I have a pair of Enabled Alpair 7Ps I'm trying to decide on how to use. I've thought a lot abut a FH3, but now I'm thinking I might like to go the "FAST" route. I was planning on maybe going with a Mark Audio Alpar 12PW, but then I thought about maybe using a Dayton RS-270P.
Dayton Audio RS270P-8A 10" Reference Paper Woofer 8 Ohm
Anyone care to share some thoughts about this combination? Maybe suggest a "crossover?"
Thanks,
Mike
Dayton Audio RS270P-8A 10" Reference Paper Woofer 8 Ohm
Anyone care to share some thoughts about this combination? Maybe suggest a "crossover?"
Thanks,
Mike
There is no way to suggest a XO other than to design one - as the A7P is very different in its response compared to the 10F/TC9/TG9 family, I am not sure how well it will take to using the same XO as the one in this thread, but you could simulate it on Xsim first. You will need to get the FRD file for the 7P by digitizing the response from the manufacturer's website, then use the FRD provided by Dayton (for all their drivers they give files which is really nice). Perhaps start with a basic XO similar to mine and adjust values until it looks good. If you guess, you will probably be off and the cost of trying different large film caps and copper inductors can add up quick.
Hi X,
I can run the A7P and get the FR for it. I was thinking of starting with the A7P portion of the crossover for the A7/A12PW and build from there.
Do you see anything that would prevent them from working well together? However, I'm wondering if going with the RS270 would provide the same SQ as the A12PW. Maybe the original idea of the A12PW would be the way to go. I'm just kicking around some ideas before I order either the A12PW or the RS270.
Thanks,
Mie
I'm in the planning of my take on your little setup, but with the TB 1363sbf as a woofer, and a Brio style top comprised of one Visaton B80 in a small sealed chamber, and one on top, open baffle.
I was hoping I could just run the two B80s as is, so, the bottom one sealed, and the top one with a 20uF cap on it.
I tried a couple of things in XSim, and came up with something with a 2mH coil only (plus an L-Pad on the B80s).
But, with the measured output of the B80s and the TB woofer, the XO comes along a wide plateau. Most XO I have seen hurry up the crossing of the drivers, but in this case, they follow each other for quite a while (yellow and red lines).
Would that be ok, or would I run into big problems if I tried that in real life?
I was hoping I could just run the two B80s as is, so, the bottom one sealed, and the top one with a 20uF cap on it.
I tried a couple of things in XSim, and came up with something with a 2mH coil only (plus an L-Pad on the B80s).
But, with the measured output of the B80s and the TB woofer, the XO comes along a wide plateau. Most XO I have seen hurry up the crossing of the drivers, but in this case, they follow each other for quite a while (yellow and red lines).
Would that be ok, or would I run into big problems if I tried that in real life?
Attachments
The 1st order XO slope is 6dB/octave so it will look like it’s following each other. Then tops look fine (B80 is intrinsically smooth and flat). But the woofer has a rise at 1kHz and that is causing some destructive interference in the overall output. It might make your presence range sound muddy too. Try adding about 22uF and 0.47R (in series) across the woofer terminal pins. That should bring that woofer rise down - play with cap value. Basically adding a notch filter to tame that peak. When the two drivers are smooth and cross over wide range like that it sounds very good actually because the sound is shared and the hand off is not perceptible.
I recently found a local shop that will cut birch ply panels cheaply and only bill me the wood I need (it comes out a bit more expensive than buying a full sheet but I don’t have space to keep the leftovers), so I’m getting curious about this. The front page is a bit confusing though, what is the current XO?
Thanks for the feedback. Good to know.
I tried adding the 22uf and 0.47R but it made that drop at 700Hz worse...
Changing the cap values do not improve it, worst if bigger, closer to the original if smaller (as expected).
I'll see what I can come up with.
Computer is turned off now, but shouldn't it be the same as moving the woofer -6in?
Thinking of building something similar now, but on steroids!
