I'm already a little tired of advertising DBA.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-low-q-subs-quasi-plain-wave-radiation.24396/
LOL: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...ossibly-affordable.392381/page-4#post-7182143
In general does DBA require EQ (as in MSO) or is it expected to work without EQ?
My personal experience with it is that EQ is needed.
Have you read the thread on ASR?))
If the forum rules do not prohibit, I can create a thread here in Multi-way. I don't read the "Subwoofers" section, and there is almost no one in the "Room Acoustics" section.
Last edited:
We can try... even set a redirect link if needed but the thread itself will likely be of interest to many.
I'd also mention @FoLLgoTT If you search here for DBA you can find links (they may require translation).
Yes, Nils helped me to dare it. Although I read "Optimierung der Tieftonwiedergabe in Tonstudios und Abhörräumen" a few years earlier.
Here https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/any-controlled-directivity-diys.280249/page-3 Nils and Earl discuss DBA))
Last edited:
i like the idea of front and back subs.
Most setups I've had where you have the subs in front with the speakers, you are sitting back in the more rectangle than square room, longest dimension front to back.
Standing at the subs, bass, 1/4 of the way to the back wall, bass, half way front to back, bass.
3/4 way back, no bass.
Based on that, if the subs are relatively low in harmonic distortion, and running 18db @ 80hz, the bass will line up better (timing) and put you not in the bass null.
Maybe crossover/phase gurus can help.
I remember (from djk) that an 80hz crossover 18db has a lot of delay below the crossover point, then less and less delay as you go down in frequency. That alone could make the bass seem like it is slogging along behind the music. Maybe 30mS delay.
I need to do a deep dive to see if I can find hime mentioning such a thing.
He did have a huge sub (like refrigerator sub) it one setup practically next to you, and no one knew.
Most setups I've had where you have the subs in front with the speakers, you are sitting back in the more rectangle than square room, longest dimension front to back.
Standing at the subs, bass, 1/4 of the way to the back wall, bass, half way front to back, bass.
3/4 way back, no bass.
Based on that, if the subs are relatively low in harmonic distortion, and running 18db @ 80hz, the bass will line up better (timing) and put you not in the bass null.
Maybe crossover/phase gurus can help.
I remember (from djk) that an 80hz crossover 18db has a lot of delay below the crossover point, then less and less delay as you go down in frequency. That alone could make the bass seem like it is slogging along behind the music. Maybe 30mS delay.
I need to do a deep dive to see if I can find hime mentioning such a thing.
He did have a huge sub (like refrigerator sub) it one setup practically next to you, and no one knew.
Hi William,
I hope you and your family are having a great time. Must make a nice change from where you were living.
I just finished a design for a small set of 3 way monitors to use when recording that will fit that description, the smallest speakers I've done in ages, as well as some large designs for myself and others.
Now I'm in the country, I'm on 'hippie'* time and finding it really hard to get stuff done especially as the beach is at the end of the street.
I look forward to seeing what speakers you come up with once you're in your new home.
* in reality, I'm about as hippie as Alex Keaton in Family Ties, but I need to blend in.
Ive never visited a world class mastering studio! ive heard many studio speakers in small studio space where the acoustic is not at all word class
if you know of a professional studio using multiple subs setting, let me know.
However, ive read a lot about studio mastering acoustics and how studio acoustician tackle room acoustics, ive also applied their techniques in my room. Putting 18" deep corner bass traps (floor to ceiling) in all four of my corners tightens the bass incredibly. i can only recommend for people to try it, its life altering in a sense.
What did you make the bass trap out of? I need to do this in my listening room.
Roxul safe and sound
Roxul comfortbatt
any similar product will work. if you go real deep for bass traps, you need to make sure to use the right density.
if you never treated your corners. Floor to ceiling, 20 inch thick on all 4 corners. you will have to take your jaw off the floor. the bass tightens id say about triple the amount.
the only thing to never forget, if you build your bass traps, flooor to ceiling, aka, very big. make sure to cover the front of the traps with a reflective material such a kraft paper
edit: if you also never absorbed your early reflections, i highly recommend you do so!
A well-known anecdote when ~2' absorber on the entire back wall had to be replaced, because instead of low-density wool, they installed the "conventional" one that was in local store.
http://www.acousticmodelling.com/
I have not been to world-class studios, but I have been to many excellent ones (in Ukraine), including those designed and supervised by Philip Newell. No, they didn't use multi subs. But the bass traps that were used there are far from what you describe, these are 40-50'' structures with a large number of membrane and resistive absorbers, covering three walls of the room. In amateur studios with corners tightly covered by absorbers, there was not even a similar effect of bass control. And no, I have not heard the best bass in my life there, although it is certainly very good.
I also talked a lot with the sound engineers. Neither wanted "the best bass they've ever heard" from their studio. Some felt that the bass problem was convincingly solved by using a 40 Hz HPF for all recordings. 🤦♂️ One very good sound engineer did most of the work on small full-range speakers and tested the mix in the car, with very good results. The studio had ATC monitors and great acoustic treatment, but he didn't need it. And one sound engineer recently visited me. The first thing he enthusiastically noted in the system was excellent bass, he was surprised how I achieved this in an ordinary room. He did not find the subwoofer at all until I showed him where it stands.
I support your point that it's better to have good acoustic treatment. But it is difficult and expensive. And good subwoofers may still be required if you want impeccable quality.
Something not brought up here is the idea of using passive radiators as bass traps. I remember an often brought up comment of why the system sounds so good in the shop among multiple pairs of speakers sitting dormant during a demo.
In the absence of integrated acoustic treatments, a sufficient Open Baffle / Dipole bass system is IMO BY FAR the best performance one can experience where music reproduction is concerned. For those with home theater performance considerations, adding a high powered sealed subwoofer with a Linkwitz Transform function rounds out the deepest octaves when desired.
if you DIY your panels, its dirt cheap.
even building 20 inch deep traps is
installing 20 inch deep corner traps is NOT a subtle improvement, its mighty obvious
on the bass traps?
if you dont, your room will be too dead, especially if you also have the early reflection absorbed aka a Free reflective zone
for the bass traps, any material that will reflect the highs and absorb the low would work. kraft paper is cheap, you could use perforated mdf.
Last edited: