Aerogel described on Audax data sheet
I made some medium floorstanders based on the IPL A2 in 1995. They are still in use as I've always been happy with them. The HM170ZO data sheet describes the composite as "Ultra light, extremely rigid and maximised internal damping. This no-compromise cone is based on a totally controlled matrix of acrylic polymer gel in which an optimized proportion of carbon and Kevlar fibres are embedded. An exclusive proprietary process acts to perfectly align the fibres along the polymer chain. This procedure allows total control over the contour and weight of the cone."
I made some medium floorstanders based on the IPL A2 in 1995. They are still in use as I've always been happy with them. The HM170ZO data sheet describes the composite as "Ultra light, extremely rigid and maximised internal damping. This no-compromise cone is based on a totally controlled matrix of acrylic polymer gel in which an optimized proportion of carbon and Kevlar fibres are embedded. An exclusive proprietary process acts to perfectly align the fibres along the polymer chain. This procedure allows total control over the contour and weight of the cone."
+1, a random fibre synthetic paper structure. I still have the cheaper, but more usable AP130ZO with polymer frame. Fantastic value and fantastic sound quality. In my opinion quite hard to beat without twice the cost. The cone edge rips easily, and all the true aerogels arent rigid enough, like soap bubbles or shaving foam as another commented. Theyre excellent HEAT insulators, but to the best of my knowledge theyre 'closed cells' so I have doubts they would be any good for sound absorption.
NASA researchers replace silica with polymers to create more flexible aerogels
That approach involved cross linking certain polymers with a bridging compound resulting in a new polymer that was stiff enough to hold its shape when subjected to supercritical drying, yet would remain flexible overall; an approach that worked so well that the team was able to create several different types of polymer aerogels that exhibit extraordinary properties.
Some of the new examples proved to be exceedingly strong; enough so to support a car when constructed as a thick slab and placed under a tire,....
That approach involved cross linking certain polymers with a bridging compound resulting in a new polymer that was stiff enough to hold its shape when subjected to supercritical drying, yet would remain flexible overall; an approach that worked so well that the team was able to create several different types of polymer aerogels that exhibit extraordinary properties.
Some of the new examples proved to be exceedingly strong; enough so to support a car when constructed as a thick slab and placed under a tire,....
Have you DIY'rs investigated Podszus cones? If you've got the $$$$, these look like sure winners.... Podszus has continued the groundbreaking work begun by Gorlich who's woofer/mids were standard in the much acclaimed Pawel Acoustics Ensemble Reference speakers.
hifisound eShop*-*Goerlich
hifisound eShop*-*Goerlich
The Audax is not the silica aerogel, it is their soft doping compound. Good drivers, but not the areojel you are thinking of.
The real aerogel would seem like a fantastic material. Some has been made lighter than air. You could make a solid cone and get a even drive to a true piston. Two problems. Cost, and it is so fragile you can barely touch it. The act of driving it would turn it to power.
The real aerogel would seem like a fantastic material. Some has been made lighter than air. You could make a solid cone and get a even drive to a true piston. Two problems. Cost, and it is so fragile you can barely touch it. The act of driving it would turn it to power.
I had hm170zo and z18 (i think) and both were quite terrible typical high-end toneless sound producing junk . Sorry guys it is what its is I know that one man junk is others treasure but audax aerogel drivers along with most other modern cone materials are for Ipod generation sound, more or less pleasant noise nothing more .
Probably
Some guys in Poland used them as midbases in bi- amped configuration with silver wired parallel 300B amp and audience didn't want to leave the room...but play them along JBL LE8 or Altec 803A and there is nothing left to say. I had an older kit based on audax aerogel drivers and few years after I played with vintage crap I tried to return to mainstream sound assembling it again. They sounded like squashed pumpkin. Anyway I think it shows that I hate modern High-End sound and all your efforts to copy most expensive or advanced modern speakers with their "high tech drivers " are march to the abyss (to me) Rgrds, L
I think that comparing large Altecs with higher WAF 'hifi' speakers is totally pointless. Im sure the Altecs have far more dynamic capability, but the cost is great.
Its alot more expensive to buy any Altec worthy of note, and I for one dont have the floor area to justify the cost.
Show me a sub 40 litre JBL or Altec that costs what the Audax cost me, and I may change my mind.
Btw the AP130Z0 cost £18 each, and the TW25F1 £11 each, 2 huge alphacore 12ga foil coils £30 each, and the rest. All in all perhaps £120 a pair including boxes. And they punch well above their weight.
Comparable to JBL or Altecs at several hundred or more? Probably not.
As Ms Tate would say- Am i bovvered?
In short, no.
Audio-snobbery 0: Frugal philia 1
Its alot more expensive to buy any Altec worthy of note, and I for one dont have the floor area to justify the cost.
Show me a sub 40 litre JBL or Altec that costs what the Audax cost me, and I may change my mind.
Btw the AP130Z0 cost £18 each, and the TW25F1 £11 each, 2 huge alphacore 12ga foil coils £30 each, and the rest. All in all perhaps £120 a pair including boxes. And they punch well above their weight.
Comparable to JBL or Altecs at several hundred or more? Probably not.
As Ms Tate would say- Am i bovvered?
In short, no.
Audio-snobbery 0: Frugal philia 1
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What WAF has to do with sound and cone material? Heck, I have vifa based speakers with paper cone and stamped frame (Living Voice Avatar) and they have tonal qualities unachievable to most "exotic cone" speakers out there. They are expensive but not because the drivers are. Here, I paid for WAF
The thing is that we vote with our money and we just promote mediocrity. I'm not sad at all that Audax is gone from DIY market with its aerogel cones and I'd gladly see Scan Speak and others follow with their dead drivers.
How many times it needs to be said that true DIY is not about saving money?
Anyway I'd agree that audax aerogel is not worse than other similar drivers and may be better than most I didn't hear. Rgrds, L
limono - I think your objection has more to do with the compliance of the driver, rather than the diaphragm material.
Those vifa drivers you mention have a foam surround, and are in a comparatively large rear chamber with very low damping. I'd also bet that the spider of the drivers was well "broken in".
As far as the top-end of a driver and the way it "breaks-up" - that's largely dependent on the *particular* driver which would of course include the diaphragm material. It also is necessarily dependent on the design of the loudspeaker and the operating bandwidth/crossover.
Personally I wouldn't "lump" all aerogel woofers as bad because of the use of aerogel - and in fact the overall sound of aerogel is quite similar to paper. (..just rub the diaphragm (*rear*) and listen to it - it has a very "papery" quality to it.)
Those vifa drivers you mention have a foam surround, and are in a comparatively large rear chamber with very low damping. I'd also bet that the spider of the drivers was well "broken in".
As far as the top-end of a driver and the way it "breaks-up" - that's largely dependent on the *particular* driver which would of course include the diaphragm material. It also is necessarily dependent on the design of the loudspeaker and the operating bandwidth/crossover.
Personally I wouldn't "lump" all aerogel woofers as bad because of the use of aerogel - and in fact the overall sound of aerogel is quite similar to paper. (..just rub the diaphragm (*rear*) and listen to it - it has a very "papery" quality to it.)
8" Audax used in Swan's product years ago sounded pretty good to my ears IIRC, that's an easy-going, effortless sound. For my taste, it's at least better than those so-called 'hi-end' but thin and stained sounding speakers...
Or maybe the Swan's designer did a good job in integrating the whole thing
IIRC, that's an easy-going, effortless sound. For my taste, it's at least better than those so-called 'hi-end' but thin and stained sounding speakers... Or maybe the Swan's designer did a good job in integrating the whole thing
Reviving this thread to see what has happened to the Audax aerogel drivers. Earlier posts were very complimentary about the sound, but not much seems to have happened to aerogel drivers since. Why the lack of take-up by speaker manufacturers - do other cone materials now sound better?
I'm wondering if it's worth pursuing an aerogel mid-bass like the HM170Z0 or should I now look elsewhere, for example the Audax carbon fibre mid-bass units used in the Acoustic Energy AE500 series?
I'm wondering if it's worth pursuing an aerogel mid-bass like the HM170Z0 or should I now look elsewhere, for example the Audax carbon fibre mid-bass units used in the Acoustic Energy AE500 series?
As I understand it (but may be wrong) as a normal active speaker driver company Audax ceased in the 90s. This suggests about 1994. The brand, tooling and remnants seems to be now owned by a company called AAC who seem to run off the odd batch of old Audax designs when there is a demand and, I think, possibly introduce the odd tweak. There isn't much activity though and the focus seems to be more on providing replacement drivers to keep old speakers going rather than developing modern drivers.
Aerogel is associated with the Audax brand from decades ago and I rather suspect that because of this if a current manufacturer were to introduce it as their new magic mix for speaker cones it wouldn't be that effective in the market.
Aerogel is associated with the Audax brand from decades ago and I rather suspect that because of this if a current manufacturer were to introduce it as their new magic mix for speaker cones it wouldn't be that effective in the market.
