Here is nesting some monitors. From Lou's new studio making photo report. But I recommend you to browse through all the pages, tons of studio construction porn!
Thanks for the links and pics Salas. Lots to look through there.
I'm feeling that my next loudspeaker will likely be something along those lines with eye towards corner placement. Sort of build the cabinets into the corners and bridge the gap with the baffle.
The other route is narrow directivity speakers but I'm not a fan of those. It feels like a constant presence of sound from the loudspeaker themselves rather than stage in front of you. Maybe this is not a colouration I'm hearing but simply that I've become accustom to the foibles of wide dispersion drivers? Sometimes you listen to one thing for long enough you reject others because of that familiarity.
Bit like my dad with his old beat up car that I keep telling him to trade in for one with a cd player or at least one with a clock built into the dashboard
I'm feeling that my next loudspeaker will likely be something along those lines with eye towards corner placement. Sort of build the cabinets into the corners and bridge the gap with the baffle.
The other route is narrow directivity speakers but I'm not a fan of those. It feels like a constant presence of sound from the loudspeaker themselves rather than stage in front of you. Maybe this is not a colouration I'm hearing but simply that I've become accustom to the foibles of wide dispersion drivers? Sometimes you listen to one thing for long enough you reject others because of that familiarity.
Bit like my dad with his old beat up car that I keep telling him to trade in for one with a cd player or at least one with a clock built into the dashboard
ShinOBIWAN said:
I've ever only tried a very cursory attempt at using a barrier, most definitely nothing that anyone would ever call conclusive (or even well done)
I've looked at method A before...and am quite certain my rudimentary computer skills are not up to scratch. I mean, apart from being in the industry, just where? would you guys learn this amount of detail regarding computers
I can't even get a plugin into winamp that will stay there heh heh. I vaguely recall you mentioning somewhere your less than completely positive experiences with it, yet what is 'interesting' about this plugin is that the people who are 'promoting' it also seem to have reservations about the effectiveness of the race algorithm..whether this is actually better of course I have no idea.
Just a few random comments about this from the forum from a few people
After much experimentation, I find that the recursion (feedback) in the RACE encoder adds distortion............ In any case it's interesting to note that Keele was aware of the problem of the canceling process going on indefinitely. It is just that fact that was the motivation for the RACE algorithm. To me, the fact that the recursive (IIR) part of the RACE algorithm causes distortion isn't surprising. What is surprising to me is that only one delay in the cancellation signal works so well. ......... I do know this, there appears to be no loss of low frequency with your plugin/model as there is in the RACE or even the BACCH. I think most people who might have tired the older versions might find this one easier to digest at first. So this is Cool
Originally posted by terry j I mean, apart from being in the industry, just where? would you guys learn this amount of detail regarding computers
Being sad git helps here. Doesn't look like you meet the requirement Terry
I don't know about others but I work in IT so you do that stuff day in day out without thinking eventually. Its like anything else in that regard.Is this a DSP plugin for winamp?
You can access the options by right clicking on the winamp logo in the top left hand corner of the player. Once the menu is up go to option>preferences. From there you can scroll down to plugins and select the one you want. I think you'd need to look in output or DSP plugins for the one you want. Make sure you've installed the plugin itself correct otherwise it won't appear here. Once you've found it then double click to load, select the preference and then get back to the main winamp window to play.
Yes that was my own thought, I played around with for an evening then never touched it again. It reminded me of those surround sound reverb effects that you get on home theater amplifiers. Some material is made to sound more interesting for a while but ultimately its unnatural.
The thing that annoyed me about RACE was the bass. It bloomed and sounded overly indistinct and large. Dialling the effect level down somewhat helped but you were always relieved once you switched back to the normal approach. However with classical music recorded in large acoustic spaces where the bass does sound indistinct and large scale then it really did sound good and dare I say even more realistic. I believe that the majority of ambiophonics users are classic music fans so this would make sense. I listen to wide variety of music though and it just didn't work on that level.
I should give the one of the other methods a go so I can form a more rounded opinion but that's something for a rainy day.
ShinOBIWAN said:
yes it is. (maybe should start a new thread, feels very much off topic now, but I'm afraid I only frequent the loudspeaker section...would it be suitable here??)
