john curl said:That is nonsense, but I do have a curve tracer, that shows the effect.
I would love to see a picture, I would consider any bi-polar that requires 2V Vcb in its normal Ic range to be pathological.
Well, it disappointed me at the time, since it was destined to be used in a proven circuit, and I had gone out of my way to get the devices through formal introductions in Japan.
Still, it won't work in my patented circuit. Check the circuit out, yourselves, if you are curious. This is only for experts, amateurs need not bother.
Still, it won't work in my patented circuit. Check the circuit out, yourselves, if you are curious. This is only for experts, amateurs need not bother.
Quasi-sat will do this, that is why the RHOM devices worked in a breadboard while an integrated version failed, but 2V seems excessive. A graph of Vsat vs Ic should show something bad.
john curl said:Thought you might know without any more input.
Unfortunately I need something more consistent to pitch my fork in.
Oh, well, thought you might know. There is enough info there, if this was a common problem.
Scott, the Rohm's worked OK in the same circuit, same as the 2N4403, and Fairchild 2A output devices.
Scott, the Rohm's worked OK in the same circuit, same as the 2N4403, and Fairchild 2A output devices.
BTW, www.bdent.com still carries 2SC2547/2SA1084 for about $1/pair in 50's. I'll order some first chance and do some measurements.
Looking at the datasheets, there's nothing outstanding or peculiar regarding these parts.
Looking at the datasheets, there's nothing outstanding or peculiar regarding these parts.
Syn,
I'll sure be interested in any measurements you cfan do on them. Just know they sound very good, but we didn't need personal introductions in Japan to get them in '75, so maybe they are not the ones John is referring to.
Regards, Allen (Vacuum State)
I'll sure be interested in any measurements you cfan do on them. Just know they sound very good, but we didn't need personal introductions in Japan to get them in '75, so maybe they are not the ones John is referring to.
Regards, Allen (Vacuum State)
Kinda hard to get the 2SC3329/2SA1316.
Do you know any sources for them?
Sigurd
Do you know any sources for them?
Sigurd
mkc said:Hi all,
I'm lurking, but wanted to mention the Toshiba 2SC3329/2SA1316. I have used these as replacement for the ROHM. However, the Toshiba have smaller Cob, as far as I remember.
Sigurd Ruschkow said:Kinda hard to get the 2SC3329/2SA1316.
Do you know any sources for them?
Sorry, I was quoting from memory. It's 2SC2362/2SA1016. www.bdent.com has them in stock.
2SC3329/2SA1316
I was asking about the 2SC3329/2SA1316 as I cannot find them easily or at all.
I have plenty of 2SC2362/2SA1016K grade G which I bought from Profusion in GB,
Sigurd
I was asking about the 2SC3329/2SA1316 as I cannot find them easily or at all.
I have plenty of 2SC2362/2SA1016K grade G which I bought from Profusion in GB,
Sigurd
syn08 said:
Hi Sigurd,
Sorry, no. I have less than 10 of each here I bought back in the mid 80'ties.
I seem to remember that Borbely to have them.
BR,
Mogens
Sorry, no. I have less than 10 of each here I bought back in the mid 80'ties.
I seem to remember that Borbely to have them.
BR,
Mogens
This is absurd!
The 2SA1084, you can get them cheaply and in quantity?
I am impressed.
Of course, when I sent one to Yishay Netzer, some years ago, it couldn't have been for any good reason, could it? And when Honeywell engineers replied back and wanted more, it must have been a fluke as well.
Now, because it was so hard to get, I gave Dr. R.G, Meyer an alternative part: a Fairchild PE8550, 2A TO-92 type device for his project, since they were available from 50 mi away, with a phone call. The 2SA1084 would have worked in his input stage, but he didn't need the very high beta, high voltage, and low input capacitance, and they were harder to get. Rbb' was about the same in both devices.
The 2SA1084, you can get them cheaply and in quantity?
I am impressed.
