I'm a bit frustrated. I'm trying to find a good sounding horn for my coax B&C DCX50 that will allow me to cross 500hz or lower 2nd order, but I can't find anything that will get even close to my standards in terms of low coloration. Yeah, sure you can EQ anything to death, but it still sounds like crap if what you're listening to excites any resonances. Please don't suggest DSP. This has to be an analog solution, mainly becuase i listen to alot of vinyl. I know it's likely not the drivers fault, becusse the driver actually sounds great without a horn and the impedance plot looks very clean. Not saying that's a tell all sort of analysis, but from my experiences it usually shows alot of bad character traits in a driver having lots of impedance peaks ie. resonances. Ive already tried the common garden variety horns which are usually very narrow dispersion pattern types in this 2" larger format lower cutoff range.
I sometimes like to listen LOUD and don't want to hear any of those nasty spots or internal reflections most horns have. That's what turns me off about most horn loaded designs. I've heard some good ones and many many more bad ones that make your toe nails curl up. If the designer got it right, its pure heaven, but most of the time it sounds awful, even when people think it isnt. I'd spend the money on something if I knew it was available without fear of shipping damage from oversees and it didn't look like a piece of ugly art deco. I'd be happy with a Juichi A290 clone of sorts, however they don't exist for purchase here in the US. All of the typical fiberglass and pro sound horns just don't cut it for me. I've tried alot of them too. This may sound stupid, but I'm trying to build something while I'm still capable. Once my garbage health takes me to the point of being a cripple, all I'll have left is listening to music if it doesn't take me down completely before that.
Any real suggestions?
I sometimes like to listen LOUD and don't want to hear any of those nasty spots or internal reflections most horns have. That's what turns me off about most horn loaded designs. I've heard some good ones and many many more bad ones that make your toe nails curl up. If the designer got it right, its pure heaven, but most of the time it sounds awful, even when people think it isnt. I'd spend the money on something if I knew it was available without fear of shipping damage from oversees and it didn't look like a piece of ugly art deco. I'd be happy with a Juichi A290 clone of sorts, however they don't exist for purchase here in the US. All of the typical fiberglass and pro sound horns just don't cut it for me. I've tried alot of them too. This may sound stupid, but I'm trying to build something while I'm still capable. Once my garbage health takes me to the point of being a cripple, all I'll have left is listening to music if it doesn't take me down completely before that.
Any real suggestions?
Hi, yes I have a suggestion. Search for Fast Lane Audio. He makes a kit to assemble a tractrix horn that is designed for the Klipsch and therefore I think it goes to 400, but don't quote me. The material is MDF and there is no resonance in it. My driver on this horn doesn't go that low and I went above the recommended 900 to about 1k or slightly above, so I can't talk about it's use any lower than that. I think it is a fabulous horn. And at 72 years old now, I fully understand "the last stereo" might be a reality. I am going to look up your driver, it sounds interesting.
Hi,
Look at here : https://josephcrowe.com/collections/front-horns : near you for shipping and you also can buy plan if you know a carpenter or have acess to some CNC services.
500 hz is a challenge though...
There are some others choices that works fine too but overseas. Ask KevinKr fellow here that hunted a Yuchi horn not so long time ago, US member that iirc found hapyness in Grece for his 290 Yuchi horns if I am correct !
Look at here : https://josephcrowe.com/collections/front-horns : near you for shipping and you also can buy plan if you know a carpenter or have acess to some CNC services.
500 hz is a challenge though...
There are some others choices that works fine too but overseas. Ask KevinKr fellow here that hunted a Yuchi horn not so long time ago, US member that iirc found hapyness in Grece for his 290 Yuchi horns if I am correct !
there's a horn on ebay, it's apparently a Klispch K510 clone.
I haven't heard it myself but there is some positive chatter about it on this site.
should get down to 500hz
https://www.ebay.com/itm/231420420855
I haven't heard it myself but there is some positive chatter about it on this site.
should get down to 500hz
https://www.ebay.com/itm/231420420855
Hi again,
I remembered the website name, Dave's Fast Lane Audio, but it is no longer up on the web, but you can contact him at:
fastlaneaudio@aol.com
Also, you can look at some details at:
http://www.alkeng.com/trachorn.html
These are really good sounding horns. Take a look. Also, I contacted Dave just now and he has two kits in stock...
I remembered the website name, Dave's Fast Lane Audio, but it is no longer up on the web, but you can contact him at:
fastlaneaudio@aol.com
Also, you can look at some details at:
http://www.alkeng.com/trachorn.html
These are really good sounding horns. Take a look. Also, I contacted Dave just now and he has two kits in stock...
I guess that you already tried this one since it was mentioned by you in the other horn thread: http://www.zxpc.us/product-p/231420420855.htm
Was that one too coloured or what was the problem with it ?
