I think Nahimic means the same. It is not the Hypex module that will decide the manipulation, but it is capable of it. The designer still has to come up with what the manipulation is.
Last edited:
I apologize, this was my first message, I did not write in it that we need to copy something, much less transfer it somewhere. This would be absurd in meaning.
I suggested to the author to improve the case as much as possible by all possible means (stiffeners inside, damping material, sealant), remove the analog crossover, insert Hypex, take the characteristics of this system and improve them as much as possible with the help of Hypex. At the output, we will get experience, speakers that should sound better than the old ones (but not ideal for our preferences). The next step is to buy excellent speakers, assemble an excellent case for them, insert Hypex and configure using the experience gained.
Good speakers for a good case.
(English is not my native language, there may be some inaccuracies in terms (I'm working on it)).
Maybe I'm wrong, but right now, I would do the following with the old system:
1) Remove the analog crossover
2) Stiffeners inside the case.
3) Sealing all seams inside the case.
4) Damping material on the inner walls of the housing.
5) Connect Hypex without inserting it into the system case.
6) Get the characteristics of the new system.
7) Change (improve) the characteristics of the new system using Hypex.
My personal opinion is that Hypex and new (expensive) speakers are redundant for this system, since a much better system can be assembled on their basis. (If you insert a modern Mercedes engine into a Zaporozhets(an old Soviet car of disgusting quality), it will not become a Mercedes.)
As a teaching tool, the option with the old system is wonderful; after experiments, return the analog crossover to its place, and put the system itself in the garage.
IMHO
1) Remove the analog crossover
2) Stiffeners inside the case.
3) Sealing all seams inside the case.
4) Damping material on the inner walls of the housing.
5) Connect Hypex without inserting it into the system case.
6) Get the characteristics of the new system.
7) Change (improve) the characteristics of the new system using Hypex.
My personal opinion is that Hypex and new (expensive) speakers are redundant for this system, since a much better system can be assembled on their basis. (If you insert a modern Mercedes engine into a Zaporozhets(an old Soviet car of disgusting quality), it will not become a Mercedes.)
As a teaching tool, the option with the old system is wonderful; after experiments, return the analog crossover to its place, and put the system itself in the garage.
IMHO
Don't try to improve the old speaker. Instead try to replicate the old speaker using the Hypex DSP. Use measurements to confirm success. Learning to measure properly using gated measurements and stiching in nearfield is a very big undertaking in and of itself. Thus modifying one speaker, and using the other as a control will be enough for this first stage of your journey.
Once you are certain of your ability to measure accurately and design a filter to hit a specific target, then you can embark upon modifications and possibly improvements with the ultimate goal of creating your own designs in the future.
Once you are certain of your ability to measure accurately and design a filter to hit a specific target, then you can embark upon modifications and possibly improvements with the ultimate goal of creating your own designs in the future.
I do not see any downside to modifying the existing speakers. There is almost no cost involved, and @AlmaAtaKZ will learn a lot. Of course it will not result in a perfect speaker system, but it is a first attempt by a new DIY enthusiast. No first project is ever perfect.
This hobby is about the learning process, and this seems like a good way to learn something.
This hobby is about the learning process, and this seems like a good way to learn something.
Without maintaing a control / reference, it is easy to get confused, to chase false leads. Like in any new study, it is best to approach it incrementaly and only "move one lever at a time". A speaker is a complex system with many factors that interplay with each other. To "twist knobs" randomly will be a detriment to learning. I speak from experience, but maybe I'm on the shallower end of the pool and it will be different for others.
@HesdShake 👍
Question: to align the level between the the three drivers (due to sensitivity difference) do I do that using filters in each channel, or using the overall EQ?
I think it is filters per channel.
For crossover I plan to use LR 4th order. Not too sure why. Which in HFD means adding two identical 2nd order lowpass/high-pass. Right?
Question: to align the level between the the three drivers (due to sensitivity difference) do I do that using filters in each channel, or using the overall EQ?
I think it is filters per channel.
For crossover I plan to use LR 4th order. Not too sure why. Which in HFD means adding two identical 2nd order lowpass/high-pass. Right?
Question: to align the level between the the three drivers (due to sensitivity difference) do I do that using filters in each channel, or using the overall EQ?
You don't use filters, there is a gain for each driver. Just click on the driver (at the top) and the gain is on the left side. You will see the number for each on the summary at the top. It is probably 0db now.
For crossover I plan to use LR 4th order. Not too sure why. Which in HFD means adding two identical 2nd order lowpass/high-pass. Right?
Yes.
You don't use filters, there is a gain for each driver. Just click on the driver (at the top) and the gain is on the left side. You will see the number for each on the summary at the top. It is probably 0db now.
For crossover I plan to use LR 4th order. Not too sure why. Which in HFD means adding two identical 2nd order lowpass/high-pass. Right?
Yes.
The existing speaker is most probably a 2,5 way.
I guess you will change the enclosure from ported to sealed. the dayton epique drivers are optimized for passive radiator enclosure. Sealed might work (edit: 6 liters could be correct, will probably need eqzalization for good bass extension). Keep in mind the (huge!) volume reduction if you add 12 mm mdf to the interior.
Also it seems a waste of money to buy the expensive epique drivers just to install them in a very mediocre existing enclosure.
But of course I know the urge to buy nice drivers first ...
I would suggest you try to get the existing drivers to work with an active plate amp (leave it outside the speaker enclosure first) , optimise them and gain some loudspeaker design knowledge.
Last edited:
That is my plan - first add hypex only. The amp will be outside the unmodified box.
New drives are for later. The vol reduction from strengthening still leaves more than enough for what that calc tells me I will need. 6l is for two drives. The box will become saled with installing new drivers.
The current speakers are 2-way.
New drives are for later. The vol reduction from strengthening still leaves more than enough for what that calc tells me I will need. 6l is for two drives. The box will become saled with installing new drivers.
The current speakers are 2-way.
Fwiw,
My bookshelf/2way active speakers are partitioned internally on the tweeter and mid/base driver’s essentially separating the plate amp from the driver’s.
My bookshelf/2way active speakers are partitioned internally on the tweeter and mid/base driver’s essentially separating the plate amp from the driver’s.
Last edited:
Distortion is not usually a problem with reasonable choices. Cabinet does not create distortion. Active crossover does not reduce distortion.
Sir, with all due respect, I disagree with this one: there are resonances at very specific frequencies which can be felt with palm placed on the panels of flimsy boxes. Even unbraced bigger 18-19mm panes are resonating like crazy.
Pro tip if one want's to feel their cab vibrate: put multitone signal playing 😀 It's bit of a time since I last tried it, but if you put 12 tones per octave from 55Hz to 880Hz for example, to have all fundamental tones of western music (scale) playing at once the cab would vibrate as much as ever.
Last edited: