Hello!
I wonder if you can give suggestions for reasonably good tube amplifiers for €400-€700.
Thanks.
I wonder if you can give suggestions for reasonably good tube amplifiers for €400-€700.
Thanks.
"reasonably good" can mean many things. Can you give an explanation what it means to you?
(as personally I can't imagine a €400 tube amplifier that is anything but a novelty item whereas it would be enough to build a quite good chip amp...)
(as personally I can't imagine a €400 tube amplifier that is anything but a novelty item whereas it would be enough to build a quite good chip amp...)
For new production, no such thing. With your budget it would make sense buying a well-reputed vintage amplifier and pay for servicing/restoration.
If you listen to rock, pop, jazz, my first recommendation would be Scott 299c. It uses 7189 output tubes. Russian equivalent is 6P14P, and good quality NOS Russian tubes are readily available for very reasonable price. This amp has big output transformers and makes powerful bass.
If you listen to classical or small ensemble, get Harman Kardon A300. Its 7408 output tubes also have Russian equivalent, 6P6S, also readily available. The A300 is very refined and musical, but won't make wall-shaking bass.
I have extensive experience restoring these amps and have a few of them.
If you listen to rock, pop, jazz, my first recommendation would be Scott 299c. It uses 7189 output tubes. Russian equivalent is 6P14P, and good quality NOS Russian tubes are readily available for very reasonable price. This amp has big output transformers and makes powerful bass.
If you listen to classical or small ensemble, get Harman Kardon A300. Its 7408 output tubes also have Russian equivalent, 6P6S, also readily available. The A300 is very refined and musical, but won't make wall-shaking bass.
I have extensive experience restoring these amps and have a few of them.
Dynaco ST-70, if you can find someone to restore it for you.
Vintage amps such as Dynaco, Scott, Harman Kardon were built for low distortion. They sounds just like solid state amps. If you are looking for “tube” sound, you have to look for something like “single ended triode” amplifiers.
Vintage amps such as Dynaco, Scott, Harman Kardon were built for low distortion. They sounds just like solid state amps. If you are looking for “tube” sound, you have to look for something like “single ended triode” amplifiers.
This guy is in Sweden - importing a US amplifier will eat up a lot of his budget. There should be something in Europe - there are a lot of tube guys in Poland for instance. There is always Chinese if you know how to rebuild them, or follow Stephe's YT videos. I don't know what skills the OP has or even what kind of power he needs.
After a lot of reading I just ordered the Audioromy FU29.
Seems to me the best value and they use a tube that is cheap and readily available NOS from Russia and China. Quite a powerful amp that can drive most speakers.
Many other cheap tube amps use cheap new tubes of soso quality. To make them sing you need to factor in more expensive tubes and some amps burn through tubes quite fast.
The FU29 is good, cheap and long lasting so cost of ownership is very low.
I haven't heard one yet but this model has been for sale a long time and has some great reviews.
Seems to me the best value and they use a tube that is cheap and readily available NOS from Russia and China. Quite a powerful amp that can drive most speakers.
Many other cheap tube amps use cheap new tubes of soso quality. To make them sing you need to factor in more expensive tubes and some amps burn through tubes quite fast.
The FU29 is good, cheap and long lasting so cost of ownership is very low.
I haven't heard one yet but this model has been for sale a long time and has some great reviews.
Chinese may be an option, but only for an advanced DIYer. Will likely need new power transformer, new electrolyte capacitors, definitely new output transformers and tubes. Simple replacements would be probably not enough, some circuit tweaking will be required.
There must be Euro amplifiers. Telefunken? Philips? I've heard of British Quads and Leaks, but am afraid they are over the budget.
There must be Euro amplifiers. Telefunken? Philips? I've heard of British Quads and Leaks, but am afraid they are over the budget.
Amps burn tubes fast because tubes are drek. FU50 is drek, but its Russian equivalent GU50 is as good as it gets.
A Puresound A10 can probably be had for that money if you shop around.
World Designs KEL84 would be another shout.
World Designs KEL84 would be another shout.
There should be in Hungary & German market Pointe PP amplifiers - These are good, neutral, from EL84 to 6L6-GC & EL34 designs, PP or PPP.
Built in last 20 years. Probably on sales from time to time second hand, the price wuold be over the 400 Eu mark but not too much & that depends on condition and age etc.