I did manage after a lot of mucking around to get it installed, and even up and running!! I could hear that it was doing it's stuff from the computer (turn it on and off, widen or lessen the effect etc) but as I still had the standard stereo setup I didn't even bother to sit and listen.
At some stage I think I must have turned the computer off and ever since then it has not come back up. The annoying thing is that I can still see the plugin listed in the plugins folder, indeed right next to another plugin I used as a test (from the winamp site) that still comes up in the dsp window that allows for 'configuration', yet the one I want no longer appears in that dsp window.
I have tried downloading it again and repeating (hopefully heh heh) the same procedure, no luck. I have even gone as far as removing and re-installing winamp itself and repeating the procedure, but this time I can't even get to first base like I did last time.
I have left a message on the forum, hopefully it is some sort of known bug (about turning off the computer?? and it disappears) but it must be a slow forum as there has been no reply yet.
http://electro-music.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=27871&postorder=asc
You offend me sir!
I'm a sad git too!! Just in different areas I guess
Anyway, in a pathetic attempt to come back on topic...is this the same house which a lot of your construction pics (winter sub project etc etc) show? I vaguely recall a 'leafy outdoor' type area, this room seems to be of a different style to those pics.
Flush mounting is certainly an interesting approach to consider, from those who know or have experience with that what are the main differences you might expect to hear over 'freestanding' speakers??
I'd imagine the dispersion characteristics etc would be very different, but even then using the computer based approach would allow those factors to be taken into account easily.
I don't know if this may be helpful or not, I hope it is
We have just covered the walls of a room at work with this stuff. http://www.customaudiodesigns.co.uk/soundproofing/t60.htm because we have installed a vocal booth etc etc and the difference in the amount of sound reflected back from the walls is significant. A chap with 25 years experience as a music producer and someone who ran an audio research facility both agreed that the room sounded very much deader and there were no obvious reverberations when speaking.
We have just covered the walls of a room at work with this stuff. http://www.customaudiodesigns.co.uk/soundproofing/t60.htm because we have installed a vocal booth etc etc and the difference in the amount of sound reflected back from the walls is significant. A chap with 25 years experience as a music producer and someone who ran an audio research facility both agreed that the room sounded very much deader and there were no obvious reverberations when speaking.
terry j said:
update
got an answer on the forum hooray. Couldn't really help me tho.
Wanna know why??
Cause it's me that's the idjit that's why. ('no surprises there'. HEY I heard that!!)
Anyway, after I turned off the computer the next time I tried it I forgot to use the vst bridge host thingy.....
re -read the instructions and a light dawned in me 'ead. So all cool, up and running.
quickshift said:I don't know if this may be helpful or not, I hope it is
We have just covered the walls of a room at work with this stuff. http://www.customaudiodesigns.co.uk/soundproofing/t60.htm because we have installed a vocal booth etc etc and the difference in the amount of sound reflected back from the walls is significant. A chap with 25 years experience as a music producer and someone who ran an audio research facility both agreed that the room sounded very much deader and there were no obvious reverberations when speaking.
Thanks quickshift.
I'm surprised at the difference that makes considering its only a couple of mil thick. I wouldn't fancy using it in isolation since you'd have treatment aimed squarely at the higher frequencies - could be some tonal imbalances. But when used as part of system of treatments I think it might work well.
Too late in the day for me to consider this but like I say, thanks for the info.
I made a start on the painting over the past couple of days. I wish to god I could just spray the whole damn thing without fear of covering the rest of the house in paint dust. I hate decorating, crouching down and messing around on ladders isn't my idea of fun.
In an attempt to make it as painless as possible I picked up one of those Dulux Paintpod system. The thinking behind this gadget is to feed paint from a reservoir up to a paint roller and onto the wall or ceiling. This saves you spending about 5 seconds dipping the roller in more paint to refill - did I mention I was lazy?
Sounds simple enough and it would be useful if it worked, however it didn't for me. You see if its not putting too much paint on the roller thereby getting more on you and the floor than the walls, then its not putting enough on it. Yay for innovation! I was determined to get my £60 worth but after doing half the ceiling I was getting complaints from the neighbours about my swearing. You don't realise how well the old fashioned way works until you've suffered utter toss like this.
