Monitor Audio Silver 6 G5 crossover
Hi all,
I am just wondering if it make sense to upgrade the crossover of MA silver 6 G5 (to make the speakers level up), or did anyone here did some mod...or I should just leave it like it is... here is a pic of the crossover
Hi all,
I am just wondering if it make sense to upgrade the crossover of MA silver 6 G5 (to make the speakers level up), or did anyone here did some mod...or I should just leave it like it is... here is a pic of the crossover
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Welcome to the forum!
It looks like a good quality crossover to me. The capacitors are just fine. Changing inductors for air core types would upset the crossover function and you would have to make alterations elsewhere in the crossover to compensate.
However, I wonder what you mean by "to make the speakers level up".
It looks like a good quality crossover to me. The capacitors are just fine. Changing inductors for air core types would upset the crossover function and you would have to make alterations elsewhere in the crossover to compensate.
However, I wonder what you mean by "to make the speakers level up".
thanks...
no I was thinking if there is any cheap improvement to do on them... I found that the connectors are cheap and not good connected, so I was just wondering whats then with the crossover...but ok....here is how they look...
Monitor Audio Silver 6 - bad connectors - YouTube
no I was thinking if there is any cheap improvement to do on them... I found that the connectors are cheap and not good connected, so I was just wondering whats then with the crossover...but ok....here is how they look...
Monitor Audio Silver 6 - bad connectors - YouTube
This video is by no means a proof of something being wrong with the terminal because the fast-on connector can be moved around. Either repair the fast-on or take a new one or solder the connection.
To make any kind of useful upgrade, you would first need to understand tha matter, and frankly this crossover board looks perfectly alright, parts quality wise.
To make any kind of useful upgrade, you would first need to understand tha matter, and frankly this crossover board looks perfectly alright, parts quality wise.
hi, I did soldering on every connector and the sound is now more tight and more clean... but one thing is bothering me from the begining when I bought them...
I am running them with Yamaha AS1000 and as soon I am lowering the bass to 9`o clock I am getting more better 3d image and mids and highs sound more faster and right to me....so I decided to disconnect the bass driver on both and turn the bass level to normal on the amp...I am realy happy now how it sounds and there is still good bass coming from them... so the problem is with that bass driver that is mudding the soundstage and I dont know how to fix so thats why I want to change something but dont know what is wrong
I am running them with Yamaha AS1000 and as soon I am lowering the bass to 9`o clock I am getting more better 3d image and mids and highs sound more faster and right to me....so I decided to disconnect the bass driver on both and turn the bass level to normal on the amp...I am realy happy now how it sounds and there is still good bass coming from them... so the problem is with that bass driver that is mudding the soundstage and I dont know how to fix so thats why I want to change something but dont know what is wrong
Overly inflated bass response could be because of the drivers/enclosure loading, room placement, personal preference related, who knows? If you think decreasing bass tone controls improved your listening experience, then it did and you are fortunate.
I know that my small apartment (living room cca 20m2 with the kitchen) is making this issue even more present but soon I am gonna move to a bigger one and then I am gonna test it and see whats going on...
I have those same speakers. They're great 2.5 ways and image better than any speaker I've heard in their price category, and not by a small amount.
The woofer goes up to 700hz, midwoofer probably up to 2.26, tweeter down to 2.26. I say "probably" because the silver 1 which has the same woofer and tweeter in bookshelf form was measured in a review, and instead of its stated almost 3khz crossover point, 2.26 was used because of a 4.6khz woofer peak. It only makes sense the Silver 6 would be done the same way for this reason. The peak is inaudible to me. The tweeter is very detailed and extended and flat.
If you're having soundstaging problems, it is your amp or something before it. But since your bass control fixes it, I think it's your amp. If you want to buy one I know works synergistically with them try to find an Arcam A18 on ebay. It's only 50 watts, but you can get the woofers close to bottoming on most music before audible distortion. The Silver 6s are quite efficient, 90 or 91db/w. A good DAC that's reasonably matched sound quality wise is the Arcam rDac, which can be had for 250 - drive them with that and some heavy gauge speaker wire, and your mind will be blown.