I've been playing with LA TL sim, and found the w8-1722 (NOT the 1772 full ranger).
W8-1722 - 8” Paper Woofer - TB SPEAKER CO., LTD.
The sim showed amazing potential, and after getting my sim reviewed and getting good feedback, I'd like to add a first order to a woofer/tweeter to bring it to life.
I'm wondering if I should go OB, a cone shaped enclosure or a horn on top of this...
I've been playing with LA TL sim, and found the w8-1722 (NOT the 1772 full ranger).
W8-1722 - 8” Paper Woofer - TB SPEAKER CO., LTD.
The sim showed amazing potential, and after getting my sim reviewed and getting good feedback, I'd like to add a first order to a woofer/tweeter to bring it to life.
I'm wondering if I should go OB, a cone shaped enclosure or a horn on top of this...
Attachments
That looks nice - impressive woofer. You might want to look into a PMC style tapered TL. I find that they are more efficient as the output port is huge in comparison and they have very tight bass when properly dampened. The way to tell is when the impedance sweep shows a single broad hill with two "owl's ears" peaks and this shows the optimum collapse of two peaks into one broad one. The sensitivity of the woofer in the prediction is -5dB in reality due to baffle step losses. so maybe 84dB - that means some padding is needed on the full range driver.
Finally had some time to do this project, inspired by X design with some mods.
Drivers are SS 10F-8424G00 and SBA SB23NRXS45.
FR cone is 0.6 liter which brings 10F-8424G00 Fb to around 185hz, I also went with a larger vented cabinet tuned to 35Hz.
No passive crossover yet, crossed by miniDSP at 700Hz, runs by my Alpha 20 for HF and FH9 for LF.
The first measurement is included in attachment, no EQs are used.
Overall I m very happy with this build, just listening to it for past 2 days, so it still need time to burn in, but very detailed separated sound, very smooth and soft vocals, great imaging
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Drivers are SS 10F-8424G00 and SBA SB23NRXS45.
FR cone is 0.6 liter which brings 10F-8424G00 Fb to around 185hz, I also went with a larger vented cabinet tuned to 35Hz.
No passive crossover yet, crossed by miniDSP at 700Hz, runs by my Alpha 20 for HF and FH9 for LF.
The first measurement is included in attachment, no EQs are used.
Overall I m very happy with this build, just listening to it for past 2 days, so it still need time to burn in, but very detailed separated sound, very smooth and soft vocals, great imaging
.Attachments
Wow, nice work Aatto! The speakers look great! I bought a set of the SB23's and never got around to installing them to measure and design a XO yet. This looks very promising though - relatively flat given no EQ was used. Nice. (please take FR sweep at about 1m and use freq dependent window (FDW) at 6 cycles and present on graph at 5dB vertical major scale from 50dB to 100dB range)
Looks like you have an all-XRK system going there with Alpha 20 and FH9
Running Class A on the midtweet is an excellent idea, along with Class AB on the woofer for good bass.
You might look into the Harsch XO if you are using miniDSP. It will give you some nice crisp attack on guitar, piano, and drums.
S. Harsch XO
Looks like you have an all-XRK system going there with Alpha 20 and FH9
Running Class A on the midtweet is an excellent idea, along with Class AB on the woofer for good bass.
You might look into the Harsch XO if you are using miniDSP. It will give you some nice crisp attack on guitar, piano, and drums.
S. Harsch XO
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Aatto, the speaker looks very nice. Great job.
I am puzzled by that FR though... no dB drop all the way down to 20Hz, when the box of about 40L is tuned to 35Hz and no EQ? And yes, it looks so flat because of the scale.
I do second the idea of using the Harsch XO with the miniDSP. It really gets snappy.
I am puzzled by that FR though... no dB drop all the way down to 20Hz, when the box of about 40L is tuned to 35Hz and no EQ? And yes, it looks so flat because of the scale.
I do second the idea of using the Harsch XO with the miniDSP. It really gets snappy.
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