fb said:
Here's some new development that may interest you.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=127520
Check the end of the thread for latest.
The solution they're using there is 8192 taps. I'm using 65536 and 131072 taps for my 44Khz and 96Khz filter respectively.
These need horse power.
How many taps are you using?
These have dc protection in the form of a relay and some have used fuses in line with tweeters to capture high power inputs.
These won't stop pops and crackles getting to your drivers.
You could setup up a fast reacting compressor plugin such as the ones from Waves but these will do more harm than good because you'll mash transients on genuine music content.
Short answer, no
Sometime ago I started a basic guide intended to explore the common functions within Acourate with the aim of helping someone get from nothing to a complete speaker featuring crossovers, driver linearisation, time alignment and room correction.
Its not as complete or polished as I'd like but I've buffed up a couple pages and they can be downloaded from the link below. I could continue but I have to ask myself, would this be of use to anyone?
I realise not many folks use Acourate so I might be wasting breath here. At the time I wrote it for myself as Acourate is one of those programs that if you don't use for a good while then you tend to forget small details and make mistakes but besides using it for my own faulty memory it would probably work well as guide for a newcomer too.
Link to PDF download:
http://www.mediafire.com/?fznkirvzvxl
Its not as complete or polished as I'd like but I've buffed up a couple pages and they can be downloaded from the link below. I could continue but I have to ask myself, would this be of use to anyone?
I realise not many folks use Acourate so I might be wasting breath here. At the time I wrote it for myself as Acourate is one of those programs that if you don't use for a good while then you tend to forget small details and make mistakes but besides using it for my own faulty memory it would probably work well as guide for a newcomer too.
Link to PDF download:
http://www.mediafire.com/?fznkirvzvxl
Thanks for that... the Acourate guide may be useful, it sure seems more detailed than that provided on their website!
Do you know of any sound cards that don't pop on poweron/off? If I go the soundcard -> poweramp route I can't rely on my family members (or me) to switch things on in the right order.
Re taps, I haven't actually used this yet, don't have a CUDA GPU. I've asked Koon about this, awaiting reply.
Cheers
Do you know of any sound cards that don't pop on poweron/off? If I go the soundcard -> poweramp route I can't rely on my family members (or me) to switch things on in the right order.
Re taps, I haven't actually used this yet, don't have a CUDA GPU. I've asked Koon about this, awaiting reply.
Cheers
fb said:
Yep I think Uli knows the program so well and his email support is first rate so I assume that he didn't see fit to create a manual but for a $500 program its an over sight IMO.
There are a few video's on the Acourate website but these are of fairly limited use and don't explain much. They're the bare essentials required really.
RME and EMU cards don't pop, they've got relays to prevent this and/or BIOS code to prevent this. I had a Lynx 2B that did on power up but not power off. I also had an Audigy and this always popped, even resetting the machine caused one.
Not sure about the rest.
ShinOBIWAN, the program is open source so it is easy to adjust the taps value once that is the actual issue. So far it is in the beginnings, needs more polishing and maybe he adds the config to the gui.
I may be wrong but his is just a crossover filter, meaning there is no hundreds peaks and dips so maybe 8192 is enough.
Btw what do you currently use as a digital signal splitter/preamp/amps if there was any change?
So far the best solution I heard about is the Uli's fanless PC/RME/Tact.
But I'm a little skeptical about the Tact audio performance, rarely heard something positive, however they might be fine without the crossover load.
Then there is that second pc and soundcard pass, so much degradation and idle power consumption, then we come to the reclocker need which Uli uses as well.
Seems like one needs $10k min to actually try all that. I am having a bit of a problem with that jump so I will convince myself for a few more months and keep it open for other solutions like this HDMI idea just surfaced.
I may be wrong but his is just a crossover filter, meaning there is no hundreds peaks and dips so maybe 8192 is enough.
Btw what do you currently use as a digital signal splitter/preamp/amps if there was any change?
So far the best solution I heard about is the Uli's fanless PC/RME/Tact.
But I'm a little skeptical about the Tact audio performance, rarely heard something positive, however they might be fine without the crossover load.