Built in last 20 years. Probably on sales from time to time second hand, the price wuold be over the 400 Eu mark but not too much & that depends on condition and age etc.
The question is a bit too open ended. What speakers do you have? What volume do you need? Single Ended or Push Pull?
What expertise do you have? Can you service a second hand amplifier from the 'golden years', or does it need to be modern?
If you want a combined pre/power amp and 17 w/channel is ok a used dynaco sca35 might be the one for you.
Power tubes ( EL84 quad matched) might need replacements, apart from that you have a good amp. Look
at blocket/tradera they do pass by from time to time.
Power tubes ( EL84 quad matched) might need replacements, apart from that you have a good amp. Look
at blocket/tradera they do pass by from time to time.
I would suggest Elekit, easy for a beginner and designed well. Pete Millet's engineer's amplifier is good too however requires more knowledge to build. Don't forget the cost of the chassis and Elekit provides that.
Honestly, I was not impressed with that amp. Rather thin-sounding, shrill, actually, and underpowered. Even in my bedroom system it was disappointing. I know this is a matter of opinion, but I've worked with and built tube amps for a long time. Try it for yourself, I imagine you can return it if you don't like it. If it sounds fine to you, then ignore me. ;-) But I would not recommend that amp as representative of good tube sound.
I have to say that you don't get very much for that price. The Chinese amps in that range are not very well made, contain a lot of problematic shortcuts, and have virtually no customer service or prospects of repair. I would suggest saving your money for something at least in the 1500-2000 range. To spend half that on an inferior product is a waste of your money.
Others have suggested second-hand vintage tube amps, but for a first time tube buyer these can be a terrible risk. Unless you are familiar with what sort of service they need or have had in the past, you could get what we call a "boat anchor" that requires a lot more money to restore properly.
The speakers really matter, which do you have? Used tube amps will often require repairs to function.
But a self-bias amp ( with cathode resistors instead of variable grid voltage ) would be the most beginner-friendly type.
But a self-bias amp ( with cathode resistors instead of variable grid voltage ) would be the most beginner-friendly type.
"Respectfully disagree. They don't sound like solid state, IMHO".
I've designed both solid state and hollow state amps. I've come very close with SS designs to hollow state performance; it's not as easy as hollow state to make SS sound really good, and there's no reason why SS needs to sound as bad as it all too frequently does. What I've found is that it's best to use that stacked SEPP topology with BJTs (it was originated for BJTs in the first place) but not MOSFETs, which you see all the time. Complimentary NPN/PNP pairs are a helluvalot more complimentary than N-Channel/P-Channel MOSFETs. With MOSFETs stick with one or the other, N-Channel or P-Channel, but not both, and use an OPT or the Circlotron design if you want to go the OTL route.
Stay away from IGBTs: these are a Darlington-like composite of a MOSFET and a BJT and combines the bad characteristics of both. IGBTs will never sound good. IGBTs were intended for switching applications not linear amplification. These days, MOSFETs that are good audio performers are becoming unobtanium. VFETs are extinct (beware of fakes and counterfeits) and only a few boutique manufacturers are still making lateral MOSFETs.
Sorry, but well-designed tube amplifiers do not always sound like solid-state ones. My Marantz Model 9s do not sound like solid-state amplifiers. Placing an RCA 6CG7 tube in them makes the amplifiers incredibly warm and liquid. GE tubes are very sterile but still sound good, while Sylvania tubes have a sweet sound.
Once the 6CA7 tubes have been on for about three hours, a hint of warmth is added to the sound.
Additionally, there is a wide variance between an average tube and the best. When you find the right one, your jaw will drop. There can be an order of magnitude difference in distortion, and each has its own charm in what it adds to the sound, while others outright fail to impress.
If you don’t hear the difference, perhaps it’s the speakers. With my Dynaudios, the differences are quite clear—to the point where some tube brands are simply unlistenable.
Once the 6CA7 tubes have been on for about three hours, a hint of warmth is added to the sound.
Additionally, there is a wide variance between an average tube and the best. When you find the right one, your jaw will drop. There can be an order of magnitude difference in distortion, and each has its own charm in what it adds to the sound, while others outright fail to impress.
If you don’t hear the difference, perhaps it’s the speakers. With my Dynaudios, the differences are quite clear—to the point where some tube brands are simply unlistenable.