I like slotted tube inside or on top of k-coupler - who else is into building
this Karlson stuff? - that's an 18" lower mass Eminence with 0.25 Qts in the coupler
this Karlson stuff? - that's an 18" lower mass Eminence with 0.25 Qts in the coupler
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Hi Freddy, Trad Karlsons are too big for my place - I think the most valuable part of their design - the BR/K slot pipe is a good design for the low end of a hi-eff 3-way system. The K slot itself I think would be valuable in TL terminations....
i build a pair!!!
Oooeewwhhhhh......Karlsons 😀
This is my build of a couple of Karlsons!
It all started with a friend of mine who had 4 of this big mighty speakers in his room in our studentdorm
When he moved i borrowed one pair and then decided i wanted i wanted to build them myself
Each cabinet is equipedd with a 12inch Celestion driver and a cheap-*** piezo-no-name-crappy-tweeter. XO was build by the supplier of the used drivers and i am sorry that i cannot tell you on what freqs the units are crossed or what components are used. Trust me...it's lowbudget.
Most pics are scanned, pre-digicam-era.
SneakPreview
Celestion 12 inch Q12-1735-T4911
Cabinet next to the soon replaced Philips FBserie (good speakers though)
8 billion screws, every 2 inch or so
In hindsight i should have used bracing
Test-setup.........OMG.....what a volume
"Curtains" placed and ready to rock
Finishing was a zero-priority job, so i've had them like this a long time.
2 b continued
Oooeewwhhhhh......Karlsons 😀
This is my build of a couple of Karlsons!
It all started with a friend of mine who had 4 of this big mighty speakers in his room in our studentdorm
When he moved i borrowed one pair and then decided i wanted i wanted to build them myself
Each cabinet is equipedd with a 12inch Celestion driver and a cheap-*** piezo-no-name-crappy-tweeter. XO was build by the supplier of the used drivers and i am sorry that i cannot tell you on what freqs the units are crossed or what components are used. Trust me...it's lowbudget.
Most pics are scanned, pre-digicam-era.
SneakPreview
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Celestion 12 inch Q12-1735-T4911
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Cabinet next to the soon replaced Philips FBserie (good speakers though)
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
8 billion screws, every 2 inch or so
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
In hindsight i should have used bracing
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Test-setup.........OMG.....what a volume
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
"Curtains" placed and ready to rock
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Finishing was a zero-priority job, so i've had them like this a long time.
2 b continued
continued
Here goes: My Karlson's The Sequel
The original i borrowed were bright yellow, though i choose a bit more practical colourscheme. Black and purple.
Precoat
Predrilling
B/W!
B/P!
Offcourse i wanted that flighcase-look! But...like always....the project disappeard in the deepfreeeeeeeeeeze
Here goes: My Karlson's The Sequel
The original i borrowed were bright yellow, though i choose a bit more practical colourscheme. Black and purple.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Precoat
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Predrilling
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B/W!
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B/P!
Offcourse i wanted that flighcase-look! But...like always....the project disappeard in the deepfreeeeeeeeeeze
here we go again.....
Years later......i ordered some aluminium corners and a real digicam!
Side
"Under Construction"
12inch, very nice indeed
Almost there.......
Almost almost there.....
FINISHED....and rocking away with these babies!!!
Things still to do :lol: : Alu on the front and cornerpieces.
Years later......i ordered some aluminium corners and a real digicam!
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Side
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"Under Construction"
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12inch, very nice indeed
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Almost there.......
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Almost almost there.....
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FINISHED....and rocking away with these babies!!!
Things still to do :lol: : Alu on the front and cornerpieces.
soooo.....this is the job i have to still do
Current state 🙁
and some random pictures:
inspirator and friend Yør.
In the background his Karlsons, fitted with FANE drivers.
One pair with longthrow and the other with a shorter throw drivers
We were just building my highsleeper-bed and it always DIY better with some music.
His Karlons have since been upgraded...not only a nice oxbloodred finish but the Foster piezo tweeter has been replaced with a hifi-sounding round softdome tweeter in stead of the PA-like-screecher.
With the new XO fitted this sounds much better in comparison with mine.
Some detailed pictures
Hope you enjoyed this 😀
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Current state 🙁
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
and some random pictures:
inspirator and friend Yør.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
In the background his Karlsons, fitted with FANE drivers.
One pair with longthrow and the other with a shorter throw drivers
We were just building my highsleeper-bed and it always DIY better with some music.
His Karlons have since been upgraded...not only a nice oxbloodred finish but the Foster piezo tweeter has been replaced with a hifi-sounding round softdome tweeter in stead of the PA-like-screecher.
With the new XO fitted this sounds much better in comparison with mine.
Some detailed pictures
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Hope you enjoyed this 😀
Highly enjoyable ! lively color schemes too ! nice to see tweeters on wings -
Karlson couplers are the wonder of the world (and apparently not popular in US) - you might flatten the piezo with a resistor & small inductor - maybe 0.2mH across it, then a series capacitor.
I'd like some new couplers and not heard that model. I do have a 1955 and ~1958 Karlson 12. Couplers are tough to beat for punch - a slotted Karlson pipe can be used for tweeter.
does the cone motion stay pretty low on your and your friend's couplers?
an internet friend built this little (20"x15"x28") coupler for 15" driver a few years
ago and seemed to be pleased
Karlson couplers are the wonder of the world (and apparently not popular in US) - you might flatten the piezo with a resistor & small inductor - maybe 0.2mH across it, then a series capacitor.
I'd like some new couplers and not heard that model. I do have a 1955 and ~1958 Karlson 12. Couplers are tough to beat for punch - a slotted Karlson pipe can be used for tweeter.
does the cone motion stay pretty low on your and your friend's couplers?
an internet friend built this little (20"x15"x28") coupler for 15" driver a few years
ago and seemed to be pleased
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
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Thanks 😀
i'll think i'll keep them the way they are 'cause i'm planning to build a pair of Avalon Isis-clones😉
with cone-motion you mean the excursion of the driver?:
Celestion Q 12-1735 T 4911 Thiele/Small
Xmax..............................2.25 mm
Magnet weight................1.035 kg (35 oz)
Thermal Power...................100 Watt
Freq. respons..................65-4k Hz
Total Dyn. mass...................37 gram
Total Q, Qts....................0.504
Mechanical Q, Qms.............6.57
Electrical Q, Qes...............0.545
Sensitivity (dB 1W@1m).........97 dB
Resonance, fs......................62 Hz
Resistance, R........................8 Ohm
Equivalent Vol. Vas............70,7 liter
BL product.......................12.8
Compliance Cms................0.18 mm/N
Mechanical resistance..........2.2 kg/S
as you can see....Xmax is 2.25 mm, so that makes an maximum total of 4.5 mm movement, so cone-movement is somewhat minimal to say the least.
Those 15"cabinets are HUGE!!!
I wondered how much your woofer was moving when playing loud.
Those 15" enclosures are about 1 cubic foot more in bulk than a 12" Karlson.
Here's a !0" size Karlson with 8" coaxial next to a factory 12" Karlson
- do you see any little couplers built?
Those 15" enclosures are about 1 cubic foot more in bulk than a 12" Karlson.
Here's a !0" size Karlson with 8" coaxial next to a factory 12" Karlson
- do you see any little couplers built?
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Here's one I built a while ago:
3-way design actually; K-15 cabinet (modified), with EV Wolverine LS-15, EV T-25A on 8HD horn, a pair of Cerwin-Vega horn tweeters, and a somewhat involved crossover.
It was my first (and only - so far!) attempt at a Karlson-based design, and I did some obviously unconventional things with it, as compared to the original design. It allowed me to try out some ideas, and turned out sounding acceptable, considering the "junk-bin" parts I used for it, and looks nice too (at least in my biased opinion).
Wilf
3-way design actually; K-15 cabinet (modified), with EV Wolverine LS-15, EV T-25A on 8HD horn, a pair of Cerwin-Vega horn tweeters, and a somewhat involved crossover.
It was my first (and only - so far!) attempt at a Karlson-based design, and I did some obviously unconventional things with it, as compared to the original design. It allowed me to try out some ideas, and turned out sounding acceptable, considering the "junk-bin" parts I used for it, and looks nice too (at least in my biased opinion).
Wilf
Attachments
hi Wilf - your K15 picture outdoors is beautiful - I've run SP15B in K15 and am familiar with those CV tweeters - which are good - how does the 8HD sound inside the cabinet?
just that much like i posted......almost invisible movement while churning out buckets of dB's......i measured 109 dB(A) SPL in my appartment.
Whilst playing some hardcore with chunky bass, distance to SPLmeter was about 8 feet. I used a Bruel&Kjare model 2239 which we use @ work.
smallest i've come across used a 6x9 carhifi.....enclosure would have been 8x10x10 (wxhxd) or so......i was told the worked brillainty due to the fact that it had an incoorperatd tweeter to cover the high.
example:
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You can even find them in 3-way....low/mid/high in one 6x9 speaker.
Hai Wilf,
thanks for contributing, nice builds. Everyone else find them unconventional LOL, i just love them.
I'm familiar with Willem Noorloos from Job Ulfman's old Karlson forum and he was very happy with K15's performance as they're weren't straining to hit nearly 130dB peaks (assume 1M)
here's an 18" woofer coupler of mine - good impact with 250W on drums :^)
42" tall K-coupler - like most K blocking some of the first few inches of slot results in less "speed"
regarding the little Karlson-coupler for the 6"x9" car speaker would you have any links to a build or plans? - that's a great size
when I was young, people built tiny couplers :^)
Transistor Radio 1
Mini K 1.5 with shelf 1
Mini K 1.5 with shelf 2
here's an 18" woofer coupler of mine - good impact with 250W on drums :^)
42" tall K-coupler - like most K blocking some of the first few inches of slot results in less "speed"
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
regarding the little Karlson-coupler for the 6"x9" car speaker would you have any links to a build or plans? - that's a great size
when I was young, people built tiny couplers :^)
Transistor Radio 1
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Mini K 1.5 with shelf 1
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Mini K 1.5 with shelf 2
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These things keep getting bigger by the minute 😱
any lunatics around with 21".....the Karlson to end all Karlsons 😀
Those miniatures are gorgeous!!! first time i've come across these, muchos gracias for sharing
Unfortunately i dont have any plans for the 6x9-ers......truly sorry.
But i guess of you use standard round carwoofers then downscaling shouldn't be much of a problem.
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Using round speakers like the ones above should be better because of the shape of the driver and functioning of the Karlson-curtains. Maybe the 6x9 makes the airflow much more messy through the opening.
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I'd do a 21" but moving mass per unit area goes up as does cost with a strong motor🙂
here's a crude 5" I made that's 8"W x10.75"H x6.375"D with a MCM 5" "monitor" - I like fullrange in Karlson and have run K12 & K15 with fullrange
it could be fun to have some little couplers plus a subwoofer
here's a crude 5" I made that's 8"W x10.75"H x6.375"D with a MCM 5" "monitor" - I like fullrange in Karlson and have run K12 & K15 with fullrange
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it could be fun to have some little couplers plus a subwoofer
slotted pipe waveguides can be kool - here's a few
Karlson's original 1965 "X15" system used a 15" CTS woofer and if I'm correct - a slotted wooden "Rocket"
later on the slotted pipe appeared and this product was concurrent with his Open End Waveguide patent
subjectively the slotted pipe has wide dispersion and a very good sound.
After Karlson's death in 1973, the idea was licensed out to Walter Zintz and Transylvania Power Company
who created "The Tube".
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Karlson's original 1965 "X15" system used a 15" CTS woofer and if I'm correct - a slotted wooden "Rocket"
later on the slotted pipe appeared and this product was concurrent with his Open End Waveguide patent
subjectively the slotted pipe has wide dispersion and a very good sound.
After Karlson's death in 1973, the idea was licensed out to Walter Zintz and Transylvania Power Company
who created "The Tube".
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Re: midrange horn inside cabinet
Thanks for the kind complement. Since this, like a lot of my projects - was a gift, I tried to make a few nice pictures for my file. Here's another one, if I may, for scale:
(The astute observer will notice that I neglected the yardwork while playing with this project😱)
You're right - the CV tweeters sounded great with this system. I wired them in series along with a first-order high-pass filter at 3.5 kHz. Normally, I wouldn't have put that midrange horn inside the cabinet, with the driver sitting right in the port from the rear chamber. I did, however, set the horn mouth back about an inch from the foam lining on the inside of the wing panels, so it didn't completely seal off the slot. I really wanted to keep it a neat package for the intended application, and a separate enclosure for the horn seemed like too much trouble. My testing showed suprisingly little audible effects by putting the horn and driver there, and it does seem to project adequately through the slot. I needed to add a couple of notch filters to tame some peaks - one for the midrange at 1.3 to 1.6 kHz., and one for the woofer at 80 to 160 Hz. The system ended up sounding acceptably nice to my ears, and the recipient - a friend who has severe noise induced hearing loss - seemed pleased with it as well, saying he heard instruments and vocal clarity that were a "new experience" to him.
