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300B advice

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#26
I'm another builder who prefers using a 2a3 to a 300b, so I'm with jcalvarez there. I wouldn't pay money for a premium 300b (or in fact any 300b) when a 2a3 is to my ears a better sounding tube if you don't need the power. But looks like the OP has cast his lot in with the 300b. I have no recommendations there. Maybe at a future point the OP might try a 2a3 amp.
 
#27
lickumms said:
Wait, is Bottlehead considered mediocre? I've really liked the kits I've built from them.
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I have not said it . You said it yourself that the kits level is not high enough to use better tubes like EML etc. I have no experience with Bottlehead kits but Paul Jopa who designs them is a good ,competent guy who openly shares what he knows. If you like them that's fine . Just don't buy the cheapest one. Cheap SET amps tend to be rather disappointing in my humble experience- no magic and no power either ...
 
#28
You don't seek out SET amps if you want power. Better off with something like a Pass 25W amp running hot in class A.

The thing is, though, that "cheap" isn't a problem if you know how to design and build a valve amp yourself. It becomes a big problem when you are a beginner in valve equipment or need to build a kit. Add on $1,000 before you start. No doubt quite a few of us started off by modifying existing equipment - get a working amp and learn to understand it and measure and write down the circuit. Then go from there in small steps over time, reading endless tutorials and staying always within safe limits. That's a cheaper option and Stephe of Skunkie Designs has produced a lot of really informative YT videos for those that want to start with a cheap Chinese amp - including a 300b one in fact.
 
#30
andyjevans said:
You don't seek out SET amps if you want power. Better off with something like a Pass 25W amp running hot in class A.

The thing is, though, that "cheap" isn't a problem if you know how to design and build a valve amp yourself. It becomes a big problem when you are a beginner in valve equipment or need to build a kit. Add on $1,000 before you start. No doubt quite a few of us started off by modifying existing equipment - get a working amp and learn to understand it and measure and write down the circuit. Then go from there in small steps over time, reading endless tutorials and staying always within safe limits. That's a cheaper option and Stephe of Skunkie Designs has produced a lot of really informative YT videos for those that want to start with a cheap Chinese amp - including a 300b one in fact.
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Unfortunately one always need some power for satisfying low end performance otherwise a love affair with a SET amp is usually short lived. Constant tweaking with a system or amp is an activity in itself detached from a pleasure of listening to music . My only comment was that if someone is on tight budget buying the cheapest basic model is a loosing proposition. Being relatively poor my whole life I came to conclusion that I simply can't afford cheap things .
 
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#32
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#33
grovergardner said:
OTOH, I have an Elekit 8600 right here, on loan. It is very quiet, very clean, and has excellent bass. But I also find it uninteresting. It's a well-designed kit, also with quality parts, but I feel as though they have tried too hard to make it "clean" and quiet at the expense of musical excitement.
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That's interesting. What are the specs of your borrowed Elekit 8600 as far as tubes, coupling caps, or Lundahls?
I have Bottlehead Paramour 2A3 monos (with teflon caps, EML 2A3) and Elekit 8600 (Jupiter copper foil caps, Takatsuki 300B), but I wouldn't call the 8600 overly "clean" or "uninteresting."
 
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#34
I was lucky enough to have a number of friends that had 300B tubes of all different brands.

Over a couple months I rolled several pairs and the tubes that blow them all away were the KR-300Bs.

They are expensive but damn they are worth every penny.
 
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#35
The EML 300B mesh-plates sound better to me than the JJs but significantly more expensive. The Sophia Princess 300B punched plate were wonderful at much less money than the EML tubes but two sets only lasted a few months before the filaments shorted against the plates. The EMLs have lasted a number of years now.
 
#36
For the price they all should last a lifetime like Original WE 300b did . I had bad experience with EML . They had a run of faulty tubes in the past and passed the cost of correcting the manufacturing mistakes on their customers. All 300B makers are promising improvements over Original design but none of the delivered in longevity of their tubes thanks to steady supply of suckers in the hobby me being one of them , meh
 
#37
Well they don't and as a former WE dealer in the late 1990s and early 2000s the WE tubes were not consistently reliable in that time frame either. I have no experience with the current production, but they have a really long warranty which is encouraging.

The JJ300B have been long lived in my experience, and I agree with WntrMute2 that the EML sound better than the JJ for a good deal more money. I also use and really like the EML20B.

I don't believe most of us are suckers, I have had the same experience with several small manufacturers and it is part of the risk of playing in this landscape, and yes I was not happy about the money lost.

Of the tubes I am familiar with JJ 300B has by far the best track record for long term reliability. (Frankly compared to any modern power tube I could care to name.)
 
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#39
grovergardner said:
There's nothing "pathetic" about Bottlehead kits, IMO. They are cleverly designed and use high-quality components. OTOH, I have an Elekit 8600 right here, on loan. It is very quiet, very clean, and has excellent bass. But I also find it uninteresting. It's a well-designed kit, also with quality parts, but I feel as though they have tried too hard to make it "clean" and quiet at the expense of musical excitement.
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Good info! I was thinking about the elekit 300B myself but now I am concerned it maybe another 'emotionally unavailable' amp. 😉
 
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#40
drjlo said:
That's interesting. What are the specs of your borrowed Elekit 8600 as far as tubes, coupling caps, or Lundahls?
I have Bottlehead Paramour 2A3 monos (with teflon caps, EML 2A3) and Elekit 8600 (Jupiter copper foil caps, Takatsuki 300B), but I wouldn't call the 8600 overly "clean" or "uninteresting."
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The board was professionally built and then reinspected by my tech friend for consistency. It has the Lundahl OPT upgrade. Caps are stock. I have EH Gold 300Bs in it, along with some very good NOS preamp tubes. We were both very much looking forward to hearing it but were disappointed by the lack of dynamics and vocal and instrumental texture. I have original ProAc Response 2's, and while they aren't terrible efficient they are quite SE-friendly. I used them with my own SE 300B amps for several years with real pleasure, and my friend has his own 300B amps. So neither of us is unfamiliar with the plusses and minuses of SE amps. All I can tell you is what we heard. Possibly the auto-bias prohibits clipping, which under these circumstances would limit the behavior of the ProAcs. We just did not enjoy the sound, and after 30 minutes swapped the Elekit out for a 12 wpc stereo Pilot EL84 amp I had just finished restoring. The difference was night and day.
 
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