I just expressed my opinion based on the available data. If it were all measured, I would know more precisely. I don't believe you can get a linear frequency range with this design, there is too much driver overlap. Off axis range is probably terrible. And the box seems small for two drivers. But in principle, they did a cheap 2.5way.
As for the modifications of cheap speakers, I did it, I posted a few pieces on the forum. It's not a problem for me, I said, I have measurement equipment (microphone, mic preamp, measurement JIG, external audio card, small amplifier, etc.), and I have a lot of parts accumulated over the years. I use Holmi Impulse for frequency range, ARTA for TS parameters and frequency range. The problem is for those who don't have it, then it's really hard to modify anything.
As for the modifications of cheap speakers, I did it, I posted a few pieces on the forum. It's not a problem for me, I said, I have measurement equipment (microphone, mic preamp, measurement JIG, external audio card, small amplifier, etc.), and I have a lot of parts accumulated over the years. I use Holmi Impulse for frequency range, ARTA for TS parameters and frequency range. The problem is for those who don't have it, then it's really hard to modify anything.
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It says 3 way 3 unit on service manual of s9. But flx9 says 2 way 3 unit . Flx drivers are exactly same but s9 has a cap on one of drivers . I think they just used these drivers in different boxes without any crossover how it could be 3 2 or 2.5 ?!
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@sohra3 , I've already explained why I think it's 2.5 way (acoustically). Manufacturers write anything and everything to sell their product, it doesn't have to be true and often it isn't. They usually sugarcoat things, claim a wider frequency range, larger power or efficiency than it is really and the like. There are speakers declared as 8 ohm nominal, and their impedance drops to 3 ohms in some part of the spectrum, there is anything and everything.
Since it's the same speaker we're talking about from the start, if you're not happy with the sound, if the midrange is lacking, do the same. Increase the capacitor on the tweeter, add some damping material, listen to the result and leave it as you like. Just don't go over 4uF and that's all you can do without measuring. Find some quality plastic capacitors to replace electrolytic ones. If you add damping, make sure that the bass reflex opening remains free, and that there is no possibility of spontaneous displacement of the damping in the box.
Since it's the same speaker we're talking about from the start, if you're not happy with the sound, if the midrange is lacking, do the same. Increase the capacitor on the tweeter, add some damping material, listen to the result and leave it as you like. Just don't go over 4uF and that's all you can do without measuring. Find some quality plastic capacitors to replace electrolytic ones. If you add damping, make sure that the bass reflex opening remains free, and that there is no possibility of spontaneous displacement of the damping in the box.
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On the condition that one of the mid basses is not cut off electrically by the crossover and thus made 2.5 way 🤣
I dissasanpble one of my speaker Walcen . Im going to do measurements and try crossover besides capacitor.i think can reach at least better than no crossover.i will share results .there are oil capacitor with Brand Icar .4 micro costs only 1 dollar here and a saw it used for crossover .
These are first test . Subwoofer woofer tweeter . First time i do that i dont know i do it right or not . Attach a razr gaming headset microphone to smartphone . Play 20hz to 20khz from pc .
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I don't know my friend . Its says 3 way on manual of dp800 and s9 . Driver's look like each other different boxes . Other is flx9 with 2 exactly same driver it says 2 way on sony website . But as our friends said without crossover these means nothing . Also hear same sound on 2 drivers with cap and no cap i think sounds different .
It's not a rule, it's just my estimation. Larger, more powerful, ferrofluid filled tweeters can handle 1st order low cut. Most can't. In any case, the 1st order cut is quite demanding for the tweeters, it puts more stress on them, the THD increases due to the longer travel of the diaphragm, and they burn out more easily.
Some manufacturers insist on 1st order crossovers, for example Dynaudio, although they also put 2nd order on the tweeter in some models.
The dip above 14kHz is most likely due to the microphone. The rest is OK at first glance. Mid bases have a natural roll off above 3KHz, they probably don't even need a crossover, just to fit the tweeter nicely wit that one capacitor. It can be seen that they are not identical, one falls earlier than the other.
Measure the entire loudspeaker at a distance of 1m in the axis of the tweeter.
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Shown here is the measurement of driver impedance and TS parameters using a PC audio card and headphone output. The additional mass method and ARTA (LIMP) software were used. I use the same, I just have an additional small amplifier, JIG and an external sound card. Probably not the most accurate measurement, but still very useful for choosing the volume of the box. Better something than nothing. 🤣
https://zobsky.blogspot.com/2008/01/simple-loudspeaker-measurement-jig-for.html
With ampifier:
https://www.instructables.com/ARTA-Measurement-Box/
https://zobsky.blogspot.com/2008/01/simple-loudspeaker-measurement-jig-for.html
With ampifier:
https://www.instructables.com/ARTA-Measurement-Box/
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I have to go shopping tomorrow . I put a 4u capacitor subwoofer and tweeter only sounds very good but combination of 3 driver a bit better than past but there is problem with these speaker .feels ferecuncy goes together wrongly .is there any basic way to seperate ferecuncy range going to woofer and subwoofer that i can test until i do measurements ? We have an extra woofer on these speakers 😁
This is the challenge. You want to match the levels. You also want to bring together the slopes, otherwise the response can be uneven, up and down. This sometimes happens when higher orders are set without properly tuning them.
There is a way for everything, but measure firsts speakers as they are. It always starts from measurements, and then changes are made.
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Hi guys . I couldn't measure drivers yet but i figured out that 4uf capacitor just send too much ferecuncy to tweeters i can hear some bad noise it sounds more but i think these noises show 4 is too much. I put a 2.2 uf as i can hear no more noises . The problem is that allen said . I run only subwoofer and tweeter its sounds very good but 3 driver are not balance together just have loudness.i will do measurements and go for a cross over design as soon as i can . Thank you im glad to start learning new things 🙏💐
So with 2.2 you get a balanced sound with
one woofer(2way) As I understand you can use the second woofer to support/give more of the deepest bass by turning it into a 2,5 way.
Coils for low-passing 2nd woofer at low frequency are large and expensive, or you can wind/rewind one yourself.
-Maybe there are another cheaper way to low pass?
Since sound is balanced as a two way with one woofer, the tweeter seems not efficient enough for a MTM(Middwoofer, Tweeter, Middwoofer) two-way.
Cheers!
one woofer(2way) As I understand you can use the second woofer to support/give more of the deepest bass by turning it into a 2,5 way.
Coils for low-passing 2nd woofer at low frequency are large and expensive, or you can wind/rewind one yourself.
-Maybe there are another cheaper way to low pass?
Since sound is balanced as a two way with one woofer, the tweeter seems not efficient enough for a MTM(Middwoofer, Tweeter, Middwoofer) two-way.
Cheers!
Unfortunately no, just a big coil on that second mid bass to compensate for the baffle step.
If that one driver is thrown out, then it must be physically removed and something should be put in its place, say a thick aluminum plate. As I said before, the box is probably too small for both of those mid basses.
The right thing would be to measure it all in the box (FR range and impedance) and make a real crossover, especially on the tweeter go to 2nd. order cut because apparently there are problems with the 1st. order.
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