I've now awarded this paintpod thing a place in the gimmicky junk corner of the garage along side the left handed paint brushes and an electric self jamming stapler.
I've had to special order the Rockwool since nobody local carries stock. Should be here next week and by that point I'll have all the painting done.
Will take a photo or two once I'm done with the painting.
In an attempt to make it as painless as possible I picked up one of those Dulux Paintpod system. The thinking behind this gadget is to feed paint from a reservoir up to a paint roller and onto the wall or ceiling. This saves you spending about 5 seconds dipping the roller in more paint to refill - did I mention I was lazy?
Sounds simple enough and it would be useful if it worked, however it didn't for me. You see if its not putting too much paint on the roller thereby getting more on you and the floor than the walls, then its not putting enough on it. Yay for innovation! I was determined to get my £60 worth but after doing half the ceiling I was getting complaints from the neighbours about my swearing. You don't realise how well the old fashioned way works until you've suffered utter toss like this.
I've now awarded this paintpod thing a place in the gimmicky junk corner of the garage along side the left handed paint brushes and an electric self jamming stapler.
I've had to special order the Rockwool since nobody local carries stock. Should be here next week and by that point I'll have all the painting done.
Will take a photo or two once I'm done with the painting.
Yes I win! Room 0 Me 1. Painting completed.
Lots of goodies arrived today too. Venetian blinds finished in sweet real oak, a big roll of 1/4" open cell furniture foam for padding out the treatments giving giving a plush look and feel, 20m of LED rope light to stuff behind the framing for mood lighting, remote control dimmer unit for rope light, Vogels projector wall mount, suede finished blackout roller blind and a bunch of other random junk such as adhesives, fixings and cables.
Looks like I'm set for the rest of week.
Lots of goodies arrived today too. Venetian blinds finished in sweet real oak, a big roll of 1/4" open cell furniture foam for padding out the treatments giving giving a plush look and feel, 20m of LED rope light to stuff behind the framing for mood lighting, remote control dimmer unit for rope light, Vogels projector wall mount, suede finished blackout roller blind and a bunch of other random junk such as adhesives, fixings and cables.
Looks like I'm set for the rest of week.
Painting the ceiling and a product placement ad for Tesco:
Rockwool arrived much sooner than expected. Came home this evening and it was sat on the drive begging to be cut I wasn't taking any chances as I know this stuff can really itch like a mother so I slapped on the spraying boiler suit and a respirator. BTW These are really easy to cut, just mark and then use a handsaw. I had the lot done in couple of hours.
On goes the 1/4" open cell foam backing in preparation for the material. I just stapled this down and then trimmed with a bread knife. In hindsight I wish I'd done the cutting with scissors as the knife chewed the foam up a little. I'll do the rest with scissors but as you can see below I don't think its a problem anyway.
Here's the end result with material in fixed into place. Looks absolutely sweet in person. To fix the fabric I used some 25mm wide double sided foam tape that's around 0.8mm thick. I believe its normally used for attaching car license plates so its really tenacious stuff and has no problem holding the fabric. The tape went all around the frames and then gradually I made my way along the length of the frame pulling and fixing the material as I went. I'm no upholsterer so there was some head scratching on the corners but its not exactly heart surgery either so I just went with a variety of folds that best hide the fact they're there. Even women can manage this sort of thing so us blokes can walk it.
I've saved the best till last though; there's already a really noticeable change in the acoustics of the room. Its eerily quiet in here and putting your ear up to the treatments is quite strange since it feels like what I can only describe as a black hole for sound. There's just nothing there. Move your ear over to an untreated part of the wall and it sounds like you've stuck a sea shell next to your ear.
I'm anxious to get taking some measurements so as to compare to the untreated ones I posted earlier in this thread and more important than this, get all the audio gear back in so I can hear the improvement. An exciting prospect.