The connectors aren't bad unless they're broken. Just repair them if needed
To expand a bit, these speakers are extremely revealing of flaws in amplification. I bought a Cambridge audio CXA60 to go with mine initially, and despite good reviews saying great Soundstage - wide, detailed - these speakers showed it wasn't the case at all. Maybe some low resolution speakers would be ok with it, but through the silver 6s the stage was narrow, the highs recessed. The only good thing was the bass, and it wasn't exceptional.
The woofer goes up to 700hz, midwoofer probably up to 2.26, tweeter down to 2.26. I say "probably" because the silver 1 which has the same woofer and tweeter in bookshelf form was measured in a review, and instead of its stated almost 3khz crossover point, 2.26 was used because of a 4.6khz woofer peak. It only makes sense the Silver 6 would be done the same way for this reason. The peak is inaudible to me. The tweeter is very detailed and extended and flat.
If you're having soundstaging problems, it is your amp or something before it. But since your bass control fixes it, I think it's your amp. If you want to buy one I know works synergistically with them try to find an Arcam A18 on ebay. It's only 50 watts, but you can get the woofers close to bottoming on most music before audible distortion. The Silver 6s are quite efficient, 90 or 91db/w. A good DAC that's reasonably matched sound quality wise is the Arcam rDac, which can be had for 250 - drive them with that and some heavy gauge speaker wire, and your mind will be blown.
The connectors aren't bad unless they're broken. Just repair them if needed
To expand a bit, these speakers are extremely revealing of flaws in amplification. I bought a Cambridge audio CXA60 to go with mine initially, and despite good reviews saying great Soundstage - wide, detailed - these speakers showed it wasn't the case at all. Maybe some low resolution speakers would be ok with it, but through the silver 6s the stage was narrow, the highs recessed. The only good thing was the bass, and it wasn't exceptional.
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Big speaker, small room, never good! 😀
And 2.5 ways have the full 6dB of bass bafflestep, which is on the heavy side unless well away from the wall.
It's not hard to redesign the crossover into a TMM with less bafflestep, but you might get a bit of combing since the basses are physically far apart.
I have done this sort of conversion in simulation. The 2.5 way bass filter sorts of averages out to a middle value where the bass slopes match.
You'd need to measure the crossover and figure out the layout. Lot of effort, but you can sim it easily enough to see how it then all works.
Software | Visaton
Use similar drivers like the AL170 and any old 90dB tweeter, maybe a SC10N:
AL 170 - 8 Ohm | Visaton
And 2.5 ways have the full 6dB of bass bafflestep, which is on the heavy side unless well away from the wall.
It's not hard to redesign the crossover into a TMM with less bafflestep, but you might get a bit of combing since the basses are physically far apart.
I have done this sort of conversion in simulation. The 2.5 way bass filter sorts of averages out to a middle value where the bass slopes match.
You'd need to measure the crossover and figure out the layout. Lot of effort, but you can sim it easily enough to see how it then all works.
Software | Visaton
Use similar drivers like the AL170 and any old 90dB tweeter, maybe a SC10N:
AL 170 - 8 Ohm | Visaton
Thanks for your reply's... before Yamaha as1000 I've had Rotel RA12 and I was using the DAC in the amp connected to LG C9 tv... I am streaming deezer and it sounded realy good but the DAC in LG C9 is even better and more forward with mids and highs, so I decided to sell Rotel and buy Yamaha cuz I was thinking it is the amp that is making the problem with the bass....after I got yamaha I didnt notice so much improvement over Rotel but the issue with the bass is the same... only Yamaha have a lot power then rotel...
I use them in a similar sized room, smaller usually, and never placed them more than 9 inches from the rear wall - too much bass or mid bass has never been a problem.
Sure, sim the crossover and see what it's doing, but ultimately I think you'll be needing a different amp.
Have you tried plugging the front port? It's for the woofer up to 700hz. It'll cut down on your 35-60hz bass by a few db.