Freddi, I would also like to thank you for your enthusiastic promotion of the Karlson design - both here and on Audio Asylum's High Efficiency Speaker forum (that's got to be you there too, right?) You were largely repsonsible for inspiring me to try my hand at this build, and I had a lot of fun with it. One question that remains unanswered to me: How does the Karlson design compare in performance to other well-designed systems of the same size (say bass reflex) for a given (same) driver; in aspects of efficiency, output level, distortion, low frequency extension, etc.? Has anyone ever done a side-by-side comparison? My (unverified) opinion at this time is that Karlson is somewhere between a folded horn and bass reflex in complexity of construction and also in performance.
Regards,
Wilf
Hi, Freddi!
Thanks for the kind complement. Since this, like a lot of my projects - was a gift, I tried to make a few nice pictures for my file. Here's another one, if I may, for scale:
(The astute observer will notice that I neglected the yardwork while playing with this project😱)
You're right - the CV tweeters sounded great with this system. I wired them in series along with a first-order high-pass filter at 3.5 kHz. Normally, I wouldn't have put that midrange horn inside the cabinet, with the driver sitting right in the port from the rear chamber. I did, however, set the horn mouth back about an inch from the foam lining on the inside of the wing panels, so it didn't completely seal off the slot. I really wanted to keep it a neat package for the intended application, and a separate enclosure for the horn seemed like too much trouble. My testing showed suprisingly little audible effects by putting the horn and driver there, and it does seem to project adequately through the slot. I needed to add a couple of notch filters to tame some peaks - one for the midrange at 1.3 to 1.6 kHz., and one for the woofer at 80 to 160 Hz. The system ended up sounding acceptably nice to my ears, and the recipient - a friend who has severe noise induced hearing loss - seemed pleased with it as well, saying he heard instruments and vocal clarity that were a "new experience" to him.
Freddi, I would also like to thank you for your enthusiastic promotion of the Karlson design - both here and on Audio Asylum's High Efficiency Speaker forum (that's got to be you there too, right?) You were largely repsonsible for inspiring me to try my hand at this build, and I had a lot of fun with it. One question that remains unanswered to me: How does the Karlson design compare in performance to other well-designed systems of the same size (say bass reflex) for a given (same) driver; in aspects of efficiency, output level, distortion, low frequency extension, etc.? Has anyone ever done a side-by-side comparison? My (unverified) opinion at this time is that Karlson is somewhere between a folded horn and bass reflex in complexity of construction and also in performance.
Regards,
Wilf
I support Karlson because no one else does🙂 - plus they're fun and cool looking. The additional reverberant components can give them a live sound.
Karlson couplers can come out on top for distortion when compared to folded horn. Use of resistive slit vents can muck up sine performance.
For a given bulk a reflex could have lower extension but higher cone movement.
For direct comparison to bass reflex here's a two tone sine test:
50Hz tuned (about like K15's nominal tuning) reflex the size of K15's rear chamber vs K15, both loaded with the same Beta 15CX speaker - there's a 10dB reduction in modulation distortion for the Karlson
An 8 cubic foot coupler with Eminence 18" vs an 11 cubic foot Yorkville
folded horn which I purchased new. The Yorkville does have higher input impedance but a good deal more distortion.
At 50Hz 20vrms input the horn had 20dB more 2nd harmonic and 10dB more 3rd harmonic distortion than the simple Karlson-type coupler.
The first dip in the coupler might be mitigated with a K15 front shelf or adjusting the baffle angle.
K vs USC1 horn small signal 34Hz sine
K vs an USC1 pipehorn 20vrms/50Hz - green spectra is pipehorn
Karlson couplers can come out on top for distortion when compared to folded horn. Use of resistive slit vents can muck up sine performance.
For a given bulk a reflex could have lower extension but higher cone movement.
For direct comparison to bass reflex here's a two tone sine test:
50Hz tuned (about like K15's nominal tuning) reflex the size of K15's rear chamber vs K15, both loaded with the same Beta 15CX speaker - there's a 10dB reduction in modulation distortion for the Karlson
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An 8 cubic foot coupler with Eminence 18" vs an 11 cubic foot Yorkville
folded horn which I purchased new. The Yorkville does have higher input impedance but a good deal more distortion.
At 50Hz 20vrms input the horn had 20dB more 2nd harmonic and 10dB more 3rd harmonic distortion than the simple Karlson-type coupler.
The first dip in the coupler might be mitigated with a K15 front shelf or adjusting the baffle angle.
K vs USC1 horn small signal 34Hz sine
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K vs an USC1 pipehorn 20vrms/50Hz - green spectra is pipehorn
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
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How particular of placement are Karlsons? The pics show some beautiful examples of them!
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