Finally I also took a trip to DFS this evening and picked out a new sofa for the room. I've always had a single seater in here which is very anti social but this time I've gone with a leather 2 seater with double recliners. Any guests will be happy to park their backsides on this, its comfy as hell.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Rockwool arrived much sooner than expected. Came home this evening and it was sat on the drive begging to be cut
I wasn't taking any chances as I know this stuff can really itch like a mother so I slapped on the spraying boiler suit and a respirator. BTW These are really easy to cut, just mark and then use a handsaw. I had the lot done in couple of hours.An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
On goes the 1/4" open cell foam backing in preparation for the material. I just stapled this down and then trimmed with a bread knife. In hindsight I wish I'd done the cutting with scissors as the knife chewed the foam up a little. I'll do the rest with scissors but as you can see below I don't think its a problem anyway.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Here's the end result with material in fixed into place. Looks absolutely sweet in person. To fix the fabric I used some 25mm wide double sided foam tape that's around 0.8mm thick. I believe its normally used for attaching car license plates so its really tenacious stuff and has no problem holding the fabric. The tape went all around the frames and then gradually I made my way along the length of the frame pulling and fixing the material as I went. I'm no upholsterer so there was some head scratching on the corners but its not exactly heart surgery either so I just went with a variety of folds that best hide the fact they're there. Even women can manage this sort of thing so us blokes can walk it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I've saved the best till last though; there's already a really noticeable change in the acoustics of the room. Its eerily quiet in here and putting your ear up to the treatments is quite strange since it feels like what I can only describe as a black hole for sound. There's just nothing there. Move your ear over to an untreated part of the wall and it sounds like you've stuck a sea shell next to your ear.
I'm anxious to get taking some measurements so as to compare to the untreated ones I posted earlier in this thread and more important than this, get all the audio gear back in so I can hear the improvement. An exciting prospect.
Finally I also took a trip to DFS this evening and picked out a new sofa for the room. I've always had a single seater in here which is very anti social but this time I've gone with a leather 2 seater with double recliners. Any guests will be happy to park their backsides on this, its comfy as hell.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Hi Ant,
I hadn't spotted this thread before - the room is looking great BTW.
Not something you really want to hear, but I had the same issues in my room; having to place the speakers at the 'thin' end of the room, resulting in them being very close to the side and rear walls.
With treatment, the room was pretty good (without it was really bad).
However, I've subsequently re-laid the room out, and having installed a new door (which now opens the opposite way to the old one) I've been able to move the speakers down to the other end of the room. This allowed me another foot or two of space between the speakers and the side walls.
The results were extremely surprising; it's not so practical for me to use the wall treatments with this layout (though the corner bass traps remain) but the sound if anything is better.
I took loads of measurements before/after with the original setup, though I've yet to take any with the new layout, as the room really needs a rug to help the center speaker (as it's now quite close to the floor). However, I'm very pleased with it.
BTW I now have a number of portable DIY acoustic panels at my place in Oxfordshire. One day I may use some of them, but if someone was seriously interested, I might be persuaded to be very charitable.
I hadn't spotted this thread before - the room is looking great BTW.
Not something you really want to hear, but I had the same issues in my room; having to place the speakers at the 'thin' end of the room, resulting in them being very close to the side and rear walls.
With treatment, the room was pretty good (without it was really bad).
However, I've subsequently re-laid the room out, and having installed a new door (which now opens the opposite way to the old one) I've been able to move the speakers down to the other end of the room. This allowed me another foot or two of space between the speakers and the side walls.
The results were extremely surprising; it's not so practical for me to use the wall treatments with this layout (though the corner bass traps remain) but the sound if anything is better.
I took loads of measurements before/after with the original setup, though I've yet to take any with the new layout, as the room really needs a rug to help the center speaker (as it's now quite close to the floor). However, I'm very pleased with it.
BTW I now have a number of portable DIY acoustic panels at my place in Oxfordshire. One day I may use some of them, but if someone was seriously interested, I might be persuaded to be very charitable.
Hi Gordon,
Thanks for the input. I remember seeing pics of your room with free standing absorbers along the side walls. Your right about such rooms being a PITA. It sounds like you've a similar room because mine too has a door on the longer wall which in this case is the rear of the room. Sadly its right in the corner so even if you swapped the hinges round to open outward, a speaker would be slap bang in the way.
Thanks for the input. I remember seeing pics of your room with free standing absorbers along the side walls. Your right about such rooms being a PITA. It sounds like you've a similar room because mine too has a door on the longer wall which in this case is the rear of the room. Sadly its right in the corner so even if you swapped the hinges round to open outward, a speaker would be slap bang in the way.
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.