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I added 1254s on a switch to my Salas FSP with the hope of one day trying an MC cart.....started with the 103 mostly due to cost and recommendations in the FSP thread as a solid entry point. Mind blown on first try. 1:10 wiring. I had every intention of adding an internal switch—and still could—to toggle between 1:10 and 1:20 for the Denon. I don't currently feel inclined to do so. Couldn't believe how much better it sounded than my MM cart explorations. Now running AT33PTG/II and Hana ML. 103 doesn't really compare to these 2 carts in my system now that I've given myself an education. But if the 103 was the only cart I had—I'd be VERY satisfied.
Hi Patrick!
The 103 needs a heavier arm (at least 17 gms. not including headshell) to sound its best imo and 1:20 step up ratio for a phono preamp not lower than 42 dB gain before linestage.
You can also mod the 103 using wooden body or cast metal body, potted etc.
I had Koetsu Rosewood, Shelter 901, Denon 103's, 103R's, and 304. I also have retipped 103, 103R and wood body 103, 103R.
I sold my Koetsu and Shelter many years ago. I still have the Denons.
Abe
The 103 needs a heavier arm (at least 17 gms. not including headshell) to sound its best imo and 1:20 step up ratio for a phono preamp not lower than 42 dB gain before linestage.
You can also mod the 103 using wooden body or cast metal body, potted etc.
I had Koetsu Rosewood, Shelter 901, Denon 103's, 103R's, and 304. I also have retipped 103, 103R and wood body 103, 103R.
I sold my Koetsu and Shelter many years ago. I still have the Denons.
Abe
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Nice! Lay it on me. SME IV 9", Jelco 10" SA-750, 12" TK-850.... heavy enough? Definitely inspired to get the 1:20 working and give a listen—I think the based config for FSP is ~40db—I'm running the other carts I mentioned on the Salas UFSP which can be easily configured for MC... Thanks Abe! I have seen the replacement 103 bodies... definitely interested. I have a plan to build new plinth for 2 arms...
I think the 103 will sound great with the Jelcos than the SME IV.
I use a Schick Tonearm (12" at about 16.0 gms) and Orsonic AV-101S headshell (14.5 gms without cart) for DL-103.
For the 103R's or retipped 103 with Ruby cantilever, I use an SME 3012 (14 gms.) with SME headshell (6 gms) with great results.
Pics of the wood bodies.(Rosewood and Panzerholz).
And, as they say, no pics and it didn't happen. I included a pic of the Koetsu installed on my Teres 255.
Unfortunately, my old computer crashed and I only have pictures of the 901 with the box when I listed it for sale. I know I have a pic with it installed to the SME 3012 but I cannot find it. Enjoy!
I left a message to get an update. The covid 3rd surge is pretty devastating. Last conversation he said they were hit pretty hard. Hopefully he can ship soon. Will update as soon as I hear.
Cheers,
Geary
Cheers,
Geary
So, finally, Good News! Cinemag will ship the order by the end of the week. I should have them by Tuesday or Wednesday of next week, (Dec. 22 or 23)
I will do my best to get them posted before Christmas. I will update when I get tracking info from Cinemag. (If I do!)
Thanks for everyone's patience. (Mine is pretty much depleted!)
Happy Holidays,
Geary
I will do my best to get them posted before Christmas. I will update when I get tracking info from Cinemag. (If I do!)
Thanks for everyone's patience. (Mine is pretty much depleted!)
Happy Holidays,
Geary
I received the invoice and tracking number yesterday. But, as of this morning, UPS does not show receipt of the package. Everything is running slow due to the holidays and covid, so the tracking may be behind.
Happy Holidays,
Geary
Happy Holidays,
Geary