There is also a 2" horn by BMS (2236) but that is maybe too narrow for your purpose.
Regards
Charles
Was that one too coloured or what was the problem with it ?
There is also a 2" horn by BMS (2236) but that is maybe too narrow for your purpose.
Regards
Charles
Thanks for the replies. Yes, the ZXPC horn you mentioned has already been tried. Its not a bad horn for PA use, but it doesn't have the transparency I wanted, plus the HF dispersion is poor, likely due to its primary design.
Scott, thanks for that info. I'll give that a try.
I've also emailed Athos Audio for a quote on his Yuichi A290s and they look great. The question now is whether the phase vanes are beneficial to HF dispersion using the coax drivers I have due to the HF element only radiating in the center portion and not covering the full opening diameter - i would assume the vanes may block HF radiating from the outsides of the horn and therefore hurt HF dispersion (the very thing they are supposed to help with using a traditional single element driver). Not sure how to figure this one out.
Scott, thanks for that info. I'll give that a try.
I've also emailed Athos Audio for a quote on his Yuichi A290s and they look great. The question now is whether the phase vanes are beneficial to HF dispersion using the coax drivers I have due to the HF element only radiating in the center portion and not covering the full opening diameter - i would assume the vanes may block HF radiating from the outsides of the horn and therefore hurt HF dispersion (the very thing they are supposed to help with using a traditional single element driver). Not sure how to figure this one out.
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The vanes shouldn't get in the way if the wavefront has the right shape to begin with. What having the vanes there allows, is to create the correct expansion without the vertical having to reduce and then expand again. Having multiple vanes also distributes the diffraction of that expansion.
@diyiggy - I've looked at Crowes website and thought he mainly provides cad files, but based on his prices on other stuff, he may be too expensive and his designs look weird compared to the traditional A290. I'll contact him either way.
@tommus - I've tried those already and they have a bunch of weird resonances down low, probably from the shorter overall depth causing alot of ripple. They sound ok crossed higher, but there is a bad peak around 800 - 1k that i can't stomach and EQing it didn't fully fix it. Vertical dispersion is also poor.
@tommus - I've tried those already and they have a bunch of weird resonances down low, probably from the shorter overall depth causing alot of ripple. They sound ok crossed higher, but there is a bad peak around 800 - 1k that i can't stomach and EQing it didn't fully fix it. Vertical dispersion is also poor.
@AllenB - thats an interesting analogy and what I thought was the case but wasn't sure. I guess if there is sufficient space between the driver opening and vanes, they would still be effective after the wavefront transitions from the driver to the horn throat and not hinder the horizontal HF dispersion.
@AllenB - That makes sense. I'm quite sure the HF from the DCX50 isnt coherent across the entire diameter of driver not having the room or distance to turn into a laminar wave front (partially due to the extra diameter it needs to expand to), so it must be spherical for the most part. The potential shading by the vanes of the smaller spherical wave front was thought to be partially blocked from reaching the outer sections of the horn.
The HF element looks to only be 1/2" diameter. I can tell this by putting my finger over that small portion of the opening and almost completely dampening HF driver radiation.
The HF element looks to only be 1/2" diameter. I can tell this by putting my finger over that small portion of the opening and almost completely dampening HF driver radiation.
K402 perhaps (quite pricey though from a klipsch dealer). SEOS 30 . There is also the option of making a large conical horn, this spreadsheet can help: http://www.libinst.com/SynergyCalc/Synergy Calc V5.pdf
I already asked the question but haven't heard back yet. He makes them both with and without vanes.
@kipman725 - the seos30 was an option I wanted to explore but couldn't find one in stock anywhere. I know that Erin used to sell them on diysound for a while until he ran into supply chain issues.
The Danley SH50 WG looks interesting to. Not sure if that's in my realm of being able to build, almost certainly not available to purchase separately from them.
The Meyers Acheron WG also looks good. Again, not sure how to purchase one separately. Most companies don't sell parts like this to diy.
The K401 WG is an option and I've heard it with the new Celestion Axiperiodic driver. It sounds nice. Last I heard, Klipsch isn't selling this separately anymore and it commands a pretty penny if you can locate a pair.
The Meyers Acheron WG also looks good. Again, not sure how to purchase one separately. Most companies don't sell parts like this to diy.
The K401 WG is an option and I've heard it with the new Celestion Axiperiodic driver. It sounds nice. Last I heard, Klipsch isn't selling this separately anymore and it commands a pretty penny if you can locate a pair.
The interesting thing about this is that for a given size, this shape gives you directivity down to a lower frequency than other shapes.
I've also seen plans for a diy version of the K401. The only tricky part of building that WG is the last 1/3rd curvature from the first conical portion. Otherwise I looks quite simple with 45 degree chamfers and virtually no transition from round to square throat. I read that it actually hurts performance to use a smooth transition at the throat - weird.