Edit: you're moving soon. Might as well wait. Maybe you'll be good when you move, no work required
Sure, sim the crossover and see what it's doing, but ultimately I think you'll be needing a different amp.
Have you tried plugging the front port? It's for the woofer up to 700hz. It'll cut down on your 35-60hz bass by a few db.
Edit: you're moving soon. Might as well wait. Maybe you'll be good when you move, no work required
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Jup I'll wait with all... in july I will be in a bigger place..
Around 21m2 living room so I'll come back with the results
Around 21m2 living room so I'll come back with the results
Are these reflex speakers? Have you tried the old trick of stuffing the ports with socks or such. Changes it to a closed box bass, which often interacts with room gain better. 😎
The bigger room will help. As do thick carpets and drapes. To me amps are amps, but smaller ones seem less bass heavy to me.
The idea of crossover tweaks is to change the slopes on the bass and mid response. 2.5 ways look a bit like this, by Toels Gravesen:
Ignore the rough frequency response, I was mainly interested in how it works. Blue is the sub-bass, Green is the midbass, Red is the tweeter.
An MTM or TMM circuit gives you a bit more control IMO:
Bass bafflestep is then largely adjusted with the bass coil and bass capacitor. But best to model it, there will be knock-on effects elsewhere.
The bigger room will help. As do thick carpets and drapes. To me amps are amps, but smaller ones seem less bass heavy to me.
The idea of crossover tweaks is to change the slopes on the bass and mid response. 2.5 ways look a bit like this, by Toels Gravesen:
Ignore the rough frequency response, I was mainly interested in how it works. Blue is the sub-bass, Green is the midbass, Red is the tweeter.
An MTM or TMM circuit gives you a bit more control IMO:
Bass bafflestep is then largely adjusted with the bass coil and bass capacitor. But best to model it, there will be knock-on effects elsewhere.
Lots of comments above. Simple answer distilled to question "if it make sense to upgrade the crossover" is: no.
Op has mentioned "leveling speakers up" and by his nickname, it sure may very well be that his and my whereabouts are closely related if not the same, because I know something of such practice which started being offered to audiophiles some 25 years ago, or so.
There was this idea among people in the hifi business and second hand dealers that audiophiles being what they are, should be given a chance of upgrading their speakers and the decision was to offer 3 levels of upgrade. Those included exchanging internal speaker wires, caps and polarity of one of the drive units. In order for the audiophiles to believe in these sorts of mods, the local hifi periodical had reviewed some products that were modified in the described way, concluding changes to be perfectly alright and desirable. This kept going for some time but eventually stopped.
There was this idea among people in the hifi business and second hand dealers that audiophiles being what they are, should be given a chance of upgrading their speakers and the decision was to offer 3 levels of upgrade. Those included exchanging internal speaker wires, caps and polarity of one of the drive units. In order for the audiophiles to believe in these sorts of mods, the local hifi periodical had reviewed some products that were modified in the described way, concluding changes to be perfectly alright and desirable. This kept going for some time but eventually stopped.
Jup, I am from Croatia also 🙂 but I am living in Norway...
I will see what my new apartment will give, but as I am reading some reviews for MA rs8 it seems like the Silver line requires big rooms... I realy like MA speakers and dont think I need a better ones... but if they will sound the same I will need to search for something else that are not so sensitive
I am using also the sub svs sb2000pro in my system so I can adjust the bass to sound a bit better... but thats not my goal 🙂
I will see what my new apartment will give, but as I am reading some reviews for MA rs8 it seems like the Silver line requires big rooms... I realy like MA speakers and dont think I need a better ones... but if they will sound the same I will need to search for something else that are not so sensitive
I am using also the sub svs sb2000pro in my system so I can adjust the bass to sound a bit better... but thats not my goal 🙂
If you want to put air core inductors in for the woofers, you might get a small improvement in midrange clarity. I've never felt felt urge to upgrade mine because the mids are so clear already. If you do, just make sure their resistance is close enough to the original coils if you do, so the filter spec doesn't change. Any other mods would probably only result in small improvements with a lot of work, with the risk of worse performance requiring unending tweaking lol