Then there is that second pc and soundcard pass, so much degradation and idle power consumption, then we come to the reclocker need which Uli uses as well.
Seems like one needs $10k min to actually try all that. I am having a bit of a problem with that jump so I will convince myself for a few more months and keep it open for other solutions like this HDMI idea just surfaced.
nuhi said:
There's always a law of diminishing returns and so upping the number of taps hits a brick wall. I think what's important is that you have enough to get good correction resolution. The higher the sampling rate the more taps needed to maintain resolution.
I've always used 65536 with my 44Khz and 48Khz audio so I cannot honestly say whether there's any audible and useful advantage over 8192 or 4096.
I like to try different and new solutions but what I have at the minute works very well for my needs and the quality is first rate.
Its a dedicated PC running console and convolver with 96Khz 64bit filters generated in Acourate. Soundcard is a Lynx AES16e SRC with 8 channels of hardware sample rate converter, I set these to take any incoming audio and upsample to 96Khz. From there the processed audio goes to Lynx' Aurora 16 AD/DAC and then onto the amps/speakers.
All audio is sent to the dedicated PC via my regular PC which has a Lynx AES16e. Its all digital right up to the amps with only one DA conversion.
The soundcard in the dedicated PC is set as the master clock and the DAC/regular PC draw their reference from this.
You can still get nice results for relatively small budget. I had an EMU 1820m interface and this was exceptional for the money. A good PC can be had quite cheaply these days. The software you use to accomplish this is up to you, personally I think Acourate is the best right now.
A PC, soundcard and Acourate can be had for $1500. This would make a nice setup.
loddie said:Shin, thanks for the guide! I don't have Acourate yet, but plan to eventually when I have a system worthy of it. BTW, what part of England are you in? I'll be flying across the pond Tuesday to Leeds
Please note its only a couple of pages(not much of a guide by any stretch!) that I buffed up from the rough reference notes I use. I really just put it out there to see if there's any interest, if that turns out to be the case then I'm more likely to continue converting what I have and possibly extending it to other topics.
I'm in Chesterfield, Derbyshire which is around an hour from Leeds.
I've got to ask... why Leeds!? I take it this isn't a holiday for you
loddie said:Business, definitely not a holiday. I won't be there long, and won't have a rental car. I will just have to wait until you finish the "listening room" walls before coming for a listen
Anyone who's either A) six foot tall with a massive rack B) well versed in the force or C) carrying a pack of brews is welcome.
I use PC with Emu 1820M and Izotope Ozone for the xover + Voxengo audio delay for time alignement.
It's realy great and not so hard to make it work.
What sucks is that new Emu's (1616M) only have 6 outputs, not as good as 1820M (still can be found used).
I had more important jobs to do on the speakers than trying convolution, room correction. I don't think I'll try because it's maybe long, taugh and not 100% sure.
My set up :
JBL 2226H on Crown K2
McCauley 6520 on 300hz Horn powered by Lab Gruppen IP 450
Fostex T90A powered by Lab Gruppen IP 450
Sounds good
Greg.
It's realy great and not so hard to make it work.
What sucks is that new Emu's (1616M) only have 6 outputs, not as good as 1820M (still can be found used).
I had more important jobs to do on the speakers than trying convolution, room correction. I don't think I'll try because it's maybe long, taugh and not 100% sure.
My set up :
JBL 2226H on Crown K2
McCauley 6520 on 300hz Horn powered by Lab Gruppen IP 450
Fostex T90A powered by Lab Gruppen IP 450
Sounds good
Greg.
ShinOBIWAN, thx for the reply.
I already use Slimdevices Transporter with Acourate filters then to preamp-amp-3way speaker with passive crossover.
It sounds great but you know, one more veil until salvation
Thing is will the soundcard+DA converter from Lynx or RME sound better or equal to Transporter's Ethernet playback, will Tact or some other 3 amps sound better or equal to Bryston with passive crossover.
What to do with volume control. So soundcard to Tact amps directly without the DA converter solve that issues if the first amp controls the volume for all.