Of course, when I sent one to Yishay Netzer, some years ago, it couldn't have been for any good reason, could it? And when Honeywell engineers replied back and wanted more, it must have been a fluke as well.
Now, because it was so hard to get, I gave Dr. R.G, Meyer an alternative part: a Fairchild PE8550, 2A TO-92 type device for his project, since they were available from 50 mi away, with a phone call. The 2SA1084 would have worked in his input stage, but he didn't need the very high beta, high voltage, and low input capacitance, and they were harder to get. Rbb' was about the same in both devices.
john curl said:This is absurd!
The 2SA1084, you can get them cheaply and in quantity?
I am impressed.
Of course, when I sent one to Yishay Netzer, some years ago, it couldn't have been for any good reason, could it? And when Honeywell engineers replied back and wanted more, it must have been a fluke as well.
Now, because it was so hard to get, I gave Dr. R.G, Meyer an alternative part: a Fairchild PE8550, 2A TO-92 type device for his project, since they were available from 50 mi away, with a phone call. The 2SA1084 would have worked in his input stage, but he didn't need the very high beta, high voltage, and low input capacitance, and they were harder to get. Rbb' was about the same in both devices.
http://bdent.com/search/part.jsp?partnum=2SA1084
http://bdent.com/search/part.jsp?partnum=2SC2547
Don't know what you mean "in quantities" but you can certainly get them in the hundreds. I just ordered 150pcs. each.
And in Europe:
http://www.schuro.de/preisl-jap-trans.htm
We get 100's of each every two or three months. no supply problem so far.
Regards, Allen (Vacuum State0
http://www.schuro.de/preisl-jap-trans.htm
We get 100's of each every two or three months. no supply problem so far.
Regards, Allen (Vacuum State0
john curl said:At this moment I am getting 0.42nV/rt Hz at 3ma on my Quantech with a 2sa1084.
That's pretty dang good! Are you going to try replacing your matched jfets with them and see how they sound?
My opinion and experience of bp's against jfets says they will sound better than the jfets, with more resolution, more detail and just overall more musical feeling. At least as cascodes under tubes, but also in x1 buffers and other different all SS circuits.
Regards, Allen (Vacuum State)
Wavebourn,
transistors have a linear region, appointed by biasing.
The nonlinearity of BJT s chiefly caused by base-emitter irregularities and the reverse transfer capacitance. Keeping Ice and Vce constant stabilizes several parameters. A higher Ic flattens variations in Gm, thereby in the impedance, which relates the input voltage to output current. (It can be mentioned here, that the tight I/Gm ratio of BJTs is not advantageous in transconductor applications, as nonlinearities in the current-voltage characteristic become large for small voltage swings. In addition, FETs have better low-level signal amplifying ability due to lower intrinsic noise, the current flowing through the channel uninterruptedly without crossing a P-N junction, also a much wider operating frequency range).
It is obvious that Vbe must be small. Emitter degeneration reduces it, alongside with Gm and the hurtful nonlinear temperature dependency.
More can be done, without using diodes, they don`t linearize anything, just supply distortion.
transistors have a linear region, appointed by biasing.
The nonlinearity of BJT s chiefly caused by base-emitter irregularities and the reverse transfer capacitance. Keeping Ice and Vce constant stabilizes several parameters. A higher Ic flattens variations in Gm, thereby in the impedance, which relates the input voltage to output current. (It can be mentioned here, that the tight I/Gm ratio of BJTs is not advantageous in transconductor applications, as nonlinearities in the current-voltage characteristic become large for small voltage swings. In addition, FETs have better low-level signal amplifying ability due to lower intrinsic noise, the current flowing through the channel uninterruptedly without crossing a P-N junction, also a much wider operating frequency range).
It is obvious that Vbe must be small. Emitter degeneration reduces it, alongside with Gm and the hurtful nonlinear temperature dependency.
More can be done, without using diodes, they don`t linearize anything, just supply distortion.
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