It seems like a weird trade off without real winners. I will need to know that passive crossover is more harm than soundcard and digital amps. Not to mention the fuss with the second pc, added power consumption and a delay for filter processing.
Uh I'm convincing myself to keep it as it is, not my plan. Feel free to convince me otherwise, maybe someone has some miracle story, but only if you had a great passive speaker to begin with.
I already use Slimdevices Transporter with Acourate filters then to preamp-amp-3way speaker with passive crossover.
It sounds great but you know, one more veil until salvation
Thing is will the soundcard+DA converter from Lynx or RME sound better or equal to Transporter's Ethernet playback, will Tact or some other 3 amps sound better or equal to Bryston with passive crossover.
What to do with volume control. So soundcard to Tact amps directly without the DA converter solve that issues if the first amp controls the volume for all.
It seems like a weird trade off without real winners. I will need to know that passive crossover is more harm than soundcard and digital amps. Not to mention the fuss with the second pc, added power consumption and a delay for filter processing.
Uh I'm convincing myself to keep it as it is, not my plan. Feel free to convince me otherwise, maybe someone has some miracle story, but only if you had a great passive speaker to begin with.
nuhi said:ShinOBIWAN, thx for the reply.
I already use Slimdevices Transporter with Acourate filters then to preamp-amp-3way speaker with passive crossover.
It sounds great but you know, one more veil until salvation
Thing is will the soundcard+DA converter from Lynx or RME sound better or equal to Transporter's Ethernet playback, will Tact or some other 3 amps sound better or equal to Bryston with passive crossover.
What to do with volume control. So soundcard to Tact amps directly without the DA converter solve that issues if the first amp controls the volume for all.
It seems like a weird trade off without real winners. I will need to know that passive crossover is more harm than soundcard and digital amps. Not to mention the fuss with the second pc, added power consumption and a delay for filter processing.
Uh I'm convincing myself to keep it as it is, not my plan. Feel free to convince me otherwise, maybe someone has some miracle story, but only if you had a great passive speaker to begin with.
Volume control used to be a sticking point but there's a couple of solutions now that I'm aware of.
DACT passive volume pots in ganged configuration and stepped motor with IR remote
PC equipped iMON IR receiver and software with AutoIT automation software. You can map any number of tasks that can be accomplished with the keyboard/mouse to a single keypress on a remote.
I use the last one as it offers a nice combination of power and flexibility. I've got mine setup so I've got basic digital volume control after the processing has taken place to ensure maximum SNR and precision BUT its still not perfect because the signal is attenuated before the DAC's. A better solution would be after the DACs and before the amps.
I don't think I can convince anyone that the whole PCXO or DRC route is the right path and always definitively offers improvement over other solutions. The only way to know is to try for yourself with your audio system and room.
ShinOBIWAN, true but we are back to the issue of $10k to just try it, at least the thing I would like to try.
If I could visit Uli at his house or at some hifi show that would be nice
I tried the Transporter's digital volume control so that I can remove the preamp but it did not sounded better, at least on the low volumes.
Or all that SNR talk I read before made me sensitive to it (read: placebo).
I'll post here if there is any progress and comparison of active/passive. Probably in a few months, can't resist not to try it.
If I could visit Uli at his house or at some hifi show that would be nice
I tried the Transporter's digital volume control so that I can remove the preamp but it did not sounded better, at least on the low volumes.
Or all that SNR talk I read before made me sensitive to it (read: placebo).
I'll post here if there is any progress and comparison of active/passive. Probably in a few months, can't resist not to try it.
I recently also look into digital volume control and the comparison with passive volume control. I suppose if you can have digital volume control without doing too much attenuation, then it is not bad at all especially if you run it at 64bt floating point like insider cPlay or Brutefir with proper dithering.
I am using SPL Volume8 which sounds good, but not as good as my digital volume control using BruteFIR. I am looking into the DAC output so that I can reduce the output voltage and I can keep the digital volume high.
I am using SPL Volume8 which sounds good, but not as good as my digital volume control using BruteFIR. I am looking into the DAC output so that I can reduce the output voltage and I can keep the digital volume high.
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